Please help me with my garter snake!

[RedSidedSPR]

Nah, I got it. I was just playing along with Chantels confusion.:p

[kibakiba]

I still don't get it. It's not nice to mess with a blonde, jesse... You'll be in a world of hurt. :rolleyes:

[amcutem]

Im so hurt...


HE GOT AWAY!

I didn't think he was long enough to get to the top:-(

Im so broken hearted....:(

[kibakiba]

You'll find him! Trust me, I thought looking for Pumpkin was a lost cause after a week or two, and then I found her almost about to go out the door and covered in spider webs. The best thing you can do is not look, you will find them if you aren't looking for them. Funny how it works.

You could heat up an area on the floor, that might attract him to it.

[guidofatherof5]

What a shame. Sorry to hear this news.
He may turn up. They sometimes do.
He'll probably head for a warm place. Under a refridge, stove or dryer.
They usually stay along walls when travelling.
Best of luck.

[amcutem]

But theres lots of vents in our house, it goes through the floor. I think he went in there.

[kibakiba]

Well, I thought pumpkin went into the vents here, and some mice live down there. At her size, the mice could rip her to shreds in a second, but she didn't go in them. She went for the spider infested living room, and she came out from under the loveseat, covered in webs and a bit dehydrated, but she was okay.

[RedSidedSPR]

So sorry! That sucks :(

You'll find him though!

[d_virginiana]

Sorry to hear that.. They're escape artists. Anyone who's kept a lot of garters has had it happen. Good thing is, it's not uncommon for them to show up again.

The heatmat idea is really good. Maybe leave some water dishes where he can get to them if he happens to be wandering about? I know it sounds crazy, but I've actually seen it work for several people who have had copperheads or rat snakes loose in their homes and couldn't find them (and hey, it can't hurt). They would bake a chocolate pie and sit it somewhere where the snake could get to it. I guess it's something about the smell? Anyways, the snakes would always come to investigate it within an hour or two. If he's in your vents maybe a strong smell would be able to lure him out.
(Has anyone else heard of the pie trick? It may just be a local thing..)

[guidofatherof5]

But theres lots of vents in our house, it goes through the floor. I think he went in there.

Unfortunately heat/air/cold return vents are usually a one-way trip. Snakes get down in the duct work and then search for away out.
Ducts are usually very dusty and dehydration sets in quickly.
This has just been my experience with this situation.
I wish I had better news for you.
Lets hope that's not where your snake went.;)

[amcutem]

I can't believe this is happening..

That snake is dead if he ever shows up!!!!

Im so pissed...!!!

:(

I don't have a heat mat, but I do have a small heater... I turned it on and I put it in corner by the living room...

If I don't find him!!!

Im gonna hunt for a replacement...Are they easy to find?

I never knew owning a snake felt so goooooood

[katach]

When Toothless got out. I found her by the window in a potted plant. They really are escape artists. One night Willow got out and we found her on the xbox controller. I guess the green light and warmth of the charger was too much to resist. Either that or she's a gamer too. ;) Don't worry you'll find him.

[amcutem]

OMG



HE's back!

My mother just phoned me after having a minor hearth attacl becuz she saw him in d kitchen snaking around the floor. !


I love life!

Now only if my wife will do the same :-(

[guidofatherof5]

So, is he safe and secure or still on the loose?

[amcutem]

Yes. My mother found the
Courage to pick him up and put him back in d aquarium.

[katach]

Awesome!! They always turn up sooner or later. Glad he is safe!

[J@50n]

You wish your wife was snaking around your kitchen floor?

[RedSidedSPR]

Lol Jason.:D

thats awesome!!!!! I told ya you'd find him! Glad he's back!

[amcutem]

You wish your wife was snaking around your kitchen floor?

Lol.

No.

Comeback!


Hahaha, funny

[kimbosaur]

The fishes are in the tupperware pond I made, and the water is very shallow

Not sure if it makes any difference, but those aren't guppies! They're neon tetras! :)

Congrats on finding your snake :)

[guidofatherof5]

Yes. My mother found the
Courage to pick him up and put him back in d aquarium.

Glad to hear he's safe and sound.
The security breech has been fixed, right?

[RedSidedSPR]

Kim, I've seen a lot of feeder guppies with that color, so I'm really not sure, but they do look like that...

And yeah, make sure he can't get out again! Fix any holes, etc. Or, from what it sounds like, put a lid on it.

[indigoman]

Your mother deserves a big thank you! I'm sure it was not easy for her to do that.

[kimbosaur]

Kim, I've seen a lot of feeder guppies with that color, so I'm really not sure, but they do look like that...

I think there are feeders with that colour/pattern (endlers maybe?), but its the shape (tail especially) that gives it away as a tetra. They're actually a lot brighter in an aquarium, but look much duller when they're stressed/scared:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2121/2544926516_e803397c02.jpg

See, when it comes to snakes I don't have a clue, but for the fish I'm sure! :D

Only reason I brought it up is because when they're isolated, they literally stay in one spot not moving whereas guppies are much more active (maybe why the snake didn't go for them?). Also, they're tropical fish, so I don't know if they'd be considered garter-safe.

