I am sick :(

[JodiLeigh]

Hey,

Has anybody ever got sick from having a snake?

Is it possible to be allergic to snakes?

I was ill a few weeks before I got him and now since I have had him I have been ill and can't get rid of this cold and now I am having to go doctors because I'm getting worse and also have a rash on my arms!

I have been very vigilant about keeping his enclosure clean and washing my hands after every time I hold him or do anything with his tank, I even use hand sanitiser after washing my hands! So surely it can't be just from snake germs.

I will let you know what the verdict when I get back from the docs, I hope it isn't anything to do with Manny because I have gotten really attached and would hate to have to give him up :(


To be continued . . .

[gregmonsta]

The cold is probably just that ... the rash is probably from overdoing the washing/hand sanitising.

If you were to get anything from a snake it would be salmonella .... and your symptoms would be a lot worse .... and the chances of this are very slim.

[JodiLeigh]

The cold is probably just that ... the rash is probably from overdoing the washing/hand sanitising.

If you were to get anything from a snake it would be salmonella .... and your symptoms would be a lot worse .... and the chances of this are very slim.

Oh good! Phew, I was getting really worried!

And Manny can't get ill from me can he?!?!

[katach]

I agree with gregmonsta. Colds are pretty common this time of year. Snakes are really pretty clean animals. The only germs you really have to worry about is from handling their food or poo. As far as I know they can't get sick from you, but if you are worried I would limit the amount of handling. Hope you feel better soon!

[JodiLeigh]

I agree with gregmonsta. Colds are pretty common this time of year. Snakes are really pretty clean animals. The only germs you really have to worry about is from handling their food or poo. As far as I know they can't get sick from you, but if you are worried I would limit the amount of handling. Hope you feel better soon!

I thought that about he food and poop but like I say I have been making sure everything is clean all the time.

I am leaving him for a few days anyway as he's not been eating so want to make sure it's not due to stress. I have covered the sides of his enclosure and just freshened up his tank and water and got his heat mat on a thermostat and heat lamp on a timer so I won't have to do anything to disturb him.

Thank you, I hope I get better soon too.

=]

[aquamentus_11]

if you do in fact have a cold, you have a virus. most viruses are pretty species/host-specific (with some famous exceptions), so I wouldn't worry a whole lot about getting it from or giving it to your snake. better safe than sorry if you're concerned. like people have said, salmonella is mostly the thing to look out for and (at the mildest) you would have intestinal symptoms if that were the case.

don't overdo the hand-washing: the more you wash, the more damage you do to your skin via dehydration and exfoliation. esp. if you're using hot water. use room temp and a moisturizing hand soap if you need to wash that frequently. that's the way operating room staff do it and they wash their hands all day. your skin is your first-line defense!

as for the allergy...what sort of substrate are you using? you've been trying new foods for your snake; could you have encountered one that you get a reaction from? what sort of cleaners have you used for tank maintenance or hand-washing? as far as i know (so correct me if i'm wrong), snakes don't continually shed flakes of their skin between sheds or secrete ANYTHING to the outside of their bodies so i would be very surprised if you had an allergic reaction from just handling your snake. that's not to say that it's not possible; you can get an allergy to pretty much anything from what i've learned. however, i'd be more inclined to think it was something your snake crawled in that got deposited on your arms if this rash is snake-related. all of the articles that i read about snake-related allergies are re: reactions to venom. your snake hasn't been chewing on your arms, has he? garters do have a weak neurotoxin, but it would take some chewing to get it into you and even then it would probably only cause an allergic response if anything (although i did read that T. elegans vagrans bites have caused reactions similar to those seen in small crotalids (pit vipers). this was strange because they have a hemotoxin and the symptoms actually sounded more like one of those than anything.) is he cb or wc? mite or other external parasite feces could definitely cause a reaction.

i hope you feel better soon. let me know what they say it is.

[PINJOHN]

I think the above post covers most of what i had to say i would just stress that a allergy is not really a germ or virus it's your body's extreme reaction to a substance so you need to look in the snakes environment rather than at the snake its also possible that its not even connected to the snake at all but some thing new in your surroundings and at times people become suddenly allergic to things that previously never bothered them :eek:

[aquamentus_11]

btw, can you take Benadryl? your version of the drug is nicer than ours (less drowsiness) so might as well use it! jk, but it would help to get a better idea of what's going on. if your symptoms go away after using it, chances are it's allergic.

