Oldest breeding female

[chris-uk]

Those of you that breed...how old is your oldest female that is still breeding (or how old was the mother of your oldest litter)?
Reason for asking is that Char has spoken to someone about a breeding trio (2 males, 1 female) of San Frans. They are 3 years old and confirmed breeders. We're trying to find out more, because we originally enquired about a couple of babies from this breeder.
So I'm trying to judge whether there's much breeding life left in the female. Does it vary in different sub-species?

[Thamnophis]

I have some ladies (sirtalis sirtalis, black and sirtalis tetrataenia) of 6 year who still produce healthy young. They all brumate every year during 2 - 3 months in the refrigerator at 4 - 6 degrees C. They are captive born ladies.

[kibakiba]

It depends on each individual snake, 3 years old isn't that old. That would be a normal breeding age for a NW (they don't reach adult size until 3). As long as she's healthy, I could see her having quite a few litters.

[guidofatherof5]

3 years old sound like they are at prime breeding age with many years left.
I base my opinion on my snakes.

Beautiful snakes and I wish the best of luck.

[chris-uk]

It sounds like the age of the snake isnt an issue. We just need to ask a few more questions and see if we can get them for a reasonable price.

[PINJOHN]

slightly off topic i know but the male that fathered your snakes is over ten years old, not only that but he shows an interest in any female no matter what species and hassles them continually, should have called him Errol :D

[chris-uk]

lol. I remembered that you'd said the father of our bunch was an old guy.
I'd read about female snakes hitting a menopause in captivity, but not really seen anything about when it kicks in.

Here's hoping Char hears back from the guy with the San Fran trio soon, if we do buy them it will take a little bit of planning and preparation.

[PINJOHN]

The Borg could not have assimilated you two any more successfully than we have, :p :D

[ssssnakeluvr]

I was given a female flame/ery eastern this year. she had produced a litter earlier. she is one of the earlier flame/ery girls, probably 10 years old or more.

[Char361979]

Academic... Not getting these three. Way too much. Now in a bad mood. Hrumph.

[guidofatherof5]

Sorry to hear you won't be getting them.
Can you share with us the cost. Just curious.

[chris-uk]

It was going to be £150 a snake, which isn't massively over the odds, it may even be a good price but they don't come on the open market often enough to say (I know Thamnophis has a couple on his website in Holland for €180 for a CB11 pair, and so around £140 for a pair in Holland). It's just a bit more than we were looking to spend at the moment (when Char enquired it was with the thought of getting a single juvenile female, not a trio) . We'd be looking at spending maybe another £200 or so to get a 3' viv setup for the guys as well. So it was all about little too much to spend out of the blue. I think I should settle in for a long term plan to get some more vivs in place, then go hunting for tetras, maybe take Char for a weekend in Holland...

[Char361979]

If we have the room later, maybe some radix may be in order. I fear we wouldn't be so much T.Radix Ranch as T.Radix Tent.:D

[PINJOHN]

did you check out the female san fran i told you about , also before you pay top pet shop prices for viv's, check out custom aquaria a young fella who has built up his own viv business he does standard vivs, or will accommodate any design you wish. his work is good, he is reasonably priced, he can be bartered with, and he delivers them to the shows, donny included what more could you ask. [ after that spectacular endorsement i think i will buy shares in his company] :D

[chris-uk]

did you check out the female san fran i told you about , also before you pay top pet shop prices for viv's, check out custom aquaria a young fella who has built up his own viv business he does standard vivs, or will accommodate any design you wish. his work is good, he is reasonably priced, he can be bartered with, and he delivers them to the shows, donny included what more could you ask. [ after that spectacular endorsement i think i will buy shares in his company] :D

Do you mean these guys John? CustomAquaria_home (http://www.customaquaria.co.uk/index.htm)
If so, they're not far from us, and one my route to/from the office (on the rare occassions I have to got to the office).

Char called about the female San Fran, it was sold 3 weeks ago. The person Char spoke to didn't seem to know what a San Fransisco Garter was until she helped with a description - "garter snake, brightly coloured, been on your shelf a while".

[PINJOHN]

Yes that's him customaquaria, nice lad very friendly and helpful.
as for the pet shop he has a huge selection of reps and amphibs even down to a speckled or black caiman [cant remember which] you dont have that much stuff without knowing your business, you must have got through to someone new or a family member helping out, either way the snake being gone is a bummer :mad:

[chris-uk]

you must have got through to someone new or a family member helping out, either way the snake being gone is a bummer :mad:
Yes and Yes. She called on a Sunday, so likely to be "the Sunday boy". Agreed, bummer it's gone, we just wanted one and if it had been on the shelf for a while he may have dropped his price more.

[PINJOHN]

Yes that's him customaquaria, nice lad very friendly and helpful.
as for the pet shop he has a huge selection of reps and amphibs even down to a speckled or black caiman [cant remember which] you dont have that much stuff without knowing your business, you must have got through to someone new or a family member helping out, either way the snake being gone is a bummer :mad:
did anyone notice the new species of crocodilian i introduced above, if so go to the top of the class. i of course meant spectacled caiman :o

[Char361979]

I spoke to an older guy when I rang. He knew what the san fran was once I said "brightly coloured female snake you've had for a while2. He said he knew which one I meant and that he sold it three weeks previously and was not going to get anymore as "they are a pain in the arse to sell and no one wants them." After checking out his website I'm not suprised she didn't sell. No listings of what he had in stock. If he'd listed his san fran on his site it would have come up on the numerous web searches I trawled through.

[PINJOHN]

I spoke to an older guy when I rang. He knew what the san fran was once I said "brightly coloured female snake you've had for a while2. He said he knew which one I meant and that he sold it three weeks previously and was not going to get anymore as "they are a pain in the arse to sell and no one wants them." After checking out his website I'm not suprised she didn't sell. No listings of what he had in stock. If he'd listed his san fran on his site it would have come up on the numerous web searches I trawled through.
to add to his difficulty's it seemed a shy snake, always hidden away when i visited, i only knew he had it because i specifically asked about garters, hence the reason i was hoping it was still there
"no one wants them" try telling that to all our American friends :(

[Char361979]

I want them! I want lots of them! I dreamt about garter snakes last night!! I'm now a garter bore. It's all I talk about! I have a wish list of the various types I want to collect. It's becoming an unhealthy obsession. I may have to make Chris sleep in the car so there is more space for snakes. I've nearly had rows with people who say boas are better, and get really defensive when people don't even know what garter snakes are.

Hello.
My name is Char.
I'm a gartersnakeaholic.
It's been 2 hours since I last went to check on one of my snakes (although now I've typed this I want to take a peek)

[chris-uk]

You can go for 2 hours without looking in one viv or the other? Since we moved Esk upstairs I've been visiting going upstairs more often. It's good exercise.

[katach]

It seems that my snakes are all I talk about as well. My mom loves that I have such a passion for them. She just can't hear about feeding time. The whole thought of pinkies freaks her out. :)