[RedSidedSPR]

Oh yeah, definitely a tetra! Sorry, couldnt tell. I keep aquariums too, and am kicking myself for not seeing that :D

[guidofatherof5]

Does anyone know with species tetras these are?
I wanted to check the fish list but don't know which fish this is.

[katach]

Neon (Paracheirodon innesi)

[RedSidedSPR]

Neon tetras. (paracheirodon innessi... or something like that)

Crap again. Sorry Kat, didn't see that you posted. And apperantely i spelled it wrong too.

[katach]

We are on the same wave length today!

[RedSidedSPR]

I do that alot. I don't know what happens.

[katach]

Great minds think alike!

[guidofatherof5]

I was unable to find any information with regards to these fish containing Thiaminase.
When in doubt, don't feed.
With guppies and mollies on the safe fish side hopefully there are other options to feed.
Just my opinion.

[amcutem]

Glad to hear he's safe and sound.
The security breech has been fixed, right?

Yes.

I still can't believe how he escaped. I seriously thought he wasn't long enough to do it. He is clever like the real Michaelanglo.

[amcutem]

Your mother deserves a big thank you! I'm sure it was not easy for her to do that.

You don't know...

I can't believe she did it.

[amcutem]

So whats up. Are the fishes ok to feed?

[RedSidedSPR]

Don't go by how LONG the snake is. One of my babies, isn't long enough, but he can stick to the glue in the corners. And he knows it. I've had to seal the tiniest holes. They are escape artists. They'll find away out. Thats why you need secure cages.

[RedSidedSPR]

So whats up. Are the fishes ok to feed?

We don't know. Like Steve said. When in doubt don't feed.

[d_virginiana]

Glad to hear he's back!

Like they said, it's better to stick to a known safe species for the fish.. They're probably cheaper than the tetras too.

[amcutem]

When can I start holding him? Its been a while already, if u dont count the two days off prisonbreak, that he's been in the aquarium.

Can i start holding him so he starts to get use to me?

[RedSidedSPR]

Heck, BECAUSE of the jailbreak I wouldn't.

I'd get him eating first. Or at least just wait a few more weeks before handling.

[kibakiba]

I agree with Jesse. Get him eating, then worry about handling.

[amcutem]

Ok. Wil do.

[Venti]

I don't know if you have already done this, but for some people recomend putting a dark colored blanket or towel over the tank, to help calm down the snake. I just thought this might be worth giving a shot.

[amcutem]

I don't know if you have already done this, but for some people recomend putting a dark colored blanket or towel over the tank, to help calm down the snake. I just thought this might be worth giving a shot.

You know what, I think u gave a giod idea. Ut seems that he's alway scared of people. But lately, he's not quick to bounce when i stick my hands in the aquarium.

I didn't know snakes have bad eye sight.

[katach]

They can see a little, but they use smell the most.

Any luck with the slug?

[d_virginiana]

He needs to get started eating before you try handling him.. Is his cage in an area where people aren't walking around often? If he can't see a whole lot of things going on around him he might calm down.

I've heard of the dark towel thing too, but mostly for animals that don't really hunt by eyesight. I just wonder if the dark would make him less able to find a prey item or if the shock of suddenly removing the covering to feed would make him too nervous?

[kibakiba]

Well, since they do go by smell a bit, it wouldn't be too hard to find the prey. Despite Runt being partially blind (she chews on sticks, hides, fingers, water dishes and bumps into them too and they aren't food scented) She flicks her tongue more often than the other snakes and gets to her food, as long as you aren't moving it. She can sense light and darkness, turning the lamp on or off often scares her. As for the light of taking the towel off of the tank, do it slowly so it wont be a sudden blinding light on him.

[amcutem]

They can see a little, but they use smell the most.

Any luck with the slug?

Im not sure. I left him a small white slug lastnite but im not sure if he ate it, and i dont want to bother him by checking. I always leave worms with him though. Im gonna find more tomorrow.

Thanks.

[amcutem]

Yesteday I tried to go toad, tadpole, and frog hunting but I wasn't so lucky.

Can someone gimme pointers on how to catch them. I hope I dont have to swim. The place I went to had a small pond wid floating lillies. But the lillies were at the middle of the pond. Also, wen is the best time to catch them?

[guidofatherof5]

Beware of the heavy parasite load that most of them carry.;)

[RedSidedSPR]

They'll be out when it's cooler. You can find them along banks. On land. Key is to not scare them, or they'll just jump in the water.


Beware of the heavy parasite load that most of them carry.;)

Well, before he was caught, I'm sure he ate plenty of frogs. A few more to get him eating is probably worth it.

[guidofatherof5]

They'll be out when it's cooler. You can find them along banks. On land. Key is to not scare them, or they'll just jump in the water.
Well, before he was caught, I'm sure he ate plenty of frogs. A few more to get him eating is probably worth it.

