New Albino Checkerd garter.

[celbii]

Got a new Albino Checkered garter yesterday at our local pet store. He was the only Garter they had left, they did have a bunch of ribbon snakes but I was set on a "Garter" and not a ribbon(he cost a pretty penny more than the ribbions also :O)

My old corn of about 8 years passed away recently last week and we gave his 55 gal cage to the hermit crabs and I took their old cage to get a smaller snake. Without further ado:
Here he is last night:
http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/311822_10150384348347205_504637204_8706420_1268989 428_n.jpg
His cage last night
http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/312892_10150384348607205_504637204_8706422_2075637 354_n.jpg

Here is his cage as of about an hour ago, If anyone has any suggestions to improve on it I Would be more than happy to hear it. I know I need another hide on the cold side also since I only have that little coconut on the hot side, but the leaf pile over there should work for the moment.
You can see him around his coconut in these pictures I just took right now.
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/310534_10150386870127205_504637204_8713647_4724575 54_n.jpg
http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/311725_10150386869902205_504637204_8713646_1960293 791_n.jpg

He is also very frightened and fidgety if I walk by him he freezes up and if I try to hand him he runs for dear life, is it just because he is not use to his new home right now? I know hes probably a little stressed most likely and needs to adjust. they recently had him on pinkies every friday for the last 5 weeks or so, So I will put a pinkie in his cage on a little plastic lid and see if he eats it, I'm tempted to try a feeding cage but may just do that later as I don't want to stress him out at dinner time, I know hes going to get tons of traffic on thanksgiving and probvably just stay in his coconut that night :P.

[infernalis]

Nice setup.. Congrats on the new snakie.

http://www.thamfriends.com/mat.jpg

[katach]

That looks great! Congrats!! Welcome to the forum family!!

[EasternGirl]

He's a cutie! Sorry to hear about your cornsnake passing. Things look good in his enclosure so far. What kind of substrate are you using? Many members on here know a lot more about feeding than I do...so I will let others advise you on that. Stick to what the snake is used to for now. A feed tank can always be a good idea, but some people prefer to feed in the snake's own enclosure...again, I will let others advise more on that. He will need time to adjust to handling and getting used to you, his new environment, etc. He will be a bit stressed at first so try not to pressure him into being held just yet. After he has time to get used to his new home...start by just putting your hand next to him in his enclosure and letting him come to you. Right now he just needs some time to get used to everything. You're off to a great start. Welcome to the forum and congrats on your new little one! We are always here to help!

[chris-uk]

Welcome and congratulations on your albino checkered (it's scientific name is Thamnophis marcianus, in case you didn't know).

We have a female albino checkered which is a few months older than yours, so I can offer you a bit of advice based on our experience with her.
The viv looks like it has plenty of hiding places, although it is a little big for a baby so he may take some time to get used to it. Our snakes like cardboard tubes, so quick way to add a cheap hide would be to pop one in at the back on the cold side.
Our girl took a few weeks to settle in and didn't like being handled at all for a week or so, then we started just touching her in the viv, then holding her in the viv, then took her out.
Feeding, I assume you plan to cut the pinky up? Pieces about 1.5 times his head size are ideal, for our 4 month old checkereds they can happily take a pinky cut into 4 pieces.
Burrowing... Not sure about your substrate, but our love to burrow in aspen. It was particularly worrying with the albino being the same colour as the aspen, in the early days when we couldn't see her and a quick rummage in the aspen didn't reveal her unless she moved. :) If yours wants to hide somewhere, burrowing is always an option if your substrate isn't too heavy.

[PINJOHN]

Welcome from a slightly chilly Liverpool

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR4y1dPtN-EVPENg1BYYsLqoHg5jOJOmruRHFC-G6D7nGLBSxPphAhttp://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSaz93quM1Ay0V0d7uMRqvUm3CpZZtMC wWq2SdiSWB_eWH5brgjzg

[Light of Dae]

Welcome :) I used a feed box for mine just cause i'm scared of her eating substrate, Im no expert but I'd say if you can get her used to it, do it. Or try laying paper towel over top the substrate under the dish. A Pet store may have been feeding her with tongs too, so she might not go for an unmoving pinkie on a plate. Best of luck <3

[Char361979]

Hello and welcome.

