Quote from our friend "Bob"

[GarterGuy]

Was browsing Kingsnake.com and saw "Cool blue garters" was still there. Took a look at it and was amazed at what I read. This is an actual direct quote from the ad (I just cut and pasted it)..... "Everyone who has received these snakes has been delighted and agree that the snakes look much better than the pictures and their temperament is wonderful. I would be happy to supply references." I'd really like to know who "everyone" is and who's supplying him with shining references???? This part of "everyone" ended up with three dead snakes and I know others out there who's experiance has been less then delightful!
Roy

[Boots]

Hopefully anyone who is interested in Bob's snakes will do a little homework before buying from him.

I did a search in Google for "Cool blue garters" and garterking's post about "Bob" shows up. http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/497-buyer-beware-bob.html . Which should make people think twice about believing "Everyone who has received these snakes has been delighted..."

Jason

[Cazador]

That's really amazing! They say that behind every lie, there's an element of truth. I see an "element" of truth in that the snakes that manage to survive are great pets. The odds certainly weren't great last year, though.

Rick

[Ameivaboy]

well, suppose i should respond as i have seen 75 or so of these snakes this year and may very well see more, first off let me state in my personal opinion even though he says they are captive bred i highley doubt it im thinking he raids a good den or something, I mean who's selling that many captive bred adult snakes and selling gravid females like there's no tomarrow. so that's my assumption but you know what they say when you assume something ...............

So, quick update

I have only found one dead one out of the 40 or so we currently have left, there are a few with blisters and minor abrasions and some are having some pretty horrible sheds, aside from that though i'd say in my opinion the animals are no worse than any other wild caught snake (as i am categorizing these as WC as that is my opinion of them)


there for they should be treated like a wild caught import, and some fecals would prob save a number of these snakes, cant blame bob for parasites, garters eat animals that give them parasites nothing you can do except treat accordingly

as for my personal cool blue pugets
they are fine, my 2 gravid females (and yes they certainly are gravid as we sold some to a well known reptile specialty store and agreed they were gravid as well) are eating like pigs and no signs of any illness has yet revealed itself, my male had a slight run in with my terrorist cat but was unharmed through the ordeal but managed to stink up the house with the lovely aroma of musk, anyways he has shown no signs of illness either


so yea my 2 cents for what it's worth (maybe just that 2 cents)

[Snaky]

Well, let me add my 2 cents. For the record, I've never bought from Bob and so I cannot judge the health of his animals.

From what I've heard of several people, it appears that he plunders a den to make profit from it. That point alone would never make me buy a single snake from him. Why?
-Somebody doing something like that, I don't see him treating all those snakes he got from the den like he should do ( food, temperature, hiding places, humidity, ... ). Providing them with everything they need and making sure they are and stay healthy. Still this remains speculation, but it would greatly surprise me if he did.
-Telling everybody that it's all captive bred, while the snakes can carry lots of parasites or diseases. It's asking for problems with the snakes and will make that quite some snakes will die.
-I've nothing against taking a few snakes from the wild. But so many snakes that it appears that you plunder a den... I just can't imagine that it's healthy for the wild population, certainly if a lot of females where still pregnant when he sold them. Which makes me wonder if it's not illegal? If it is, you might ask an authority to investigate it on reasons of suspicion.

[garterking]

well, suppose i should respond as i have seen 75 or so of these snakes this year and may very well see more, first off let me state in my personal opinion even though he says they are captive bred i highley doubt it im thinking he raids a good den or something, I mean who's selling that many captive bred adult snakes and selling gravid females like there's no tomarrow. so that's my assumption but you know what they say when you assume something ...............

So, quick update

I have only found one dead one out of the 40 or so we currently have left, there are a few with blisters and minor abrasions and some are having some pretty horrible sheds, aside from that though i'd say in my opinion the animals are no worse than any other wild caught snake (as i am categorizing these as WC as that is my opinion of them)


there for they should be treated like a wild caught import, and some fecals would prob save a number of these snakes, cant blame bob for parasites, garters eat animals that give them parasites nothing you can do except treat accordingly

as for my personal cool blue pugets
they are fine, my 2 gravid females (and yes they certainly are gravid as we sold some to a well known reptile specialty store and agreed they were gravid as well) are eating like pigs and no signs of any illness has yet revealed itself, my male had a slight run in with my terrorist cat but was unharmed through the ordeal but managed to stink up the house with the lovely aroma of musk, anyways he has shown no signs of illness either


so yea my 2 cents for what it's worth (maybe just that 2 cents)

I guess I should comment here as it was myself and a couple others here who led the assault on "bob" Let me start out with this...........I hope you are the first of many sucess stories we can read on here. I would love to read on here where everyone who buys from "bob" gets healthy snakes and his attitude has changed, but there have been so many horror stories that it will take more than one to convince me.

I think what also annoys so many on here is that most presume these are wc, but he says they are cb. If he would just admit they are and say "wild caught and not checked for parasites or bacteria" then people would respect that a lot more. But lots of people are under the impression these are healthy and if they were, $50 plus shipping would be a deal as they really are pretty snakes. But when you spend $50+ and a couple hundred more on a vet and meds only to have it die, it's a real disaster. Some people don't have the time, money, or knowledge on how to care for a sick snake, or to even recognize a sickness.

"bob" has also stopped answering my emails, and has not contacted a couple others that have had problems with his snakes in the past. Like I said earlier........I hope this is only the first of many sucess stories BUT..........you did say 1 died, some have blisters, and some are having problems shedding. These can all be signs of an unhealthy snake. I also catch (and sometimes keep) wild garters, but I've come across very few with blisters/tumors. Shedding problems are a bad sign.

Not bashing on you this and I hope I'm not offending anyone but, as I stated. It will take many more good stories for me to ever have trust in him.

Mike

[adamanteus]

To take one or two specimens from the wild, for your own collection, if the species is not threatened, I think does no harm. But if a person was to raid a den or hibernaculum and take large numbers, the impact on the local population (and associated fauna) could be devastating. If someone were to do this I think it would be very selfish and short-sighted. I really hope this is not the case.

[mikm]

Rape and pillage that is ...