It was just a friendly reminder;)

[RedSidedSPR]

I know. Didn't mean that.

[d_virginiana]

Yesteday I tried to go toad, tadpole, and frog hunting but I wasn't so lucky.

Can someone gimme pointers on how to catch them. I hope I dont have to swim. The place I went to had a small pond wid floating lillies. But the lillies were at the middle of the pond. Also, wen is the best time to catch them?

If you're looking for tads, they'll be more likely to be near the edges of the water or hiding under debris. If you go out in the middle of the day, check under floating vegetation and debris in deeper (like, knee deep) water, and if you can go out at dawn/twilight, they'll be more likely to be out in the open.

Like Steve said, they can be risky to use because of parasites, so try to get him on other things as soon as you can.

[amcutem]

Hi guys.

Today I bought feeder guppies from d petstore. They were like $5 for 25, so cheap:-)?

Before i bought the guppies, i kept trying to feed him worms. Im not sure if he ever did it one or yet, but everytime i get my hopes up, i'll find the worm dead somewhere in the habitat. Sad and anoying.

So I guess i just let the guppies swim around too?



Thanks

[katach]

yep. They are very active fish so the splashing and movement should attract your little ones attention. Good luck!

[RedSidedSPR]

That's a good price. Yes just let the swim in a low-to-the-ground shallow dish.

[amcutem]

I couldn't take it anymore, I had to pick him up even for just a bit.

I think he's starting to calm down now, becuz it seems he's not too surprize and scared too much wen I put my hand inside his aquariun. Lastnite I held him and I think he poooooped on me. Yuk! It was wet and white but it didn't have an odour. It reminded me of tofu? Thats a good sign, right?

Or was it peee

[RedSidedSPR]

It was poop. They poo/pee all in one convenient little bundle like birds.:p he did it out of fear or defense.

[guidofatherof5]

With garters you get two-for-one. It's a combo package.;)

[amcutem]

Yeah, but is that a good sign that he still had food inside him? Im still worry about his diet?

[RedSidedSPR]

I guess.

It's been awhile. I would try some other foods. Even frogs.

[guidofatherof5]

I by no means am trying to tell you what to do but it has been long enough you should consider the possibility that this snake will not adjust to captive life.
It is no reflection on you or anything you've done but a fact of life with some snakes.
Some, not many just won't adjust.
Garter snakes as a rule will adjust and eat like pigs.
I released a radix once that just wouldn't settle down. He would eat but was obviously under stress.
Doing what's best for the animal sometimes means not doing what we want to do.
Just my thoughts.

[kibakiba]

The white is urates. If there isn't poop in it, brown, then there is no food left in him.

[RedSidedSPR]

Not allways the case but yes... That's true.

[amcutem]

I saw some sort of frogs in the petstore. I think it was called clawed frogs. I will buy the smallest one, or else..........

[kibakiba]

I don't think a clawed frog will help. I'm not sure if they have any toxins in their skin that could harm your snake.

[katach]

If you put it in live I would worry about it harming your snake. From what I've read those claws are what the frogs use to tear apart their food.

[amcutem]

If you put it in live I would worry about it harming your snake. From what I've read those claws are what the frogs use to tear apart their food.

Well, ll cut claws of or something.

[katach]

Good idea.

[RedSidedSPR]

NOT. don't do that, they will not hurt the snake.;)

[d_virginiana]

Are they African clawed frogs or African dwarf frogs? Dwarf frogs are identical to clawed frogs, but they stay tiny and don't have claws.

Mainly, like Chantel said, I'd be worried about toxins. Is there any way you can catch a small wild frog? Almost all frogs excrete some sort of toxin, it just might not be harmful to humans or the animals that would naturally eat them. When you start giving your snake non-native frogs you run the risk of harming them. I had a bad experience like that when I gave my snake a pinky I had offered my pacman frog. Only time he ever regurgitated in his life.

[guidofatherof5]

Mainly, like Chantel said, I'd be worried about toxins. Is there any way you can catch a small wild frog? Almost all frogs excrete some sort of toxin, it just might not be harmful to humans or the animals that would naturally eat them. When you start giving your snake non-native frogs you run the risk of harming them. I had a bad experience like that when I gave my snake a pinky I had offered my pacman frog. Only time he ever regurgitated in his life.

Very good point to bring up.;)

[RedSidedSPR]

Claws won't be a risk, but non-native skin toxins definitely could.

I would try to catch one...

[amcutem]

Ok guys, i know u can't read my thoughts, but Im freakin out. I don't want him to die or let him go. WTF! :-( what do I have do?

Tomorrow morning Im waking up at 8am and im buying a net. But I Still dont know where and how to catch a frog. I found a two places that I will go to tomorrow. If I cant catch any, im buying the frogs I saw at the pet store. I think It was called clawed frogs and some of them were white in colour. Last nite I left food, fish and worms, in every corner of the habitat. Im thinking maybe he also needs a darker and bushy enviroment since the place i found him has a lot of tall grass and bushes.

