Thamnophis + Natrix = OK?

[PINJOHN]

I think the environmental conditions aspect is a consideration when housing any snakes together. That many garter species have such a large range makes it easy to put different species together, but I'd still shy away from putting garters together where their natural envionmental conditions varied greatly. What is significant is that the Canadian garters still operate in similar temps to Mexican garters, the difference being the months that they are active. That garters tend to be very adaptable helps keep them together. Similar story with natrix, for example I've read about a population of natrix tessalata living in Poland, when they are normally found further south so there's a adaptability in natrix as well. Whether all species of natrix and thamnophis could be safely kept together... I don't know, we'd have to consider each combination and decide.

Pathogen crossover between thamnophis and natrix is an unknown until someone produces the research that says that a virus/bacteria/other pathogen commonly and harmlessly carried in one genera has ill effects on the other. There's two ways to approach an unknown risk, either assume it is a high risk until proven safe, or assume it is not a risk until it proves otherwise. As with many things we make a risk assessment and decide how to react based on our perception of the risk.

OK then Chris based on my personal experience of keeping these snakes together, i deem it to be risk free there you go i have said it and it is of course just my opinion ....and i don't seem to have aquatically explained that when mixing the two then i am referring to snakes of comparable latitudes not to one from each extreme, i honestly thought that was a given but people keep coming back to the extreme position.

[chris-uk]

Valid opinion John.

[PINJOHN]

Valid opinion John.

that's no bloody help at all, you are supposed to argue

[johnc79@hotmail.com]

that's no bloody help at all, you are supposed to argue

Lol I take it your only after an argument! I'll leave it there then. Everyone has there point of view and fair play but your way is definitley not mine.

[PINJOHN]

Lol I take it your only after an argument! I'll leave it there then. Everyone has there point of view and fair play but your way is definitley not mine.

To be serious john i have no inclination towards keeping the two species together i have been there and done that with no negative effects i am just arguing against the point that this cant or shouldn't be done.
going back over many years i have made mistakes for which the poor snakes have payed the price, one of those being that i wanted to give my garters the most naturalistic setup i could devise, my logic was garters being a damp, marshy, water, loving creature then they should be given a setup consisting mainly of water, whereby they ended up predictably with the blister disease now when i say predictably that would be now not then, as there was nowhere that i was aware of to get this knowledge if fact i am sure that there was some old books that recommended this course of action and it's possible i have one in my collection somewhere, but of any negative results brought about by me with the snakes, keeping these two together wasn't one of them.

[ConcinusMan]

Valid opinion John.

Every opinion is valid. Doesn't mean it's fact or even based on fact, that's why it's called an opinion.

So here's mine...

It probably wouldn't hurt a thing to keep them together short term during their active season. Personally, I would keep them separate. Natrix family in one enclosure, north american garters in another. I would tend to give my garters a longer warm season. Sounds like grass snakes are adapted to a short warm season and a generally cooler climate.