Pheobe my Eastern Garter

[Mrs N1ntndo]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Pheobe_our_eastern_garter_snake_caught_the_middle_ of_june_2011.jpg

This is my Eastern Garter snake. I dont know how how old she is. How am I able to tell. Sorry about the water spots. Its from misting or pour water on her, which she loves both. She is pregnant but I dont know how far along. Shes a little over 3 foot long and because shes pregnant shes about the size around of a 50 cent peice. Shes gonna shed again in the next day or 2 . Her eyes were fogged for about 3 days and they cleared up today. Like I said Id like to know how Im sopposed to tell how old she is. Oh, along both sides of the center stripe on her back is skinny red lines. They look soo much wider now beacause of pregnancy. How long are they pregnant for and how do they act right before having babies. She has gotten more aggressive for a little over 2 weeks now maybe a cpl days longer. Anything that you can tell me will be awesome. Thank you all and Im glad I found these forums cause everyone is soo nice. Thanks all.

[ssssnakeluvr]

only way to tell is to raise it from birth. nice looking snake too!!!

[RedSidedSPR]

Awesome snake!!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Thank you all... Is there any signs right before she has her babies because Ive only seen babies when I woke up or somthing but never at the time of being born.

[RedSidedSPR]

From what I know, theres no real way to know. You can tell she's gravid, and can often tell if it will be soon, but mostly it's just waiting. Theres stuff you can do, but really I don't know what and can't help....

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I am assuming gravid means ready but I dont know all these terms everyone is using like gravid, het... And I cant remember some of the others. Is there a spot in a forum that has all those term cause Ive tried to look for them a couldnt find anything.
Thank you for helping though. Anything right now people say is like new. I thought I knew kindof a lot but realized tht I dontknow as much as I thought. I know how to keep them alive and thats awesome but I didnt really now much else I guess...lol. Thank u

[RedSidedSPR]

Well, gravid means pregnant.

Het means it carries the gene or something, so the snake can be normal, but if bred will produce whatever its het for.

Het albino, means he'd produce some albinos, but doesn't have to be one.

My flame is het erythristic, so he's a flame, but if I bred him, id have some ery babies.

Something like that. :rolleyes:

No, there's nowhere i know of to look them up. Just ask. ;)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

well you learn something new everyday. Thank you very much. In the past few days sence Ive been in these forums Ive learned tons and I love it. So interesting. So when Pheobe has her babies and some look different then its probably because of the Het. Right? When the babies are born I will deff take lots of photos and post them. Im hoping to get atleast one with more red or the all tan one one of my past snakes have had before. I woulda kept the tan but I didnt know how to raise the babies. In the past few days Ive learned so much about that and I am pretty sure it will work out. Im not going to keep all but about 2-3 to start and let the rest go. I dont want to over well myself with to many the first time trying it. I also know that if I have any questions that the people here are very helpful and quick at responding. I love tht. Thank you

[RedSidedSPR]

Uh... Well.. Sorta. I don't know the details on hets and stuff.

Babies really aren't hard to keep. If you were to keep them all, I'd just keep them like you two, but offer more food.

Your other thread has info on that....

[Mrs N1ntndo]

ok thank you.

[d_virginiana]

Just out of curiosity, how long is she? Might just be the pic but she looks like a monster! Very nice snake.

[RedSidedSPR]

She looks of decent size....

[Mrs N1ntndo]

How do I post pics in here?

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Shes a little over 3 feet long. Once I figure out how to post the pics then I will put some in here but until then I have pics of her in my albumn in my profile.

[RedSidedSPR]

How do I post pics in here?

From the forums gallery? Your album? You click the picture and underneath you highlight the IMG code, or BBM code, (I don't know which i use photobucket) and than copy it, and paste it here

[Selkielass]

Hello and Welcome!
I'm in Michigan too- over in Macomb county, NE of Detroit.
The Butlers garters in my area are starting to give birth- baby season is definitely upon us.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Im going to try now . I know I cant wait. I know she needs to shed but hasnt done it yet. Eyes were cloudy for 3 days and cleared up early early yesterday morn and shes just laying there now. Hasnt shed yet. How long b4 giving birth do the stop eating. Cause yesterday she ate 1 crawling when she normilly eats 3-4 at a time. Even when she is getting ready to shed she still eats something .