[kibakiba]

Well, sometimes you have to do what is best for him. At this point it might be better to let him go, otherwise he will die. Force feeding can kill him if you try that, too.

[katach]

Maybe a little greenery would help. Are you "in the tank" often? You may just want to let him be for a while. If he is stressed he won't eat. Have you tried frozen/thawed pinkies? My youngest NW took those right away.

It's been a month is that correct? It may be time to release. I'm sorry. I know you have put a lot into him, and you are emotionally invested, but sometimes they just don't take to captivity.

[amcutem]

Thanks for ur help guys.

[amcutem]

Would him shedding skin have anything to do with his appetite?

[RedSidedSPR]

not really, it's been too long to blame shedding. Did he just shed???

[Starling96]

maybe
some snakes dont eat when in shed

[d_virginiana]

Shedding wouldn't cause him not to eat for a month, and a lot of snakes don't even go off food during shed.

[kibakiba]

Actually, they do. Almost all of my snakes go off food when in shed... Only the really big ones/ females will eat in sheds. My males wont.

[guidofatherof5]

Shedding wouldn't cause him not to eat for a month, and a lot of snakes don't even go off food during shed.

Very true. Many never miss a meal during the shed phase.
Then there are those that do stop.

[woody44]

All my kings eat while in shed but when I had ball pythons they wouldn't with the exception of a couple. It just depends on the snake imo.

But a month without feeding wouldn't be caused by being in shed.

[RedSidedSPR]

My snakes are still pigs when shedding...

[d_virginiana]

Neither of mine do. Last time Houdini was in shed, I picked him up and gave him a couple worms, and when I came back into the room five minutes later, he had started to shed. He's such a pig.

[kibakiba]

Snap shovels food in when I hold her up to the food even when she's in shed... My boys don't. I wish they would though, it'd make it easier.

[RedSidedSPR]

I don't feed as much when they're shedding anyway, I personally think they aren't meant to eat as much, cause its harder to shed on a full stomach.
Just my observations...

[kibakiba]

Yeah, I don't usually feed at all when in shed, unless it's a couple worm pieces. Snap wont eat from the hemostats and will constantly strike at me if I don't give her what she wants. She's one of the slower shedders, though... She takes about a week to shed, so a couple worms wouldn't hurt. ;)

[amcutem]

not really, it's been too long to blame shedding. Did he just shed???

Yes

[RedSidedSPR]

Huh. Interesting.

Well, maybe he'll eat, try some worms, catch a frog.

[kimbosaur]

It seems to me that keeping the snake is only stressing the both of you out!! Taking any animal from the wild is tricky business because they are wild animals! Not all of them can just accept the change in lifestyle. Being the one who removed him from his home, it's your responsibility to recognize that you might have to bring him back if he doesn't adjust well.

I know it's easy to get attached to animals (trust me, I know!), but it seems that the snake is really unhappy being caged up. Also, it's making you unhappy and stressed out seeing someone you're attached to be stressed out. I don't think it's fair to keep a wild animal caged up if he's obviously not adjusting well. If he's not happy in your home, then you need to bring him back to his! It sucks but it's what's best. Since you already have a set-up, maybe you can go out and get yourself a captive bred snake that you know is for keeps :)

[RedSidedSPR]

Well said and I agree.;)

[d_virginiana]

Yeah, it's probably time to let him go even though you don't want to. It can be hard, but knowing that he'll do fine in the wild should make it easier for you though.

If you go out and get a captive bred garter, I can just about guarantee your experience will be so much better. You've already got the setup and learned a lot about caring for them.

[katach]

I have babies for sale right now, They are NW. I'm sure about shipping to Canada though. By the time they will be ready for new homes they will be on unscented pinkie parts. Let me know. I do agree that it's probably time for you to let him go back to the wild.

[kibakiba]

I don't think you can import a snake without the proper paperwork and such.

[Mommy2many]

I believe it is rather cumbersome. We have a few Canadian members on the foum that may be able to help you out.

[katach]

That may be a little more than I want to deal with then.

[ConcinusMan]

If Canadians want northwesterns they can them from B.C.

[kibakiba]

His snake is a northwestern, so it wouldn't be too hard.

[amcutem]

SLUGS!!!!!

I think he likes slugs......

Each time I put them in there, they're gone in a second...I've never really seen him eat it, but I doubt those slugs can get far in such a short time....

Thanks Katach and everyone else who didn't tell me to let him go:mad:.

I know you guys just wanted to save the NW Garter spicies that are decaying....

lol

Anyways, I know u guys just wanted to help


Man..........

I hope im right



I think I am becuz just before I edited this post, I checked on him, and his there wating around where the slugs were.

[guidofatherof5]

Slugs can move pretty fast when they want to.
I sure hope your snake ate them.;)

[katach]

I hope he ate them too!!! That would be great! If he did eat it, you can use a slug to scent other things for him to eat, like pinkies.

