Feeder Fish without Thiaminase?

[d_virginiana]

If you do try the f/t silversides, make sure to try ones that the heads haven't broken off of. This sounds bizarre, but I have two snakes that absolutely will not touch a feeder (mouse or fish) if they can't find the head. It's like it just blows their little minds or something and they don't recognize it as food.

EDIT: Safe fish list is about halfway down the caresheet

http://www.thamnophis.com/index.php?page=caresheet

[AntTheDestroyer]

Vitamin B12 is cobalamin. Thiamin is vitamin B1. You can buy a B1 tablets and extract online or most health food stores. As previously stated it is water soluble so would be nearly impossible to overdose as long as you provide adequate water.

[d_virginiana]

Sorry, typo. I've been reading about B12 supplements for vegans and got a bit muddled.
Are these products produced for reptiles or humans? I know some iguana keepers use human B1 supplements sometimes but garters are notoriously sensitive to preservatives and other things that are harmless to people and larger animals. It'd be easier to just try a thiaminase-free fish (have you tried one of those yet, other than guppies?) or work on scenting mice. He's probably not going to drop dead overnight from eating rosy reds, it'd be easier to work on getting him on a safer food source than to worry about supplementing with human B1 products. I have literally never heard of anyone doing that for garters (or any snake actually).

[guidofatherof5]

Take the one he will eat. Crush it with a little water then smear it all over the food you want him to take. Give that a try.

[AntTheDestroyer]

I think he is still a little too small for a silverside. They are for humans but I would assume you could find a organic source. I really would like to be able to have a live fish colony for him. Are guppies the only choice I have? Thanks for the advice Guido, don't worry I am allowed to say it. I was wondering how I should go about converting him to pinkies.

[d_virginiana]

There's really not much else between guppies and rosies size-wise. You could always try feeding him parts of silverside; many fish eaters will easily take appropriately sized strips of fish. If he won't, keep working on scenting the things you want him to eat.
Some snakes can eat rosies or goldfish for years before they develop symptoms of B1 deficiency. You've got time to switch him over without worrying about supplementing B1 IMO.

I realize my earlier posts may have made thiaminase sound more menacing than it really is (though we have occasionally seen symptoms of B1 deficiency over a short period). Very reputable breeders often use things like rosies or other 'unsafe' fish to get babies started eating with no problem. I just wanted to make the point that it shouldn't be a lifelong food source and that the potential for negative outcomes was there.

[AntTheDestroyer]

If there was one thing I took from your posts it is that it is something I should be concerned about in the long term, thank you.

[AntTheDestroyer]

Just wanted to give an update on my snake, Draco. First I wanted to thank everyone for all the input you fine folks gave. Especially Guido for the great idea of how to get him to take pinkies. He took his first pinky today on the first attempt with fish guts. Just one less thing to worry about.

[d_virginiana]

Just wanted to give an update on my snake, Draco. First I wanted to thank everyone for all the input you fine folks gave. Especially Guido for the great idea of how to get him to take pinkies. He took his first pinky today on the first attempt with fish guts. Just one less thing to worry about.

[LeoVi]

Steer clear of catfish and carp for this reason.

but (here was an source) we have next stuff: there is a Catfish that have a thiaminase (Catfish (channel) (Ictalurus laccustris punctatus) ) and don't have a thiaminase (Sea catfish (galeichthys felis) )