Feeder Fish

[SourceAll]

Wondering if there is a completely safe feeder fish that is completely safe and easy to breed.

They seem to love fish so there has to be a safe type for them to eat.

Would love to be able to breed a safe type of fish in a small aquarium.

[infernalis]

Feeder guppies are a popular choice.

[Albert Clark]

THIS ^ ^^^^^^ Also Platys are a safe breedable fish.

[guidofatherof5]

Throwing the word completely makes it easy. No. Safer, would have been a better word. Guppies, Mollies and Gambusia(mosquito fish) are about as safe as you will find.
Fish I wouldn't feed unless it was life or death for the snake would be rosy reds, minnows or goldfish.

[SourceAll]

Feeder guppies are a popular choice.

Thanks and do you feed these to your snakes as a staple?

[SourceAll]

THIS ^ ^^^^^^ Also Platys are a safe breedable fish.

Thanks for the response… Do you feed these as a staple and or an occasional snack?

[SourceAll]

Throwing the word completely makes it easy. No. Safer, would have been a better word. Guppies, Mollies and Gambusia(mosquito fish) are about as safe as you will find.
Fish I wouldn't feed unless it was life or death for the snake would be rosy reds, minnows or goldfish.

Thanks and this is the type of cautious answer I would give

Are you saying they are potentially not safe because they may contain some thiaminase or are you saying they are potentially not safe for other reasons like parasites?

Also, I might as well just say what I would like to do and hopefully you guys could tell me if its possible or more importantly not in the snakes best interest. I have had a few garters when I was kid and caught countless specimens that I later released but I currently don’t have any, just in the research stage.

I would like to build a paludarium / vivarium that is bioactive in the water and out. It would be fully planted and have isopods and springtails as janitors.

I would like to find a fish (I’m leaning towards mollies or platys) that I could stock the water feature with that would serve as the snakes main and staple diet. I would have a separate aquarium where I would breed these fish to keep the paludarium stocked. I would supplement this main staple with other items occasionally but as a day to day food item the fish would be it.

I’ve seen this done before in a crude way and was just fascinated by it but I know now as this was when I was a kid that the people didn’t know what they were doing and the fish they were using were gold fish.

Would the snakes (planning on 2 garters not sure which yet, maybe even a water snake or liophis) thrive in a set up like this?

[Albert Clark]

Thanks for the response… Do you feed these as a staple and or an occasional snack?

YW. Actually, no. I feed f/t pink rats as a staple to my garters with the switch t o hairless hoppers in the appropriate size. I do intersperse with f/t frog legs and f/t silverides. I will scent cut nightcrawlers and pink mice with fish for picky hatchlings or even picky youngsters. That scenting usually works. On another note, even though you are considering live fish as a staple the safety of thiaminase free doesn't mean you are parasite free. Probably parasite diminished.

[SourceAll]

Awesome, thanks for posting that as I'm definitely interested in what experienced keepers are feeding their snakes.

You just reminded me of something I keep forgetting to bring up... You said some fish are parasite diminished not parasite free. So, when I got back into keeping herps about 5 years ago I purchased a Woma python from a top breeder and he told me to only feed frozen rodents as live can have parasites. I haven't heard anyone mention parasites in mice in the garter world. Do you know this to be true or have you heard this?

Also, I have to say, that I hate that pinkies are considered a perfect staple and that you don't need to feed them anything else (according to the 2 care sheets I read on this site) One of the reasons I started looking into garters is to avoid mice

Any other advice for a new keeper or snake recommendations?

YW. Actually, no. I feed f/t pink rats as a staple to my garters with the switch t o hairless hoppers in the appropriate size. I do intersperse with f/t frog legs and f/t silverides. I will scent cut nightcrawlers and pink mice with fish for picky hatchlings or even picky youngsters. That scenting usually works. On another note, even though you are considering live fish as a staple the safety of thiaminase free doesn't mean you are parasite free. Probably parasite diminished.

[Albert Clark]

Awesome, thanks for posting that as I'm definitely interested in what experienced keepers are feeding their snakes.

You just reminded me of something I keep forgetting to bring up... You said some fish are parasite diminished not parasite free. So, when I got back into keeping herps about 5 years ago I purchased a Woma python from a top breeder and he told me to only feed frozen rodents as live can have parasites. I haven't heard anyone mention parasites in mice in the garter world. Do you know this to be true or have you heard this?

Also, I have to say, that I hate that pinkies are considered a perfect staple and that you don't need to feed them anything else (according to the 2 care sheets I read on this site) One of the reasons I started looking into garters is to avoid mice

Any other advice for a new keeper or snake recommendations?

They are considered parasite diminished bc you are raising them to thrive in pristine conditions by having no overcrowding, proper filtration, and proper acid base balances. Parasites certainly can be in rodents. That is why we as keepers feed frozen thawed. There is always that chance that at any given time by continuing to feed live, there is more of a risk for a reptile to have a outbreak of high parasitic loads. This is true but can be reduced by feeding frozen thawed, keeping your husbandry numbers dialed in correctly, and very importantly to pay attention to cleanliness of the terrarium. That is crucial for garters who have high metabolisms and have high outputs of waste products. Keeping water bowls clean and disinfected on a regular basis will all help to keep parasitic loads to a minimum. Pink mice and rats are not completely a perfect staple bc they are mostly (90%) moisture. Lacking calcium mainly but they do have whole organs however small. Pink rats being a larger animal has a greater proportion but still mostly moisture. You can also steer clear of rodents if that is your choice but the garters will need complete nutrition from a varied safe diet which may include reptile vitamin/ mineral supplementation.