[katach]

Try and see if he'll take a slug from a pair of tweezers or tongs, then you'll know for sure he ate it! :)

[amcutem]

I hope he ate them too!!! That would be great! If he did eat it, you can use a slug to scent other things for him to eat, like pinkies.


Well, Im not sure I have too, since I can tell he's way fatter than he ever was. I put like atleast 5 or 6 of them in there and they're all gone..But I will still try it.

Thanks again

[katach]

If you feed just slugs you may need to get a vitamin supplement powder. That's why I switched ours over to pinkies. They still get worms and fish as treats, but pinkies are their staple because it's the most nutritionally rounded.

[kibakiba]

Actually, slugs are pretty good vitamin wise. I believe someone told me they're actually high in calcium. That's something I wouldn't have expected. I know if you gutload them with vitamin rich foods, they can be at least a little nutritionally complete.

[RedSidedSPR]

If he's eating, GREAT!! But better figure that out.

[amcutem]

If he's eating, GREAT!! But better figure that out.

Thanks to u too, redsidedspr, for all ur help and pm.

Now that I know what he'll eat, how often should i feed him?

[RedSidedSPR]

Well you're not sure, so I'd offer each day. He would be fat that way and you'd know.

But also, like mentioned above, I'd get a log pair of tongs and see if he'd eat the slug.

[amcutem]

Cool

[amcutem]

WOW!

I've jusy confirmed that he is eating. I got some slugs dangled it on his face. First he sniffs it then, BAM! He bites it then swallows it. It was sO awesome.

But then the last one i gave him was pretty big. Like 3 to 4 times as bug as his head, but he doesnt seem to care. As im typing this post, his trying to swallow the big slug.

Is it bad for him to give him big meals?


I just checked. He swallowed it, but it took like 5 minutes. Is this safe?

Also, what should I do after i just fed him? Can I hold him right away?

[katach]

That is so awesome he is eating! Congrats!

If it's that big, I'd cut it and give it to him a little at at time.

Now you can try scenting, offering other things and use a slug to scent. (just rub the slug on whatever you want them to eat.)

[kibakiba]

They are capable of swallowing things bigger than their heads, but try to keep it a bit smaller. One of my snake's jaws locked after eating a large meal, she had a really hard time getting her jaw to be back to normal.

[amcutem]

That is so awesome he is eating! Congrats!

If it's that big, I'd cut it and give it to him a little at at time.

Now you can try scenting offering other things and use a slug to scent.

But how do i know how much to feed him? Ive got another one here, but I think he ate too much already. But I also don't mind watching him eat? What should I do? Wait till tom?

How do I scent? Cut the slugs and rub it on the meal. I have frozen pinkies here? So u mean as long that it smells like a slug, he'll eat it?

After watching him eat a huge slug, maybe he can eat the whole baby pinkie.

[katach]

I feed ours 2-3 pinkies a week and sometimes a worm, or a chunk of safe fish as a snack mid week.

[RedSidedSPR]

Don't feed something that big. Only feed things that are about as big as his head or smaller.

I wouldt feed for afew days, he's had plenty of food. Wait until he's a little slimmer again.

That's awesome that he's eating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[guidofatherof5]

Glad to hear he's eating.;)

[amcutem]

Omg. U guys dnt know how happy i am. Ok maybe u do. :-)

Thanks again guys.

[amcutem]

Hi guys.

Lastnite, Michaelangello finally ate his first Pinkie mice!

All I had to do was rub a slug all over the gross cut up pinkie and with a little tricking, he ate it. I had to drag the pinkie around with tongs becuz if didnt move, he doesnt want to eat it.

But now that he's eating, he's got poop everywhere. More work for me now. How often do u guys clean ur snakes habitat?

[RedSidedSPR]

That's awesome!!

I just clean it when i see it. I have 3 babies in one cage that eat almost every day, so there's a lot to clean up.

I just pick up the bedding around it with my hands. Or the poop itself if the heat lamp has dried it.

If you have a heat lamp...

[amcutem]

Ive a normal study lamp that i shine one corner of the habitat with and it does produce heat. I dont have a proper heat lamp yet.

[RedSidedSPR]

You don't need a "proper" heat lamp. A normal lamp, with a normal 60wat bulb is all ya need. That's what i use.

[jitami]

Yay! So glad he ate for you & pinkies to boot! Nice job!

[amcutem]

What should I try and feed him next? How about chicken, pork, or beef?

[guidofatherof5]

I would stay away from the pork or beef. I don't think good chicken would be a problem.
It shouldn't be a main food source thought.
Worms would be better to get him started on.
In my opinion.

[RedSidedSPR]

Yeah, no reason to do chicken. Try worms now. Scented, or chopped with slugs.

[amcutem]

Worms?????

Are they full of nutrients or something?


Ok

[RedSidedSPR]

Well.. They can pretty much live off pinkies and worms.

[guidofatherof5]

Worms?????

Are they full of nutrients or something?