[guidofatherof5]

Not eating isn't a good judge of birth time with some snakes.
I have some that eat on birthing day and shortly before they finish giving birth.
My girls usually get restless before giving birth.
They keep on the move and can't seem to get comfortable anywhere.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I know the gravel isnt good and I gotta wait for my check and things will be changing. This is Pheobe's whole body to show how big she is.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Pheobe_pic_3_Her_whole_body_July_19_2011.jpg

This is Pheobe's tail to show a closer view of that. Let me know what you think please.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Pheobe_pic_4_Her_tail_July_19_2011.jpg

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Thank you. I watch her all the time to make sure everything is good. Is there a chance that a snake can still give birth before shedding . Also do they ever give birth in water?

[guidofatherof5]

I have never had a snake give birth in water but I guess it's possible.:confused:

[RedSidedSPR]

Probably not likely though...

[kibakiba]

Mama was laying in the water when she gave birth to the baby she ran over. I had soft glass pebbles in the water in case she did, so yeah... But she killed the poor little guy.

[RedSidedSPR]

That sucks... :(

[kibakiba]

Yeah, he was really frail looking and barely out of the membrane, honestly, even if he lived, it wouldn't be for long.

[RedSidedSPR]

Well, guess that's a good thing. You know, that it was him, rather than another

[Mrs N1ntndo]

i hate when any die. Its so sad.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Well I am here to report one thing . No babies yet.... Bummer :( but she shed yay. Oh man shes pretty. Also I have pics...yay.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/After_shed.jpg

This is how she sheds. It looks so awesome to watch her transform basically in front of you.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/In_water_for_her_shed.jpg

Here she is shedding still. Looks awesome.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Look_at_her_So_pretty_.jpg

I have a pic of all of her after she shedd but for some reason it wont upload . But heres a cpl

[RedSidedSPR]

Beautiful.! Nice pictures. I've personally never witnesses my snakes shedding. They all all do it in like 10 seconds. :D

[guidofatherof5]

You are right. She's very pretty.;)

[ConcinusMan]

Babies really aren't hard to keep.

Obviously you've never attempted to keep a litter of newborns.:rolleyes: They are a lot of work and can sometimes be a real PITA.


I know the gravel isnt good and I gotta wait for my check and things will be changing.

In the mean time, newspaper would be a better solution. Keep a hide with moist paper towels in it, handy for the babies when they do come. They'll need a moist place.

[RedSidedSPR]

I only meant the individual care isn't that much harder than adult. I know it would be hard to keep a whole litter.

[snakehill]

I only meant the individual care isn't that much harder than adult. I know it would be hard to keep a whole litter. Disagree with that!!!:o

[RedSidedSPR]

Don't start :rolleyes:

[Mrs N1ntndo]

heres some of Pheobe right after shed. she shed on 7-20-2011
No babies yet. But she hasnt eaten yet either. I cut up a worm thinking maybe its cause she didnt want a full one and I have it by her so hopefully she will eat. Its on a lid in the tank so she can go to when she wants. I just hope that when I go to to wheresgeorge gathering on July 30th. which will be all day. I hope she does ok. I now food wize she will cause she still ate not to long ago but her eating still changed but as for the babies.


This a pretty pic of her colors after shedding.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/Close_up_of_Pheobe_and_her_colors.jpg

heres a full body pic after the shed.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Day_after_shed_Beautiful.jpg

This is a pic from the day before she shed but had to show you cause its awesome.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Pheobe_before_shed_7-19-2011.jpg

[snakehill]

Very pretty! Love her name!:)

[RedSidedSPR]

Ok. There is not doubt in my mind that beast is gravid. HUGE!! and beautiful. Nice pics.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Thank you all. Her named came from the fact that I love the show Friends. I know shes gonna have her babies soon I just dont know when...lol

This is how Pheobe on Friends spells her name out loud....
P as in Pheobe
H as in heebee
E as in eebee
O as in Ohbee
B as in beebee
E as in Eloh there mate

I love it...lol

[snakehill]

Pheobe was my favorite character on the show!:D

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Phoebe was my favorite character on the show!:D

Shes one of mine too. I love her being weird and her clothes are cool . I just couldnt pull off some of those combos that she wears.

