Possible WC hypo

[zooplan]

The only thing I can think of for the whole visual het thing is that the gene that the snake is het for is also tied to a dominant gene that would alter its appearance and hence indicate the presence of the recessive one.
I've had almost no genetics training/education so go ahead and rip that apart if I'm wrong lol.

I took me an hour to read sschinds post and than I had to remember how to get on the English Wikipedia pages...
Mendelian inheritance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
this should open alot of eyes
the rest is only drawing bigger charts
and playing with numbers

"a visual het" comes from an intermediary allel

[sschind]

I took me an hour to read sschinds post and than I had to remember how to get on the English Wikipedia pages...
Mendelian inheritance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
this should open alot of eyes
the rest is only drawing bigger charts
and playing with numbers

"a visual het" comes from an intermediary allel

That's not bad Udo, it took me longer than that to write it. I know I tend to get a little wordy and I can see where that might be a problem for those of you for whom English is not your primary language. I can be bad enough for those of us who speak it and heck, I am the one writing it and even I confuse myself.

Thanks for the link

[snakeman]

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssssnakeluvr
me??? showing off???? just adding 2 cents.... that's a Nebraska albino....she came from Nebraska...has more straw coloring than the other plains albino genes..... if I was gonna show off, I would have added my "christmas" albino plains....an Iowa albino with orange....



Using the terms as Udo has defined them, and I agree with, then using the term albino to describe this animal would be incorrect and I think that was the basis for James' whole discussion. That animal is not an albino it is an amelanistic. Just because someone bred it and stuck a name on it doesn't mean its the correct name. Also, a bit of confusion arises when we consider terms like Albino, snow and blizzard. The terms Albinism, thus albino, are scientific terms based on specific criteria. The terms snow and blizzard are descriptive terms that while on the surface may seem to be based on scientific criteria just like albino (snow = no black or red, blizzard = no black red or yellow, which are by the way great ways to describe them) they have no scientific basis. They are simply descriptors like "flame" and any number of other terms. The confusion comes in when scientific thought processes of people like James comes in contact with the marketing thought processes of people who want to breed and sell more pretty snakes.

Just think back to when the first amelanistic corn was produced. They guy probably looked at it and thought "what does this remind me of. It has no black, albinos have no black so it must be an albino" Thus the albino corn was born. Later on when this gene was combined with the gene for no yellow (anerythrism) the result was a snake that looked even more albino than the first they guy must have thought " oh crap, this looks even more like an albino than the first but an even more albino corn sounds stupid so what can I think of that is really really white? I know, I'll call it a snow corn." Ok, I think you can see where this is going. Fast forward a few years and we add in the gene for no red and the result is an even whiter snake. Now the guy must be going nuts. He has to be thinking "double crap, how much more white can this thing get. What in the world is whiter than snow? the only thing I can think of is a lot of snow and what is a lot of snow? I know, a blizzard."

With the way genetics are being tested in today's morph crazy world of reptiles I think it is entirely possible, even probable that people are using old terms in new ways that they were either never intended to be used or, more likely, never envisioned to be needed to be used. Maybe we need to come up with new scientific terms to describe what is happening. Maybe the old terms simple don't cut it. They were fine for what they did but in this day and age they are simply not accurate. The problem with that, in my opinion, is that more people are intent on creating new genetic morphs than trying to really describe what is genetically happening, not that they may not know what is happening they are just not out to prove it scientifically. They are happy to keep using old terms to describe new effects and thus confusion abounds. Even with the really really smart people. A prime example of this is a term I see in the ball python hobby a lot. They use the term "visible het" Now to me, a visible het can not exist because by its definition, at least the definition I learned in my genetics classes, an animal that is heterozygous shows no visible markings that it is heterozygous. They claim that a Pastel ball is a visible het because if you breed two of them together you get a "super" form or a super pastel. They say that a pastel is really a het for super pastel and since you can tell a pastel visually then it must be a visual het. I understand what they are saying and it makes sense to me but I contend that they should come up with a new word rather than het. Granted the old definition may be incomplete based on what we now know but adding to the definition of a already accepted term can only lead to confusion.

Sorry this was so long, hopefully I have succeeded in confusing you even more so we can continue interesting discussions such as this.
Everwhere I look albino is a animal missing black pigment.The term actually started in africa with people that were born with white blotches wrer called albino.Go argue this on the ball python forum they will set you straight. albino christmas plains

[sschind]

Quote:

Everwhere I look albino is a animal missing black pigment.The term actually started in africa with people that were born with white blotches wrer called albino.Go argue this on the ball python forum they will set you straight. albino christmas plains

Yes, albinos do lack black pigment. They also lack red and yellow pigment. I guess if you look hard enough you can find a definition that suits your purpose. That works both ways so I suppose it depends on what definition of albino you are using. It would be a waste of my time to go to the BP forum because they would be using the same definition that you are and it's a definition I do not agree with so what is the point.

Is it really such a big deal if your snake isn't really an albino. It doesn't change what it is, just what it is called.

[snakeman]

No where did I see a definition that says albino lack black, red, and yellow pigment.They have different terms for animals that lack red and yellow pigment.amelanistic=albino lets stop spreading false information.

[snakeman]

Actually I found my info in the oxford journal.It was a research paper on black rat snake genetics.Is that a credible source?

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

my albino hondurans have bands of orange all they loose is their black

No where did I see a definition that says albino lack black, red, and yellow pigment.They have different terms for animals that lack red and yellow pigment.amelanistic=albino lets stop spreading false information.

[snakeman]

[sschind]

I found several sources (just google albino definition) that say it is a condition derived from the lack of pigment. I take that to mean all pigment. Some do say lack of melanin but just as many if not more simply say the lack of pigment. I guess we will have to agree to disagree and leave it at that. You can keep calling your snakes albinos and I will keep calling them amelanistic and in our own minds we will both be right.

Cute penguins by the way. You the one falling in?

[snakeman]

Wow!good one.