Ok

Yes they are. My wild radix population grows big and strong on a mainly worm diet.
Night crawlers are awesome.
In my opinion ;)

[ConcinusMan]

I would stay away from the pork or beef. I don't think good chicken would be a problem.
It shouldn't be a main food source.
Worms would be better to get him started on.
In my opinion.

I agree

[kibakiba]

Night crawlers are what garters here specialize in. They can live off them with very little extra.

[RedSidedSPR]

Yeah, I think they're better, and more of a staple than some people say.

[kibakiba]

Snakes here eat only worms, the only food I have ever found snakes eating is worms. There are tiny field mice that nest out in the field, but they usually nest in roofs. I don't think most snakes out here (usually finding yearlings and 2 year olds) can eat pinkies. Slugs are very hard to find, the ones with yellow slime are the ones most found. I have only found 5 striped ones since I lived here.

[RedSidedSPR]

Unless there's frogs available, I think most do.

[kibakiba]

In the summer there isn't. They're all hiding in the ground. Pacific chorus frogs really hate heat and will burrow to keep their skin moist and cool. I have to put my ice pack under the tank they're in sometimes when its hot.

[kibakiba]

Well, I guess there is, they're just harder to find. If it weren't so hard to feed them (they eat too much) I would have a few more. They really are cool frogs. I need a male.

[RedSidedSPR]

There are a LOT of frogs here in summer!

[d_virginiana]

We're totally overrun with frogs and toads here. Plus where there's several underground springs and a large creek that sort of converge here there are tons of fish, which is most of what I see the local snakes eating.

[ConcinusMan]

Unless there's frogs available, I think most do.

I can only speak from experience. Take a northwestern garter snake from a habitat far from water, or from a wetland area full of frogs and put them captivity. No difference. Both snakes seem to prefer slugs or worms.

Take a sirtalis from the same wetland habitat, or get one from somewhere else. While the northwesterns will usually ignore the frog, the sirtalis' relish them.

Doesn't seem to matter what kind of habitat the northwestern comes from. While they "get a hair up their..." every once in a while and will eat anything, they are still mainly feeding on worms and/or slugs. If you have northwesterns born in captivity, it seems they will accept with more consistency, anything you offer, especially if you offer "anything" on a continually rotating basis, starting from a couple of months old.

[RedSidedSPR]

No doubt. I wasn't really talking about NW. They werent even in my mind when I said that... garters in general do. Like you said, sirtalis. NW, the worm-lovers are an exception.

Sorry. Should have been more clear.

[kibakiba]

Well amcutem has a NW, so any other species preferences don't matter ;)

[ConcinusMan]

I was thinking it :rolleyes: Just so I'm clear, I wasn't saying all of that directed at you Jesse, I was saying it specifically because it's a northwestern that is the subject of this thread.

Since it is a wild caught, and you got it eating anything at all, consider that you just crossed quite a hurdle. In time you can try other tricks. Took me a year to get it to work on Miss Piggy, but cutting off a pinky mouse head and covering it very thoroughly in slug slime (Just irritate the slug and let slime, don't cut the slug) and try offering that to your northwestern after he's already taken a bite of slug and is all worked up into a frenzy. I know, that was kind of rambling but you get the idea.

[katach]

My WC.NW are all eating pinkies. 2 are eating unscented.

[kaseypf]

Hey this is kinda off topic but how do you post a question?

[ConcinusMan]

Hahaha very funny. How original.:rolleyes: (not) For posting any random thing, like that post, please use this thread since there is no topic there and you can talk about any random thing. That's what it's there for: http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/garter-snake-lounge/1293-its-oh-so-quiet-shh-shh.html

[amcutem]

Hi guys.

Last night I offered him worms. It was pretty tricky again to get him to eat it. I had to rub the slug all over it several times. But eventually after trying to bite the chopstick that smelled most like the slug a couple of times, he missed and took the worm. Lol.

Its true what the other guy said, he seems to love slugs but not worms. Im not sure he even ate worms before becuz he totaly didnt care for them, unlike the slugs.

Today I learned that i can make him follow his food around after he smelled it. I like watching him go vertical. :-)

Also, his more calm now, I can even kiss him and he doesnt hide. Cool

[RedSidedSPR]

Cool indeed. good job. Keep working with worms, he'll learn to like them.;)

[guidofatherof5]

Glad to hear he's doing better for you.

[d_virginiana]

Good to hear he's starting to take worms. With fall coming up it'll be getting harder to find slugs.

[ConcinusMan]

Say what? Speak for yourself. The only time I can't find slugs is if it's bone dry and 90 degrees or if it's frozen solid. In other words, I can find them 9 out of 12 months. Fall is peak season around here for two things: Slugs and mushrooms. Nice and wet and cool.

[amcutem]

I guess I should try and feed him without scenting soon.

