Cross breeding, need help.

[KITKAT]

well all dogs are same family....people breed this wierd dog thats a wolf hybird (stupid once they mature you gatta lay down on them for a long time so they submit to ur domanince)

I know this is off topic, but I can't ignore the mis-information you have just written above. Dogs are Canis lupis familiaris. Wolves are Canis lupis. Therefore, dog x wolf breedings are not true hybrids and the species of both dog and wolf are the same. The dog is a subspecies. For this reason, responsible people who work with animals that are part wolf and part dog, call them wolfdogs, and do not call them wolf hybrids.

Also, I don't know where you got your info about "lay(ing) down on them for a long time so they submit to your dominance". I think what you may be describing is an "alpha roll", which is a training technique that used to be done with dogs of any breed. The alpha roll involved rolling the dog over on its back and holding its throat with your hand for a SHORT time. Here is information about this training technique and why it is NOT PROPER to use it!

The Alpha Roll - LoveToKnow Dogs#

[Stefan-A]

I know this is off topic, but I can't ignore the mis-information you have just written above. Dogs are Canis lupis familiaris. Wolves are Canis lupis. Therefore, dog x wolf breedings are not true hybrids and the species of both dog and wolf are the same. The dog is a subspecies. For this reason, responsible people who work with animals that are part wolf and part dog, call them wolfdogs, and do not call them wolf hybrids.

All Canis lupus subspecies are grey wolves, dogs included. In the dog's case, I consider its classification as a subspecies highly questionable and I personally wouldn't rank it higher than a form (Forma).

Subspecies of Canis lupus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[drache]

and if its in a controlled enviorment with best possable care and a responsable owner i dtill dont see whats all that wrong...

the very most responsible owner can have something happen that's beyond their control - like have a freak accident or die of a heart attack
the only true controlled environment would be one that is highly secure as a facility, where meticulous records are being kept, and more than one person knows exactly what's going on, or at least how to glean it from the records
I can't imagine that that applies to you, or most of us on the forum (not me, for sure)
so let's just do our best to protect the natural state of these animals and keep the god playing to the realm of inanimate objects

[mustang]

ok thanks for info...

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

my only question issss...

who does want to play god?!

[Stefan-A]

who does want to play god?!

I don't know, there are days when it doesn't seem like such a bad idea.

[ConcinusMan]

I'm glad I stumbled upon this post. I was going to ask a similar question but not about crossing different thamnophis species. That's nuts.

If all the various subspecies of Thamnophis sirtalis are indeed the same species, then there really shouldn't be an issue with breeding (even if it has to be done artificially) say, a s.f. garter with a concinnus or ca red-sided? Afterall, there are pictures on the web of snakes that appear to be the result of two different subspecies producing offspring together.

[Stefan-A]

If all the various subspecies of Thamnophis sirtalis are indeed the same species, then there really shouldn't be an issue with breeding (even if it has to be done artificially) say, a s.f. garter with a concinnus or ca red-sided?

Not really, the same problems with keeping track of those hybrids would still exist even if physical problems, such as reduced viability, would be less likely to occur.

I don't try to speak for everybody, but it probably matters to most of us what we have. You don't really see any of us here intentionally breeding animals to each other simply based on species. Most, if not all, seem to want to make sure that their snakes only mate with individuals of the same subspecies. Personally, I wouldn't even consider buying a garter, if I didn't know its subspecies with a some amount of certainty. I've made that mistake in the past and I'm glad those snakes never reproduced. As far as I'm concerned (and I want to stress that this is only an opinion), hybrids, whether they're between species or within a species, are only good as feeders.

[gregmonsta]

a s.f. garter with a concinnus or ca red-sided?

Why .... why, why, why? You'll either get a litter that looks like either parent or just an undistinguishable mishmash ... garters are colourful and beautiful as they are. You won't find me intentionally buying any hybrid or subspecies cross.

[mustang]

my only question issss...

who does want to play god?!

beceaus...welll who wouldnt and i thought it would be interesting since all garter & ribons (excluding the indoniesan ones) are all the same family/genus of thamnophis just different individual species. and i loved the way that red spotted and flordia blues look but if i had offspring of the two they would look amazing even if they had only a little of each parent!