An Attack

[Finalflash50]

For the past year, I've had 2 snakes, Lightning and Plissken. The whole year, things went peaceful. They got along great. Lightning wasn't used to sharing food ever, so I put him in a separate container for feeding time. Tonight, once I put him back in, he moved around for a little bit, then attack Plissken in the tail. He wouldn't let go for 10 seconds. It was very stressful to watch. I stood there wondering what I should do, and then about a minute later, he did it again. I tapped him on the side to make him let go, then grabbed Plissken and lifted him into Lightning's feeding container, where he is now.

I don't know why Lightning had an urge to do something like this. This is definitely a first. There have been 5 snakes in the tank at one point, and he never did anything like this. Does anyone know why he would do this? The feeding wasn't very big. I only gave them 3 minnows each as that was all I had. Lightning shed about 3 weeks ago, so he can see just fine. Plissken appears to be okay, just shaken up. I have water in there, so there's no limit on his time in there.

[chris-uk]

He was still hungry and still in feeding mode.

Is there a big size difference between them? Not that that makes a big difference, i started separating my infernalis after the smallest of my "infernal three" grabbed her larger sister by the head for the second time, similar to your experience except she didn't have hold of her sister by the tail and there was a bit of a bleeding. There was a lot of thrashing around and the little one let go when I picked them up. Now the infernalis are fed in different containers (and one stays in the viv) at the same time and I leave them in the containers for 15-20 minutes after they've eaten before they go back together. I don't let them stuff themselves, so they often stay active after going back into the viv but no incidents since I started separating.

I've also got a pair of rescued marcianus, which are hyperaggressive when they are in feeding mode. They will will chase each other and strike out at me when feeding. I still feed them together but usually manage to keep them on opposite ends of the viv, they are still very nervous of handling and I have to admit that I'm a little nervous of handling them after one of them chewed on my finger for five minutes a few month back... So far they haven't attacked each other, just stolen food from each other.

I think it's just a feeding accident, and I'd put them back together now it's been several hours. Keep an eye on them for a while after putting them back together, but they should be switched off from their feeding response now. Just leave Lightning longer after eating next time and keep a watch on them after feeding.

[ConcinusMan]

He was still hungry and still in feeding mode.
.

That and the bitten one smelled like food. It's that simple. A firm but gentile tap or press down on the top of the head several times will cause them to let go usually. Never try to pull them apart while teeth still have a grip. Might need to start bathing/washing them down after eating and place in seperate clean containers until they calm down for a while, before putting them together again.

[guidofatherof5]

I think Chris is spot-on with his advice.
Here is a link to the forum care sheet, there is a section on why not to feed minnows and a section on safe food.
What species of garter are you keeping?

Garter Snake Forum - Garter Caresheet

[Finalflash50]

One is a Butlers Garter while the other is an Eastern. The Eastern is the one who attacked the Butler. There is no significant size difference yet. Plissken is still in his separate container. I'll be feeding them both tonight. Once they are fully fed, will they be able to rejoin living together?

[guidofatherof5]

After feeding I would give them an hour alone still until the feeding mode is gone.

[Finalflash50]

Thanks for the advice. I've bought worms, and covered them in ReptoCare powder so the bone absence in worms won't lead to a lack of calcium.

[ConcinusMan]

Thanks for the advice. I've bought worms, and covered them in ReptoCare powder so the bone absence in worms won't lead to a lack of calcium.

It won't anyway if the worms are living in rich black dirt or leaf compost. Lack of bones does not mean lack of calcium. Worms actually concentrate and contain calcium from the medium they are living in. Worm poop (castings) has many times the calcium found in the surrounding soil. Try to stay away from supplements and favor a varied diet that includes whole fish and/or rodents. If the snake doesn't get just the right calcium, vitamin D, and phosphorus ratio then supplementing will do more harm than a diet somewhat low in calcium. Keep your worms in rich leaf compost/black fertile dirt (you can add bone meal to the dirt for even more calcium) and your worms will have more than enough calcium. Even tilapia fillet, with no bones, has a significant amount of calcium. One bony fish or whole rodent per month, or worms like I described, will be enough without having to supplement. They don't need much. That stuff was developed for very poor diets and/or reptiles not getting enough UV that require it. Totally unnecessary for a garter getting even just a so-so diet with some calcium in it. even slugs that have just fed on dark leafy greens have calcium.

[Finalflash50]

I think what I'm going to do is keep them separate for a while. They both seem very active, and happy right now. In about a month I'll move Plissken back in. Is this a good idea? Plissken's new home is plenty big for his size.
The only thing I fear is that Plissken may not know where his water is. I haven't been watching him in his new tank, but the water seems a bit untouched. Just the other week I loured him over the top of it with a worm. His chin touched the water, but it didn't look like he drank any. Does anyone think he knows that it's there? If he doesn't, what can I do to help him find it? Thanks for any help.

[chris-uk]

He will know where the water is. He's just drinking when you aren't looking.