[JodiLeigh]

if you do in fact have a cold, you have a virus. most viruses are pretty species/host-specific (with some famous exceptions), so I wouldn't worry a whole lot about getting it from or giving it to your snake. better safe than sorry if you're concerned. like people have said, salmonella is mostly the thing to look out for and (at the mildest) you would have intestinal symptoms if that were the case.

don't overdo the hand-washing: the more you wash, the more damage you do to your skin via dehydration and exfoliation. esp. if you're using hot water. use room temp and a moisturizing hand soap if you need to wash that frequently. that's the way operating room staff do it and they wash their hands all day. your skin is your first-line defense!

as for the allergy...what sort of substrate are you using? you've been trying new foods for your snake; could you have encountered one that you get a reaction from? what sort of cleaners have you used for tank maintenance or hand-washing? as far as i know (so correct me if i'm wrong), snakes don't continually shed flakes of their skin between sheds or secrete ANYTHING to the outside of their bodies so i would be very surprised if you had an allergic reaction from just handling your snake. that's not to say that it's not possible; you can get an allergy to pretty much anything from what i've learned. however, i'd be more inclined to think it was something your snake crawled in that got deposited on your arms if this rash is snake-related. all of the articles that i read about snake-related allergies are re: reactions to venom. your snake hasn't been chewing on your arms, has he? garters do have a weak neurotoxin, but it would take some chewing to get it into you and even then it would probably only cause an allergic response if anything (although i did read that T. elegans vagrans bites have caused reactions similar to those seen in small crotalids (pit vipers). this was strange because they have a hemotoxin and the symptoms actually sounded more like one of those than anything.) is he cb or wc? mite or other external parasite feces could definitely cause a reaction.

i hope you feel better soon. let me know what they say it is.

So I have been to the docs and she says it a viral infection which has caused my cold, conjunctivitis (how gross!) AND the rash. She has given me some eye drops for the conjunctivitis but just have to rest up, drink plenty and wait it out :/

-I am using aspen bedding

-I have been planning trying new foods just need some money first

-No chewing on my arm, not even a little nip from him

-He is captive bred I assume as my brother got him from a pet store here in the UK

Thank you =] I am going to spend the day in bed heh heh XD

And thank you for the advice!

[aquamentus_11]

good deal. you and your buddy can get in some QT today.

[WingedWolfPsion]

Reptiles rarely cause allergies--if they do, it's generally contact dermatitis--just a rash, not other symptoms. Unless dried reptile droppings are all over, and the dust becomes airbone, there's no real way for it to cause the other symptoms. Other, more common things that trigger allergies: dust mites, mold spores, laundry detergents, artificial fragrances, pollen, and insect droppings. If doc says it is all the cold though, then hopefully that's all it is. :)

[mikem]

My niece just got over a cold that was accomplied with a rash that was on her arms and face. You probably have a virus that is going around. Keep us updated!

[JodiLeigh]

Reptiles rarely cause allergies--if they do, it's generally contact dermatitis--just a rash, not other symptoms. Unless dried reptile droppings are all over, and the dust becomes airbone, there's no real way for it to cause the other symptoms. Other, more common things that trigger allergies: dust mites, mold spores, laundry detergents, artificial fragrances, pollen, and insect droppings. If doc says it is all the cold though, then hopefully that's all it is. :)

This is what I always worry about :/
My room is always dusty, I don't know why?
My dad has changed washing powder so that could be contributing to the rash :/
It's not so bad and it's just on my wrists, I just worry too much ha ha

Well I have been in bed all day and at least I can breath a bit better and my headache is gone.
So I think I will be better soon

Thanks guys! =]

[kibakiba]

I get rashes when I use un-natural soap.... I make my own, so I usually don't but if I don't have a batch ready I get rashes all over. All natural is the way to go with soap. :D

[EasternGirl]

Well..as was already stated, the venom does cause allergic reactions in quite a number of people when they are bitten by garters. In fact, we have a few members on here that have reported allergic symptoms after bites...nothing drastic...just uncomfortable. We had a link on here not too long ago about the venom...Steve posted it...Steve, if you read this, do you mind reposting that link? I have allergies and I have noticed that the dust from the substrate can make me sneeze...and sometimes something gets my arms red and itching after I have had them in the tank...but I have yet to pinpoint what is causing it. I know it isn't the snakes though, because I do not get red or itchy after holding them.

