Collecting Gravid Females.

[Snake lover 3-25]

hmmmmm.... we have thousands of new toads..... and tons of minnows along with a creek.... but i have never seen a large or even a smell group of snakes coming out of a den....... i'lll post pics of my area tomorrow if it's nice and maybe you can help me determine where to release???

[Garter_Gertie]

Somewhere in the park Dave knows of a den where the garters come out wriggling. It's a very closely guarded secret. He was going to show me this year and we were going to watch, but time and memories got away from us both. Hopefully we'll make it in time next year. At the very least it's good to know I'm very close to one when I work and we have one!

CRIPES! Winnie was headed in that general direction last late summer! I bet that's where she was headed!

[anji1971]

I know where the snakes in my 'searching grounds' congregate immediately after brumation, but I've yet to get out early enough to be able to pinpoint where their dens are. The snakes themselves seem to keep it a closely guarded secret!
I can only hope my soon-to-be-released little squigglys can figure it out when it's time.

[Zephyr]

I know where the snakes in my 'searching grounds' congregate immediately after brumation, but I've yet to get out early enough to be able to pinpoint where their dens are. The snakes themselves seem to keep it a closely guarded secret!
I can only hope my soon-to-be-released little squigglys can figure it out when it's time.

I recall pheromones playing somewhat of a major role in the process. :P

[Loren]

so what would happen if i let the wc mother go and raised the babies till the end of summer???? in your opinion would this give them a better survival rate???

I have a thought on this- but you might not like it Shanley

I think that if raising animals for release, handling should be seldom to none, as making them unafraid of one potential predator may make them less warry of others, and they might be more likely to be eaten. In other words, soon-to-be wild animals should be raised as wild as possible.
Just something to chew on
A few meals should sure help them out though- in my opinion.

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah.... lol that's why i have sooty!!! lol jk.... but as soon as she has her babies then i can handle them instead!!!! bc hers will not be released

[Garter_Gertie]

I recall pheromones playing somewhat of a major role in the process. :P

I may want to see the snakes in the spring, but I'll be danged if I'm gonna stick my patoot in the air with my nose to the ground, crawling around sniffing for pheromones...

It just ain't gonna happen.

[Spiritwolf]

Many times, I have gone to the woods looking for snakes, turned over countless big logs, etc, and found absolutely nothing.

The two I did find last year, were both found by accident when I was out walking in my back yard and the adjacent field, and picked them up before mowers could run over them. Funny that I found two by accident yet all the many times I've searched to try to find snakes on purpose ended with me going home empty handed (except for a few plants I wanted to identify and a couple of fluorescent golf balls I found in the field!)

JC, my first of the two above-mentioned rescues, was gravid when I got her although it was awhile before I realized it. The day I got her, I started researching garters online and figured out she was female. It wasn't til later, when she began getting more girth in spite of the fact she didn't eat anything at all from the time I first got her, until the day after she delivered 20 babies!

Four of the babies were stillborn, I lost a few more (no idea why, except I found them dead in their water and their water dish was shallow and had a rock in the middle so they could easily get in and out of the water!), and when the rest had grown some, I released them back to the wild because they were just ordinary dark with light green striping like their mother is, except one that was stillborn and was a golden-green color (I wished that one had lived coz it was pretty and different).

I figured by releasing JC's kids back to the wild after giving them a good start in life, I paid nature back for my keeping JC. After all, if I hadn't picked her up that day, she probably would have been hit by the lawnmower. (The same day, JC only a short time after I picked her up, paid me back for her rescue bigtime, as recounted in my story "Meeting Jesus" that I posted a few months ago)

[Steven@HumboldtHerps]

Perhaps more importantly, garters are an important food source for a lot of species, including frogs, fish, birds and other snakes.

Well, I guess I'll join the party and say "Leave the gravid WC's to nature." I understand extreme situations (lawnmowers, rescues), but the bottom line is we have no true understanding over whether or not releasing babies from gravid WC mothers will do good or harm. The cycles of nature, of individual species are far more complex than most of us can imagine. If we give the babies a head start and release them into the wild, there is ALWAYS the concern of pathogens, seclusive diets, and (very importantly) the current impact of any introduction of newcomers to an existing population. Timing in nature is often "everything". Here in NW California, raptors, shore birds, predatory mammals, larger fish, snakes and frogs all make meals of baby garters at "strategic" times of the year. Is anyone here well-versed in the seasonal cycles of the predator/prey complex in their local area? Wildlife conservation and management are a challenging beast! Don't think you are making things better with random assumptions!

All I can advise is: Leave the gravids alone! If you go for WC's, start with babies and choose patience before obsession when it comes to all breeding projects! Also, try to stick with CB's if you can... and try to avoid commercial monsters like Petco! They are the epitome of apathy, when it comes to herp knowledge and maintenance.

Steve

[Loren]

If you go for WC's, start with babies and choose patience before obsession when it comes to all breeding projects! Also, try to stick with CB's if you can... and try to avoid commercial monsters like Petco! They are the epitome of apathy, when it comes to herp knowledge and maintenance.

Steve

I agree, while I do collect, I always prefer to collect young, and take captive bred any chance I can, although I have taken some adults. Unfortunately, since my area of interest is in natives, I cant buy cb, and dont get too many oportunities to have them given to me.
I am thrilled that I didnt have to remove a ca. mountain king from the wild but was able to "adopt" one that needed a home(even though the original owner had most likely collected it). My great basin gopher, among others, was born in captivity as well, and it is by far the most gentle gopher snake I have.
I also agree with the Petco statement. I'm sure there are some individual employees here and there that are well educated/experienced, but as a whole, I am far less than impressed with the chain's reputation for reptile care.