Building on Chris' advice (I'm his wife), our little albino girl is not a fan of very bright light. Albinos as a rule should bout be exposed to bright light as it can cause damage to their eyes/skin. I would swap the lamp you have there for a heat mat at one end of the enclosure.

[guidofatherof5]

Nice to have you on the forum.
Here's a link to the care sheet.
Any questions not answered there can be posted to the forum.
Good looking Checkered.
Garter Snake Care Sheet - Caresheets (http://www.thamnophis.com/caresheets/index.php?title=Garter_Snake_Care_Sheet)

[ConcinusMan]

Welcome to the forum. It's too bad you didn't join before you bought that snake. Just a few months ago, a lot of albino checkered garters were produced by the breeders here. They were being given away for free, or dirt cheap. Got one free this year myself. When you say "pretty penny" do you mind if I ask how much you paid? They really shouldn't be much more than $30 at the most and like I said, this year there were so many produced, breeders were giving them away. I have a feeling that once you get to know us and litters become available, you'll just have to get another one, or three, or five.:p

Good advice about light. Don't expose albinos to intense light or sunlight. They have no melanin to protect them from sunburn, cancer, etc. and can go blind. Some of my albinos don't mind bright light but I still don't use light bulbs to keep them warm. It's too risky. Ambient light from a nearby window and an undertank heater or ceramic heat emitter for warmth is recommended. Above all, thoroughly read the caresheet that Steve posted. It will answer a lot of questions you might have and help you to avoid making husbandry mistakes.

Baby garters need to eat often, say about 3-4 times a week and be careful not to let them get way stuffed like you would a python. Overstuffing can be fatal when they are this young. Make sure the snake can get into the water easily as baby garters can dehydrate very fast. I would use a dish that is easier to get into. That one has sides that are quite high. A shallow dish with low sides such as a plastic coffee can lid is better when it comes to baby snakes. One more thing, I wouldn't cover the tank like that. Adequate ventilation is important especially using reptile bark. It tends to make the humidity very high which isn't good. Other than that, your setup looks great. I don't mean to pick, I just want your experience with your garter to be a pleasant and rewarding one with a happy healthy snake.;)


Here's a girl that I was keeping up until recently. Her name is "Butters"

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg694/scaled.php?server=694&filename=111005large.jpg&res=medium

Looking forward to having you stick around and keep us posted on his progress. ummm... wait, I think that you might have a little girl there.

[celbii]

Hey everyone, thanks so much for all the great info! I'll try to reply to some of it as im in a bit of a rush at the moment :P
Feeding wise, They are pretty tiny pinkies, the store I got him from I believe were feeding them whole to him once a week.
The substrate is reptile bark, which he has been able to burrow into(and make me sad when I dont see him :P).
I was kind of wondering also about covering the top, we did it mostly to keep heat in. Also what are your opinions on a red light? I switch the light to a red bulb at night time.

However, if no lights are required for an albino(Makes sense) can anyone recommend a good heat mat to me? I was worried that they could burn the snake if he was on the glass but I guess they are making them with thermostats these days probably.

As for the water I think it is okay, I caught him earlier taking a big drink from it untill he saw me looking at him after he finished and went to hide.

edit: Also alot of the time I find him (in the 3 days I have owned him lol) usually when he is not in his coconut on the hot side(with light) he is hiding somewhere usually burrowed under the bark in the cool side, would this be an indicator that the light is bad for him?

[infernalis]

I will maintain this to the end. Garter snakes live in some really harsh conditions.. They are quite happy at room temperatures (Unless you live in an igloo)

Shut down everything at night, Evenings are supposed to be cooler for them.

The local T.S.sirtals can often be found under things while there is frost on the ground.

[RedSidedSPR]

Welcome to the forum!

Awesome snake! Ask any questions you have, and Keep us posted

[guidofatherof5]

The smallest ZooMed heat pad doesn't get very hot.
I understand your concern about the possibility of getting burned. I sometimes place a ceramic tile on the glass where the mat is.
This way the mat has to heat up the tile up which lowers the overall temp. Just an idea.