[EasternGirl]

Found it...thread about venom in garters: http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/5277-duvernoy-gland.html

[WingedWolfPsion]

Note that what people usually experience are minor symptoms of envenomation, rather than allergic reaction. (You must be exposed to something first, at least one time, before you can develop an allergy to it).
Garter snakes do produce venom, but they are not a rear-fanged species, and have no delivery mechanism for it. It is a powerful haemotoxic venom (similar to a rattlesnake's), but they produce very little of it, and it is simply present in their saliva. Still, one foolish person did allow a garter snake to attempt to eat his finger for about 45 minutes, and he experienced classic signs of envenomation, such as those that have been reported in some hognose snake bites. This includes swelling at the bite site, joint pain, and redness. Sometimes the swelling can affect the entire hand.
Here is one gartersnake envenomation: http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v2205/63/44/77203249/n77203249_31661914_3740.jpg
And here is another: http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b297/snake_gal/The%20bite/Picture005.jpg

As you can see, it's not exactly serious, but it wouldn't be surprising if it occasionally caused other systemic symptoms, because different people have different sensitivities to snake venom.
Just like the slightly more venomous and rear-fanged hognose, garter snakes are still considered a completely harmless species.

[aquamentus_11]

Ok, that explains why the symptoms sounded more like a hemotoxin. It would make more sense to me for them to have a neurotoxin given the way they hunt and hold onto their prey, but I didn't make 'em.

Does anyone else think that this makes garters at least 12x cooler? I mean their eating habits and climbing/aquatic behaviors are what drew me to them, but venom is just the kicker. It very well could just be me: I stopped maturing mentally when I was 20.

[guidofatherof5]

Does anyone else think that this makes garters at least 12x cooler? I mean their eating habits and climbing/aquatic behaviors are what drew me to them, but venom is just the kicker. It very well could just be me: I stopped maturing mentally when I was 20.

Only 12X;)

[EasternGirl]

I do understand that...I read the article. I understand that it is actually envenomation and not an actual allergy. It does present like an allergic reaction in some people though. Chantel reacts as if she is having an allergic reaction when she is bitten by one of her snakes...whether or not it is mild envenomation or a sensitivity to the venom...I do not know. But what you are saying about allergies...you are saying that a person cannot have an allergic reaction to something the first time they are exposed to it? I don't think that is correct. I have had allergic reactions to medications the first time I took them...I have seen other people have such reactions as well. People go into anaphylactic shock the first time they are stung by a bee. So how can that be right?

No...aquamentus...it isn't just you. It definitely makes garters so much cooler!

[kibakiba]

Well, perhaps I'm extremely sensitive to it, or allergic.. People have been in contact with their venom and don't even get half of what I do. For those who don't know the reaction I get... (lets say my hand gets bitten, between my thumb and finger) The area swells up and turns red, then my hand starts swelling and turning red... Then, it starts turning purple with a numb, hot and prickly feeling through my fingers and palm. The worst case I had was like that, only it went up my arm a little bit. I'm lucky to have fast reflexes when it comes to nippy snakes... I jump if they move at me fast... Haha. If I just get nipped my hand gets red and swollen, but full on bites tend to give the swelling reaction. It also depends on whether the snakes are in feeding mode or not, probably because that would be when they produce more saliva and venom to get their prey.

[WingedWolfPsion]

Yes, those are symptoms of envenomation. If it were an allergy, you would get some redness and swelling, but also rash, and possibly hives and respiratory trouble if it were a severe enough allergy. The profound swelling, tingling, and numbness and discoloration are a venom reaction, rather than allergic reaction. You must be very unusually sensitive to garter venom, lol.

Yes, you have to be exposed to something before you can become allergic to it. The only exceptions are when people are exposed to two substances that are very similar on a molecular level. In those cases, exposure to one may be enough to cause allergy to both. For example, a fire ant sting may render a person allergic to bees and wasps as well.

Apart from that, you cannot have an allergic reaction to something you have never encountered before (at least in some form). An allergic response happens when the immune system decides that something introduced to your body is dangerous (when it's actually not), so it creates antibodies to it. These lie in wait for the substance to reappear--when it does, bam, your bloodstream is flooded with protective compounds designed to destroy the invader. These create inflammation, among other things. If there's far too many of these, you have such a severe reaction that your airway swells, and cuts off your breathing (called anaphylaxis).

Most people are simply not aware of the first exposure, because it caused no reaction, so was unremarkable.

[EasternGirl]

I understand everything that you explained...as I am in nursing school and we studied the immune system and antibodies and everything you just said. I'm trying to understand how, then, someone, who...say...has never had penicillin, has an allergic reaction the first time they take a dose of penicillin. Like...for example...a child, who takes penicillin for the first time and has a severe allergic reaction to it? And I agree, Chantel's symptoms do actually sound like evenomation not an allergy.