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  1. #1
    "PM Boots For Custom Title" Selkielass's Avatar
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    Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    In my area, (Michigan) both Easterns and Butlers garters are common, and I'm beginning to wonder if my wild caught snake Abby mightn't be a cross or intergrade of some sort. While she lacks the distinctive striping of a Butlers garter, she does have an *extremely* narrow head that is scarcely wider than her neck, and she is a somewhat picky and worm-centric feeder, as Butlers are reputed to be.

    The narrowness of her head has become more and more apparent as she has grown, especially in contrast to the head of he cagemate, a checkered garter, so I've begun to wonder if she is an Eastern, as I've assumed.

    So, is a cross or intergrade of these varieties likely in a wild caught snake? I thought the mating and courting habits were pretty different, making wild crosses unlikely.
    What do you think?

  2. #2
    Forum Moderator Stefan-A's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    It's not impossible, but that doesn't mean that it is what has happened.

  3. #3
    T. radix Ranch guidofatherof5's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    In the few species I keep I haven't seen any difference in mating or courting habits.
    I can't say this is normal though.
    Steve
    5 awesome kids!
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  4. #4
    "PM Boots For Custom Title" Selkielass's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    I'm not planning on breeding her. I'm just curious about the possibility.
    Sources I've read are pretty unclear about how separate these species actually are in areas where both are common. I figured somebody here might know more.

  5. #5
    Domos Ophiusa gregmonsta's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    Even Easterns can be picky . You'll find that there's a lot of variation within a species. My red-sided female also has a 'narrower than others' head an doesn't seem quite as off-set as the norm.
    But with intergrades it can be very difficult to judge or prove in some cases.
    You won't find any great differences in mating behaviour. A common barrier can be things like mis-matched sexual organs (the hemipenes vary greatly in shape and size and so do the female 'receptacles' between species) and success rates can be much reduced in the process of producing viable offspring.
    Keeping - 'Florida blue' sirtalis, concinnus, infernalis, parietalis, radix, marcianus and ocellatus.

  6. #6
    Forum Moderator aSnakeLovinBabe's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    It is possible... But more than likely you just have a narrow headed\minded eastern. The easterns from the farm have narrow, petite Heads! And there are no butleri in sight!
    Mother of many snakes and a beautiful baby girl! I am also a polymer clay artist!


  7. #7
    Forum Moderator infernalis's Avatar
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    Re: Eastern/ Butler intergrade?

    I know it's just reinforcing what has already been said, But I have several W/C eastern garters from my own back yard, no two have the same markings or physique.

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