Amazon.com: zoomed heat pad (http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=zoomed+heat+pad&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps&hvadid=7400641524&ref=pd_sl_8eh41tjig5_b)

[chris-uk]

I tried one of our pads without a stat, and it got to just over 30C. Now I believe that rocks and the ground in many parts of the States will get far in excess of that on a nice sunny summer day.

[EasternGirl]

That is good to know since I have been nervous about using one for the new albino on his way....

[ConcinusMan]

Now I believe that rocks and the ground in many parts of the States will get far in excess of that on a nice sunny summer day.

While this is true, I caution about comparing outside wild conditions with those in captivity. People often compare the conditions outside where they found the snake and think that's good inside. Such as wet forest floor, swampy areas, rotting compost matter etc. Just because that's where you find them outside doesn't mean they will do well like that inside. Another thing, "a sunny summer day" usually has air temps well in excess of room temperatures. Snakes in captivity that are struggling to raise their core temp because of low air temp, can, and do burn themselves on heat pads. You just won't see garters, even outside, sitting on scalding hot surfaces on a warm summer day. On the contrary, they tend to disappear and are only seen warming themselves and being active, in morning when the air is very cool, and the last few hours of the day.

While they might survive just fine at room temp as some people say, I don't think one should do that. For one thing, its not at all how they live in the wild. On the other hand, how they live in the wild is sometimes irrelevant. So what if you find them outside when it's cold? That doesn't necessarily mean we should put them through that. They do tolerate adverse conditions but the point here is, to give them very comfortable conditions while in captivity. The right amount of heat, and wide temperature gradient in captivity enhances immunity, growth and digestion. I don't recommend keeping your garters at room temp all the time. They need a heat source to thrive. They should be able to raise their core temp to 80-86 degrees F during the day. They will inevitably seek to achieve that whenever conditions allow it. At other times in the physiology (such as being in shed) they may seek out cooler temps. My point is, they should have that gradient and be able to choose. Turning all lights and heat off at night and cooling them down, (unless sick or injured) giving them uninterrupted night, I can recommend. I would not keep them warm 24 hours a day and I wouldn't interrupt their night by coming in the room and turning lights on. Night should be just that. Dark, and cooler than the day but I would never keep a garter long term without allowing it warm itself to at least 80 F each day, if they should so choose to do so. Brumation and simulated fall/winter for breeding purposes is an exception to this.

[infernalis]

Even though you are dancing around it, don't worry about offending ME Richard.

If you read that post carefully, I said almost what you just did.

I did not recommend anything aside from shutting down the heat at night. Read closely grasshopper. :D


I will maintain this to the end. Garter snakes live in some really harsh conditions.. They are quite happy at room temperatures (Unless you live in an igloo)

Shut down everything at night, Evenings are supposed to be cooler for them.

The local T.S.sirtals can often be found under things while there is frost on the ground.

Examples for illustrative purposes, the only recommendation in that post was to shut down at night.

[ConcinusMan]

Now, you know better than that Wayne. Since when have I ever worried about offending anyone when stating my opinion.:rolleyes: I wasn't dancing around anything. I just thought that this statement gives the wrong impression. It sounds like you're recommending keeping them at room temp and no added heat. IMO that's not good for long term and that's all I'm trying to say. There are people that say they keep them in tubs with no added heat, just room temp and "they do fine". That's just ludicrous. Not recommended at all. They would survive most likely, but they certainly won't thrive. Yes, garters face harsh conditions in the wild. It's not our goal to make their life harsh in captivity.


I will maintain this to the end. Garter snakes live in some really harsh conditions.. They are quite happy at room temperatures (Unless you live in an igloo)

[EasternGirl]

Okay...well considering all that you are saying, and the fact that I am starting to get a better handle on things...I have been trying to monitor the temps in Cee Cee and Selena's enclosure carefully these days. I usually use a 25 watt basking bulb during the day along with a flourescent light...and a 25 watt night bulb. I have noted that the temp during the day gets to about 77/78 degrees with the basking light I'm using, and goes down to about 70-73 degrees at night with the night bulb I'm using. I'm thinking that based on what you are saying, I should have higher temps for them during the day...and lower temps for them at night. What should I use to get the temps higher for them during the day? And, should I just not use any bulbs at night? I just worry about it getting too cold at night.

