Albino Garter snake FOUND IN NW OREGON!

[Steven@HumboldtHerps]

i dont know man, but when when people break laws to get a new morph into the hobby, makes us all look bad and know one whats to be part of it... Look at all the -press we have had this year. I think your wrong about them not caring...its not a $5 WC garter....its one that is worth alot in the long run and their looking for things like this...come on...it was on CL!!!! you dont think they saw this and are most likey reading this post.... Things like this get into the hobby from the "blackmarket" style sales...not the open market.

I am happy to say, that here in California, despite some of our strict wildlife laws, native albino herps are free for the taking with a standard fishing license. There is no restriction because albinism is usually a detriment to surviving in the wild, as in: "Look at me! My camouflage is great for hot, white sand beaches or (Ha!) snow..." If other state's laws differ (and they do,) it just goes to show how screwed up perceptions of the herp world really are. It would be nice to have some objective uniformity. Yes, hardly policed... Ask your typical fish n' game guy, and he don't know squat about garters! I work at a national park; even their herp data is outdated or incorrect.

[ConcinusMan]

And I can tell you that in Oregon, even native herps, if albino, or other unusual morph, (different from the usual natives) they can be freely kept, traded, imported, and exported to and from Oregon without restriction, paperwork, or license as long as they are not a "species of concern" or on any threatened or endangered list.

I can also safely say that very few Washington wildlife enforcement officer is going to know the difference between a native garter and a non-native or one morph from another because they simply don't give a darn. Unless it's very apparent that you're catching tons of local snakes and selling them, It's not likely that you'll get their attention. They really aren't concerned with local folks keeping a few garters as pets. Seriously. They have better things to do with their limited resources. I've dealt with them before. They let me keep my garters but took my 2 rubber boas. Their main job and concern is fish and game animals and even then, facing budget cuts and laying off officers, they can't even keep up with that.

[ConcinusMan]

I've been emailing back and forth with this guy and when I suggested he join the forum and learn and hopefully keep that snake alive, he showed no interest at all and said "well i gess its gunna die then if no one will put up 200 sorry man" In a previous email, he said "well this guy offered me $600 so I guess I'll go talk to him"

What a hemipene. Can you believe that? He doesn't even care that the snake is in less than good health and doesn't care if it lives or dies. Why is it that it seems like it's always people like this that find these things.

[Stefan-A]

What a hemipene. Can you believe that? He doesn't even care that the snake is in less than good health and doesn't care if it lives or dies. Why is it that it seems like it's always people like this that find these things.

I can believe that. 95% of all people are hemipenes.

[Stefan-A]

I can believe that. 95% of all people are hemipenes.

No, scratch that. It's 99%.

[kibakiba]

I agree, many people are a hemipenes... That kid is stupid for saying that. People like that make me sick. Hell if I found that snake I'd give it to a member here who's responsible enough to take care of it free of charge just to make sure it has a good home. Ugh.

[ConcinusMan]

Yeah, I've tried and tried with this guy. I tried appealing to his sense of decency and invited him to join and all that out of concern so that the snake could at least be well cared for, even if he keeps it and he doesn't seem concerned about that at all. He so far hasn't shown any signs of compassion or caring for the snake. Not even a little bit. All he did was get hostile and start talking a bunch of junk about how I am trying to BS him out of the snake for less money. The highest offer was $100 and I think that's more than fair but all he's concerned about is more money.

[Stefan-A]

Sounds like he doesn't understand game theory, either. He can accept a price that's been offered and earn $100, he can keep the snake and earn $0, or he can gamble. Either way, only one of his options is a guaranteed win.

[ConcinusMan]

That's funny you say that. Apparently I understand "game theory" even though I never heard of it before now. I did just tell him that he could gain $100 and the snake would be well cared for or he could insist on keeping it and probably have it die on him. I also said in that scenario nobody wins. He loses, snake loses. Apparently he'd rather do that because he has some paranoid delusion that I'm trying to con him.

He's had it for quite some time without heat or lighting and from the looks of it, not really feeding it enough and he's not even interested in learning about caring for it properly. He really doesn't know how to take care of it. That's why I say it probably won't make it if he insists on keeping it.

I told him if that happens he gets nothing AND the snake dies. Lose-lose.

All he did was blab off some reference to someone else willing to pay $600. I don't believe a word of it.

[Stefan-A]

If somebody offered $600, why the hell didn't he take it? It's 6 times the second highest bid. If it's a bluff, it's a bad one. Nobody who only offered 100 is going to match that bid. They might go up to 200, maybe 300, but not 600.

Anyway, that snake will probably kick it soon enough and it'll be one more hideous albino I won't have to look at.