No Slugs!!you got me woooooried again:-(

[ConcinusMan]

It's not difficult to collect a lot of slugs ahead of time before a big freeze or other expected shortage. I did so last time we had a deep freeze coming. It wasn't hard to keep them alive at 42 degrees F, in a refrigerator. They just went dormant and didn't need food. That gave me a supply of slugs to feed them during the few weeks when it was way too cold outside to find any. Just an idea. You can stretch that supply by not hurting them, but using them to "slime up" other stuff like pinkies.;)

If all else fails, cooling the snakes down to 45-50 F works too. Same thing happens. They go dormant don't need food.

[amcutem]

Um.

U want me to freeze Michaelangelo?

[RedSidedSPR]

No. Sort of brumate him... worry about that later. When it's cold out.

For now, I'd try and get him on worms, so the slugs wot have to be a main source.

Try cutting (chopping, dicing) the slugs up into little peices, and cut up a worm into tiny peices too... mix those together, and put them in dish I'm the cage.

Or just keep scenting like you did. He'll take them.

[amcutem]

I've been feeding him a few slugs every day becuz i want him to get bigger.

Can snakes over eat and become obese.

[RedSidedSPR]

Yes they can. Easily. It can be fatal...

I feed every day. Do do a few other people. But you have to do it right... I feed really little peices, and not many...

[d_virginiana]

If you feed every day, I think it's best to give mainly 'snack' foods like worms or fish pieces; stuff that digests quickly. I feed my adult every other day, but he probably gets only about one to two pinkies a week, the rest is worms and fish.
My baby gets fed every other day as well, but in reverse. She gets mostly pinky organ meat with only a few worm chunks.

I wouldn't worry about overfeeding right off the bat. Isn't it just babies that can eat themselves to death? I'd think obesity in adults would be more of a chronic problem. Right now it's probably best to just focus on getting him to take different or unscented foods. :)

[RedSidedSPR]

True, don't worry too much about that yet, but adults CAN get obese. They just wont die in one sitting, like you mentioned babies doing.

[ConcinusMan]

Even adults usually won't get obese unless they are fed a lot of fatty food such as fish. Slugs and worms are very low fat.

[amcutem]

Hi guys.

Another little update on Michaelangelo.

First, im still having a little difficulty trying to feed him anything other than slugs. Scenting seems to help, but is a little tricky.

I usually feed him every day or two some slugs and a couple of pieces of pinkie, but For some reason, i can't get him to eat enough so that there's a nice bulge in his belly.

I guess he must be health consious?

And another thing, he has shedded again today? I thought they didn't shed that often? Is he alright? Is this a good sign that he's growing?

[ConcinusMan]

Shedding often, as long as it goes well, which it sounds like he is shedding fine, is a good sign he's growing and healthy. There doesn't have to be a visible bulge if your snake is eating regularly and often like yours. Sounds like he's doing fine and getting enough to eat.:) We like to see a bulge in adult snakes that eat once or twice a week. Forget about that if your snake eats a little every day or two.

Sometimes scenting isn't enough. I told you about having to completely saturate a pinky head in slime to get one of my northwestern garters to eat it. The pinky head is about like a slug, and all slimed up, it fools her. Sometimes it's about mouth feel too. If it doesn't feel right, (too firm, too soft, too dry) they drop it.

Anyway, I don't think you have anything to worry about. Just keep doing what you're doing. You might want to start preparing for winter. If there's no food available to him, you'll have to either get a colony of them going somehow, (or collect slugs and keep them in the refrigerator before it freezes outside) or you'll have to have a place to brumate your snake.

[katach]

Sounds like he's doing great! That's good to hear! Have you tried offering an unscented pinkie? My NW started taking unscented after about the 3rd time scenting. They got used to the texture and they didn't care it didn't smell like salmon or worm, or in your case slug. You may want to try that so you have food for the winter.

[ConcinusMan]

They do tend to be "grazers". Instead of gorging on a large meal they tend to prefer eating a little, but often. Unless they're like that red striper, Miss Piggy. For her, it's a lot, often.:p

[amcutem]

Im not sure of what I did wrong, but last time i collected some slugs, they died after a couple days.

[kibakiba]

Too hot, too cold, too humid, too dry?

[ConcinusMan]

Im not sure of what I did wrong, but last time i collected some slugs, they died after a couple days.

I just put slugs in plastic container and give them a light mist to dampen them. I put only one or two very small holes in the lid so it won't dry out inside too fast. That is, almost no air circulation to the inside of the container.

Then I put them in the refrigerator and the temperature is around 5.5-6 degrees C. They just go dormant and stay alive for weeks. Too much moisture will kill them. Too dry will kill them. Just a little colder and they will die, just a little warmer and they will require food.:cool:

[kibakiba]

And if you leave them out in the weather we just had today, you get slug steak.

[ConcinusMan]

Slug Jerky in 5 minutes here. Day started around 68, rose to 85 by noon Was around 94 at around 5pm. Humidity is so low, and with the breeze, you could dry soaking wet blue jeans in the shade in less than an hour.

I know because I do it. Any opportunity to avoid using the drier ,which tends to shrink or misshape my pants, not to mention wasting electricity, is welcome.

