Brumation conditions: Dry, humid or wet?

[Stefan-A]

[guidofatherof5]

Good addition to the thread. Thanks Stefan.

[ConcinusMan]

I find the snakes I brumate spend a lot of time in the water dish.

Me too. But wet substrate? I think not. I'll pass on that.

Good addition to the thread. Thanks Stefan.

I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on that as far as care in captivity goes. Remember, a lot of things happen in the wild. Doesn't mean it's good for captivity. I've seen the shape garter snakes are in when they come out of a water logged hibernaculum. Terrible. Blisters, skin infections, RI's, etc. I know that if I kept them on wet substrate during hibernation, it wouldn't be but a few days before the substrate start smelling like mushrooms growing on a rotted log. That can't be good.

[Thamnophis]

As a substrate for brumating the snakes I use wood fiber (for many years).



I fill a box with it for about 50/60 %. I keep it under the tap and stir the wood fiber till everything is wet. On the bottom of the box I keep a layer of water of a 0,5 cm. On top of the wood fiber I lay an old towel (cut in the right size) which I make wet too.

This substrate never smells like mushrooms of any other mold. Keep it at 4 - 6 degrees Celsius (39-42 degrees Fahrenheit) in a refrigerator. Most snakes are kept in this box for 2 - 2,5 months. Last year I kept my eastern blackneck garter snakes in it for 4 months and no molding occurred.

Some of the snakes lay on top of the towel, others underneath the towel and others dig tunnels to brumate in.
As I said... no losses up to now. Even the yoy all survive and come out of it in good health.



I brumated my New Mexico garter snakes last year in a box with a water bowl in it. This was a recommendation from the breeder. The substrate also was quite wet.
The result was that they never went in the water bowl (I would have known when they did because there wood be some wood fiber pieces in the water). Look at the pics how the four snakes were found every time. On top of them was a piece of moist towel that I took of for making the pictures.
The breeder kept his substrate quite dry and the result was that the snakes always were in the water bowl.

[CrazyHedgehog]

This was a detailed explanation, thank you, how did you get the pictures to keep refreshing with new pics?

[-MARWOLAETH-]

Me too. But wet substrate? I think not. I'll pass on that.



I wouldn't draw any conclusions based on that as far as care in captivity goes. Remember, a lot of things happen in the wild. Doesn't mean it's good for captivity. I've seen the shape garter snakes are in when they come out of a water logged hibernaculum. Terrible. Blisters, skin infections, RI's, etc. I know that if I kept them on wet substrate during hibernation, it wouldn't be but a few days before the substrate start smelling like mushrooms growing on a rotted log. That can't be good.

Is a smelly substrate really worse than a desiccated snake?

[Selkielass]

This makes a lot of sense.
My Butlerii use wet hides on a regular basis when they are available.
preferred brumation sites are quite wet, with ground too soft to drive a vehicle on and, aside from themounds themselves, wet enough to support crayfish, frogs and other wetland natives and invasive species.
I've rattemted to roughly duplicate this habitat in a naturalistic terrarium, and they choose to spend most of their 'down'cage time burrowing in the dampest part of the substrate. At 'dawn' they begin prowling, climbing the dried reeds and driftwood and sunning themselves openly.
Now these are adults, but Cranky was as skittish and nasty tempered as possible when I you.d him this spring. He continued to be 'Cranky' in in a more traditional habitat.

After adjusting to the new natural habitat, his attitude has changed markedly for the better. He is visibly more relaxed and accepting of more human contact. Less stressed.


Im preparing Cranky and Trax for brumation. I was considering offering a damp hide before reading this, now Im definitely going to do so.
Butlerii are sensitive to low humidity. My house is extremely dry in winter.
This makes sense.

[Thamnophis]

This was a detailed explanation, thank you, how did you get the pictures to keep refreshing with new pics?

Herefore I use Jasc Animation Shop. But there are more programms that can make a .gif of a number of pictures.

[Selkielass]

I'm moving cautiously with the damper, naturalistic habitat but so far it is indeed a success.
I'll offer damp spaghum hides, dry areas, and a water dish so they can choose.
I will report any problems I note, but please realize this is my first serious attempt at brumation.

I'm not sure those wood shavings pictured are aspen. Other species don't mold so quickly.
I've found sphagnum to be mold resistant, so i'll give that a try.

[Thamnophis]

Concinnusman, if the air in your region is heavily infested with mold spores, I understand what you mean. This would mean that the substrate already may be infested before you start using it.
If dry substrate with an additional water bowl works for you, I see why you will not change this method. I wouldn't do that too.
If things work, don't change it... that is one of the lessons I learned in my life. Good is good and than you don't have to go for better.

I shall show you some pics that are made 40 days after starting the brumation. So you can see that that, in my region, it doesn't mold.