Hybrid Photo Thread

[Greg'sGarters]

I know that all, if not most garter snake breeders are against hybridization of species/subspecies of Thamnophis. However, it happens occasionally, whether it be from someone keeping their female checkered with their other "female" eastern or whether it be from overlapping ranges in nature. However, even though I am also against the hybridization of Thamnophis, I LOVE seeing photos of hybrids. I am a curious guy and naturally, I am curious to see what it would look like when you combined different subspecies/morphs. If you guys have any photos of garter hybrids, whether it be from your own hybridizing, or someone sent you a picture or whatever, post em down below!

***Note: This thread is to help educate people to recognize hybrid garters and to prevent the spread of non-pure bloodlines***

[guidofatherof5]

I have no photos but feel a thread dedicated to hybrid photos is in a way promoting the practice or possibly sparking an interest for the practice.
Don't mean to be a party pooper.
Just my opinion.

[ConcinusMan]

I have no photos but feel a thread dedicated to hybrid photos is in a way promoting the practice or possibly sparking an interest for the practice

Actually, most photos I've seen would have the opposite effect. I mean, look at this picture. I think we can all agree that checkered garters are great and so are concinnus' but look what happens when you cross them. They just look "blah"

T. sirtalis concinnus X T. marcianus:


Now, crossing species usually has that effect. The offspring are usually just "blah" and not near as nice as the pure parents. Crossing similar subspecies such as concinnus and infernalis is a little different. (they are both T. sirtalis') The offspring can look just as attractive as the parents (but certainly not MORE attractive) but will have some traits of both.

I think it's a terrible idea both for the hobby and possibly wild populations. If I were to accidentally create a litter like this, I would surely cull them. I wouldn't want to take the chance that they could escape into an area where wild garters occur and I certainly wouldn't want people to breed them to each other or other pure garters. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen is to cull them or use them as feeders.

[Greg'sGarters]

I think it's a terrible idea both for the hobby and possibly wild populations. If I were to accidentally create a litter like this, I would surely cull them. I wouldn't want to take the chance that they could escape into an area where wild garters occur and I certainly wouldn't want people to breed them to each other or other pure garters. The only way to ensure that doesn't happen is to cull them or use them as feeders.

Instead of culling them, you could just keep them and separate the sexes, so that they don't breed. If you can't keep them, I would be more than happy to take them. I run an unofficial garter rescue and I would be more than happy to take them. I would assure that they did not breed.

[Greg'sGarters]

I understand where you are coming from. That was my main concern about starting this thread. But on the good side, it also might help people to learn what different hybrids look like so that they can identify them and avoid purchasing them. When I was first getting into garter snakes, I was going to breed an Oregon Red-spotted to a Red-sided. It got sold to me as a Red-sided. Had it not been for me noticing the dark colored belly, and Scott Felzer correctly identifying it for me and telling me why hybridization was bad, I might have ended up with a bunch of hybrids. So this can also be an educational thread to prevent hybridization.

[chris-uk]

I understand where you are coming from. That was my main concern about starting this thread. But on the good side, it also might help people to learn what different hybrids look like so that they can identify them and avoid purchasing them. When I was first getting into garter snakes, I was going to breed an Oregon Red-spotted to a Red-sided. It got sold to me as a Red-sided. Had it not been for me noticing the dark colored belly, and Scott Felzer correctly identifying it for me and telling me why hybridization was bad, I might have ended up with a bunch of hybrids. So this can also be an educational thread to prevent hybridization.

The situation you describe here (planning to accidently breed concinnus to parietalis) wouldn't have been helped by seeing photos of a concinnus X parietalis hybrid... You had misidentified the pure-bred adults, not their offspring. What would have helped you in this situation was a garter species identification thread/wiki/page which contained identification photos that were guaranteed to be off the correct species (as opposed to a Google search for photos where some of them would have been incorrectly labelled).

I think most of the hybrid photos I've seen haven't been as pretty as the pure parents, but like morphs some people would find them attractive and intentionally breed them. There was a thread on RFUK last year where someone who normally bred boas was looking to acquire a pair of checkereds to breed against a pair of Cuitzeos he'd taken as part exchange on a boa. He thought it would be great to produce melanistic checkereds by hybridisation. Fortunately he decided to sell the Cuitzeos to someone who appreciated them for what they are.

[Selkielass]

Prev posted.
Eastern mother, albino checkered father. No brumation. I Preview I had two females.
Little one didn't make it. Rest of clutch was jellybeans.




Dad

[guidofatherof5]

I understand where you are coming from. That was my main concern about starting this thread. But on the good side, it also might help people to learn what different hybrids look like so that they can identify them and avoid purchasing them. When I was first getting into garter snakes, I was going to breed an Oregon Red-spotted to a Red-sided. It got sold to me as a Red-sided. Had it not been for me noticing the dark colored belly, and Scott Felzer correctly identifying it for me and telling me why hybridization was bad, I might have ended up with a bunch of hybrids. So this can also be an educational thread to prevent hybridization.

Then you should have posted the purpose of the thread.
I certainly didn't think this was an "educational" thread from the way it was described.

[Greg'sGarters]

Then you should have posted the purpose of the thread.
I certainly didn't think this was an "educational" thread from the way it was described.

Yeah, you're right, I'll ask one of the mods to add: "***Note: This thread is to help educate people to recognize hybrid garters and to prevent the spread of non-pure bloodlines***"

[ssssnakeluvr]

my eastern x albino checkered hybrid female. she passed away last summer.