[infernalis]

Sometimes Richard I do forget That I maintain the whole room and that's not what everyone would do, so I should be more careful with my words.

Dorothy has arthritis in her back, so we keep our whole house around 80, and most people don't.

[ConcinusMan]

Okay...well considering all that you are saying, and the fact that I am starting to get a better handle on things...I have been trying to monitor the temps in Cee Cee and Selena's enclosure carefully these days. I usually use a 25 watt basking bulb during the day along with a flourescent light...and a 25 watt night bulb. I have noted that the temp during the day gets to about 77/78 degrees with the basking light I'm using, and goes down to about 70-73 degrees at night with the night bulb I'm using. I'm thinking that based on what you are saying, I should have higher temps for them during the day...and lower temps for them at night. What should I use to get the temps higher for them during the day? And, should I just not use any bulbs at night? I just worry about it getting too cold at night.

Your temperatures sound just fine. I'm sure if you don't use air conditioning, those temps go up in the summer. That's the thing about garters though, things don't have to be so precise. You're getting close enough, and there's a drop at night. 77-86 in the day sounds fine to me. And no need to worry about your night time temps. As long as night is not routinely falling below 55 F or so, but is cooler than daytime, don't worry about it. And I'm sure you're talking about air temperature. Yours sounds fine. If they act like they are seeking out the warmest part of the tank during the day, you could ad an undertank heater if you wish. That provides a warmer surface on the bottom but probably won't raise the air temp more than a few degrees, which is fine. Except for the hottest part of summer, the room I kept my snakes in routinely dropped down to around 60 at night. That's fine. won't hurt them one bit, and it helps them get a good rest.

[EasternGirl]

Okay...well, they do seem to stay on the warm side of the tank most of the time...but I have a feeling that has more to do with that being where their favorite log hide is located than temp. Right now I have the tank next to a window and it's been cooler there...I'm getting ready to move it since it's going to be getting pretty drafty and cold now this time of year...the place I'm going to move the tank has a heat vent near by...I'm going to monitor the temp there for a few days and then I'll decide if I think I need to add a UTH mat...thanks.

[ConcinusMan]

Yeah, you want good ventilation, but not drafty.

[celbii]

Well I guess that if the light is no good for my albino I will buy the undertank mat the small size. I do enjhoy the red light at night so I can see him though :P

[ConcinusMan]

Well if your snake tends to be active right after dark like every albino I've ever had, go ahead and use the red bulb. You can turn it on and off and the snake won't even notice. They can't see it. To them it will seem as if it is and has been dark all along. That is, if the room is dark other than the red bulb. I would get the small or extra small undertank heater though. But there's nothing wrong with using the red bulb for night viewing. I do it too.

[EasternGirl]

Richard...I plan on keeping my new albino in my bedroom...but I leave a nightlight on in my room at night so it is never completely dark in my room at night...should that be a problem? Also...I'm up late and the lights are on in the bedroom until about 1am...will that cause problems for him?

[guidofatherof5]

Not as long as he has a hide to be in or under.

[ConcinusMan]

will that cause problems for him?

I doubt it. Even when I use a ridiculously large computer monitor in their room, which does cast a little light on them, it never seemed to bother them. They still act as if it's night. I didn't mean it has to be pitch black. I just mean you shouldn't light up their room at night. I think doing that confuses their natural rhythms of day and night. Just try to make "lights out" be about the same time every night and don't interrupt that once it's night, or make it erratic. It confuses them and it interrupts their sleep cycles. Just like it would if you and I were forced awake several times a night. It would make you cranky. They're no different in that respect.

[EasternGirl]

Okay thanks guys.

[celbii]

Ok guys Just ordered the small heat pad off amazon and will put it on his hot side and stop using the bright light, probably still use the red light on a low wattage bulb without the towel for night viewing.

[EasternGirl]

Sounds good!