[kibakiba]

It might have been my withdrawals, but it felt like 105 with 90% humidity in the house. Outside felt like a desert. I felt bad for the frogs, they were all in the water dish with an ice cube.

[ConcinusMan]

It does feel very desert-like out there. I'm sensitive to humidity, evaporation rate, etc. too.

It takes a lot of work, but yeah Chantel, I kept those frogs too and keeping their water cool with ice cubes will get them though it. It's not like with us, where we just sweat and it feels good to be under a fan. The evaporation keeps us cool because we sweat. Doesn't work that way with frogs because high evaporation, for obvious reasons, is not comfortable for them. Just keep up with the ice. They'll be OK. Been there, done that, same frogs. Obviously, snakes don't sweat either. A fan doesn't help them. Their "fan" is soaking in a bowl of water that is slightly cooler than anything they can find and fast evaporation rate (i.e. a "fan") only makes them want to soak even more.

[kibakiba]

Well, they were going to be food... But I do really love them ;)
I've already spent about 60 dollars on crickets and many hours after it rains trying to find worms for them. Pampered little frogs.

[ConcinusMan]

They're a PITA Chantel. But yeah, I did those for a couple of years. I had snakes and the frogs. Even though I used frogs as snake food, I had pet frogs too.;)

[kibakiba]

I wouldn't say they're a PITA, but they just eat a lot and poop faster than I can clean sometimes. They're really fun to watch and when I'm picking up the poop and cleaning them up, they occasionally bite me... Probably thinking I'm a cricket. Haha. All 3 of them are girls, I believe. Frogger is too tiny to really tell though. (S)he's about the size of my pinky nail still.

[ConcinusMan]

I wouldn't say they're a PITA,


Let me rephrase. They are high maintenance. And we are waaayyy of topic here.

[kibakiba]

Indeed. Frogs can be snake food, though, so at least its only partially off topis? :D

[PINJOHN]

Off topic! what the heck! . i love amphibs ! have enjoyed the frog talk ;)

[kibakiba]

Oh boy. I was reading my post and I thought I said "only partially off topless." I was seriously embarrassed for a second there!

[ConcinusMan]

Post a pic.:p

[kibakiba]

Not a chance. My frogs don't go topless. That would just be weird.

[amcutem]

Hi peeps. A little update on Michaelangelo :-)

Well, I guess its been a while since I found Michael and Im happy to say that he's ok and only because this forum has a lot to do with it. I don't think he would have ever survive without you peeps... I think im gonna cry:-(

Tonight is a little especial I guess...Tonight, he finaly ate a pinky without any scenting...What a relief. No more slug hunting and worrying everyday about what he's gonna eat....Im so relieved....

Other than that, he's shed atleast 4 times since I found him, but I think the first was due to stress?

He has also gotten away a few times which always makes me real upset and sad, because each time it happens, it seems like im never gonna find him; it's like finding a needle in a heystack, specially with Michael being such a small snake. But it's hard to believe they do show up again. I just hope my luck never runs out...

I bet right now, he's cooking up another plan to get out. I know, because that's all he does. He stares at the ceiling and just ponders how to get out. What an unloyal pet! I guess that's y he's a snake...

I wish I could find him a friend so he's not always trying to get out.. I saw a cool Gecko at the petshop. Can I put that inside with him?

[EasternGirl]

No...you shouldn't put a gecko in with a snake. You could only put another garter snake of the same size and gender in with him. I am wondering why he keeps getting out. What kind of enclosure do you have him in and what type of lid do you have on the enclosure?

[infernalis]

2 best things you can ever do for your snake...

1. Never put any other species of animal in the same enclosure, the Gecko will likely kill the snake.

2. secure the cage, prevention of escape is essential. What if you accidentally stepped on him while he was out exploring?

[EasternGirl]

Exactly Wayne...I am very concerned about the fact that the snake keeps getting out...if nothing else, one of these times you may not get the snake back :). Tell us what kind of lid you are using and we can help you make it more secure so that he doesn't get out anymore.

[amcutem]

I think I know how he gets out but I thought I covered that problem.


But what a coincidence, I caught him red handed yesterday, trying to get out. I took some pics and will post later..

One thing is for sure, he always does it after feeding. I guess it's because he's got energy again....

[chris-uk]

I think I know how he gets out but I thought I covered that problem.


But what a coincidence, I caught him red handed yesterday, trying to get out. I took some pics and will post later..

One thing is for sure, he always does it after feeding. I guess it's because he's got energy again....

If you caught him getting out you should be able to make the necessary adaptions to the lid to stop him doing it again. But don't assume he's only got the one option.

Knowing garter snakes... after one of his escapes he smuggled in a miniature glass cutter (secreted in his vent, maybe he's been watching prison documentaries?) and has cut a small hole near the back of the tank where you can't see it. :)

Seriously, if you need some ideas for ways to keep him in, post the pics and we can see how we can help advise on closing off the escape routes.