Ribbon on the Ranch

[ProXimuS]

Way to go girl

[ConcinusMan]

That's also my main way to tell Eastern Garters from Eastern Ribbons..

That's weird. To me they are so different that I recognize a ribbon from a garter at first glance. I don't see how people could even confuse the two.

[Stefan-A]

recognize a ribbon from a garter

Ribbons are garters.

[ConcinusMan]

Yeah, yeah. And dogs are wolves. Ribbons are garters, but "they're different" garters.

[Stefan-A]

Yeah, yeah. And dogs are wolves. Ribbons are garters, but "they're different" garters.

1. Which looks more like Thamnophis sirtalis?
A. Thamnophis sauritus
B. Thamnophis rufipunctatus

2. Which one is more closely related to Thamnophis sirtalis?
A. Thamnophis proximus
B. Thamnophis radix

They are full-fledged garters. There is absolutely nothing about them, that warrants separating them from the rest. Not their appearance and especially not the only thing that really matters; Taxonomy.

[ConcinusMan]

OK. Let me rephrase.

Just by visual appearance, I can tell the difference between what is called a ribbon snake and what is called a garter snake. And I'm not talking about some Joe blow down the street that calls all thamnophis "ribbon snakes".

"There is absolutely nothing about them, that warrants separating them from the rest"

Only so far as there's absolutely nothing about a person of African descent that warrants calling them "black", or a person of European descent, "white" instead of just calling both of them "human".

My point is, what is called a "ribbon" snake has nothing to do with taxonomy OR actual genetic distinction. It's based totally on appearance. That appearance is distinct from all other members of the genus.

Thamnophis sauritus a.k.a. Eastern RIBBON snake. Take note of how the head looks, and the whip like, long tapering body. Screw the genetics, screw the taxonomy. Just look at it.


Thamnophis proximus. a.k.a. Western RIBBON snake. Same features mentioned above.


Thamnophis radix (GARTER snake)


You don't see anything that the "ribbon" snakes have in common? Things that make them appear different that "garter" snakes?

Of course I totally agree with you. But there's a reason why some are called "garter" and others "ribbon". It's based entirely on appearance. After all, take a look at the title of this thread. It doesn't say "sauritus on the ranch", it doesn't say "proximus" on the ranch, and it doesn't say "garter" on the ranch. That's because it's a friggin' ribbon snake, just like the title says.

It's not a wolf, it's a dog.

[Stefan-A]

OK. Let me rephrase.

Just by visual appearance, I can tell the difference between what is called a ribbon snake and what is called a garter snake.

No, you can't. What you can do, is narrow it down to two possible species of garter snake based on their appearance. It's comparable to, for example, narrowing it down to a choice between T. radix and T. sirtalis annectens, or a choice between T. scalaris and T. scaliger. That's all you're doing. Forget about the term "ribbon snakes" and you'll probably get that.

Only so far as there's absolutely nothing about a person of African descent that warrants calling them "black", or a person of European descent, "white" instead of just calling both of them "human".

Here, watch these:

My point is, what is called a "ribbon" snake has nothing to do with taxonomy OR actual genetic distinction. It's based totally on appearance. That appearance is distinct from all other members of the genus.

There is no typical appearance for the other members of the genus. There is nothing for them to be distinct from. And if it's not based on anything meaningful, don't perpetuate it.

[ConcinusMan]

It's a common name. It doesn't have to be meaningful. Some are called garters, others ribbons. They're only called ribbon snakes because of their long, thin, ribbon-like appearance which is distinctly different than the rest of the genus and that's it. Nothing magical, nothing meaningful.

I will watch the videos tomorrow but I have a feeling they're not going to reveal anything I don't already know. The whole reason I brought it up is that, as the first video says, it's arbitrary. I know ribbons are garters, but there's still a reason why they are called ribbon snakes and it has nothing to do with taxonomy, genetics, or anything else meaningful. They're called ribbon snakes because they look like a ****ing ribbon. Simple as that. Jeez.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue greeted me at the screen this morning. When I first offered a night crawler she wasn't interested but after watching her buddies eating them she gave in. It is so nice not to have to scent the worms for her. While I was assisting one of the other snakes with its meal I felt something touching my arm. It was Shy resting her head on my arm. Of course, when I looked at her she bolted away.
I have to remember not to make eye contact with her.
She is a very special snake. I hope someday to find a CB male to breed with her. Having little Shyblue scrubs would be great.

[Selkielass]

I'm still keeping my eye open when im out at shows n stuff.
Funny how now that im looking, all the blues are pugets.