Garters in Europe?

[Bart]

Do you think that garters would thrive in Europe? I mean, there are lots of species from America that are considered as pests, like american crawfish that is pushing off european crawfish (cancer?). So you think that they would thrive here and push off our grass snake (Natrix natrix)?

I'm suprised, that it didn't happend already. It seems that any gravid female never fled from vivarium. :)

[guidofatherof5]

Depends on how the balance of nature shifts.

[Bart]

Well, they don't fear cold, there are a lot of fish and frogs and they have one big advantage over Natrix natrix - they are born alive, while grass snakes lay eggs.

[RedSidedSPR]

I don't doubt they COULD...

[Stefan-A]

There were stories about red-sided garters establishing a population in southern Sweden, but it appears that it was more or less a myth.

Natrix has one gigantic advantage over Thamnophis, and that is an insensitivity to thiaminase. Most of our streams and lakes are filled with cyprinids.

[PINJOHN]

i once had two red sided escape into my garden, more than a year later a neighbor spotted one of them in his garden apparently looking A ok. it happened more than fifteen years ago before i had my loft made into my reptile room i used to keep watch on my garden pond to see if they came there to feed, it contains various types of newts frogs and tadpoles but if they did i never caught sight of them, no chance of them breeding though as they were both males, my home is Liverpool England i have neighbors gardens stretching away on each side of my home but we back on to a railroad sidings so they had plenty of space to roam in.

[Bart]

There were stories about red-sided garters establishing a population in southern Sweden, but it appears that it was more or less a myth.

Natrix has one gigantic advantage over Thamnophis, and that is an insensitivity to thiaminase. Most of our streams and lakes are filled with cyprinids.


Wow, I didn't know, that grass snakes are immune to thiaminase! Are you sure about that?

[RedSidedSPR]

Not IMMUNE, just INSENSITIVE.... heck same difference.

[Stefan-A]

Are you sure about that?
Pretty sure, although I haven't seen any actual studies on the subject. It mostly comes from keepers of Natrix species and I have a fairly good idea of what types of fish they'd find.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I think natrix are just insensitive to anything bad. LOL. I swear to you, if I offered my young natrix male a piece of lead, he might eat it. Every time I walk into the room, he ZOOMS up front and SMUSHES his little face against the glass sideways, with his mouth open and his tongue all rubbing on the glass and stuff. Like a dog!

[RedSidedSPR]

Ok that is just weird....

[Bart]

Well, Stefan, to be honest, I thought they just have diet diverse enough not to worry about thiaminase. I mean they eat mostly frogs and only sometimes fish - and frogs are just as good food as mice.

[snakehill]

I think natrix are just insensitive to anything bad. LOL. I swear to you, if I offered my young natrix male a piece of lead, he might eat it. Every time I walk into the room, he ZOOMS up front and SMUSHES his little face against the glass sideways, with his mouth open and his tongue all rubbing on the glass and stuff. Like a dog! Maybe he just thinks you're cute!!! lol :D

[kibakiba]

Snakey does that when I'm holding Mama. It's like he goes into a trance. It's so cute, though.
If you open the top, he'll come out and rest on the tank top or climb onto my hand.