[snakehill]

I used to! Back in the seventies!:p

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I used to! Back in the seventies!:p

I was born in 1977 so I wore what my mom put on me....lol I did have some weird combos in grade school though...lol

[ConcinusMan]

By '77 I was already decked out in green cordoroy bell bottom pants and the kind of shirts that... well, just watch "That 70's show". They're not kidding about the clothes. That's what "cool" looked like. Seriously.

[brain]

well, just watch "That 70's show".

:D yes I can remember :D... hideous looking:o. But, then I did think I was Hyde:cool:

[Mrs N1ntndo]

By '77 I was already decked out in green cordoroy bell bottom pants and the kind of shirts that... well, just watch "That 70's show". They're not kidding about the clothes. That's what "cool" looked like. Seriously.

i loved that show. I wish it didnt end.

Well I stayed the night at my mom and dads and the night before we left one of our kitts took off. He did it b4 last year but he was gone for 2 days. I hope he comes home soon.

On another note Pheobe is still pregnant. Hope she doesnt have the babies while Im gone but at the same time it would be a great surprise. Im just hopeing that I can watch the births. I always wake up to thm already born and moveing all over the tank. I will for sure be taking lots of pics. I cant wait. I tried to feed her again before I left and she didnt want anything. I even tried cuttting a worm in small pieces but it didnt work either. I know they go through there thing but its just weird exspecialy sence I havent had ANY of my garters do it. Ill keep you all updated.

[kibakiba]

Any way you could set up a birthing cam? I wanted to do that with Mama, but she had them unexpectedly ;)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I dont have the money for that but I wish. I have a web cam but i dont know how to record video with it. That is a good idea. I could see if i can record when I get home and am able to get to comp to try . Good idea. Thank you.

[Venti]

Hopefully you get a nice bunch of babies from her :)
My snake acted very strange for three days before she gave birth, like tearing out all of her plants and draping her whole body over her hide, something she never did before. I didn't even know she was gravid then, so hopefully it means she is a little while from giving birth, so you can watch her have her babies :)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I hope so. I am going to be staying at my mom and dads again tonight but i wanna go check to see if my kitty came and also check on her. Wish me luck.

[RedSidedSPR]

Ok. Good luck. Now what?

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I hope so. I am going to be staying at my mom and dads again tonight but i wanna go check to see if my kitty came and also check on her. Wish me luck.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Well we got home yesterday and no babies yet. But last night she started to do more draping on things and when she would drape it wouldnt be for long cause there was more constant moving. She would move around the tank and suddenly stop with her neck extended and almost like she would freeze. when she would do that it would be for a couple minutes at a time. I put a new hide in there which she likes. she still is drinking but no eating still sence right before her shed. She likes to dig around in the tank a lot. that part isnt anything new but had to tell ya anyway. Do you think these things happening more often means its closer to time. Man , I want her to have her babies soon but Im hoping taht it isnt till after our trip. Thankfully our little trip is only a day. How long will they be acting weird before the babies come. Im so excited to see what the babies will look like. What colors? How much of those colors? Yay... cant wait.

Id also like to say again thank you alll for helping out soo much . I have learned so much stuff from this forum and I love it.

I have another question about hides. I know I can use the shell part to a coconut but I was wwondering ....
1) what would be the best way to open it with out losing the milk, and messing up the shell.
2) do i need to do anything to the shell before putting it in there. please help

my mom said I can use a hammer and nail to open it but I havent had fresh cocnut since I was a kid so I dont know much about the opening process exspecailly since I want to keep the shell.

[guidofatherof5]

I think if you freeze the halves the meat will break out much easier.
Heating the shell 220 for 30 minutes should give you peace of mind.
Drill a hole in it. The milk will not mess anything up.
Heating and drilling might be things you should probably get permission to do. Not sure of your age.;)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I am 33 years old. I have kids and married also. So I would first break ito or drill it. Cause I want the milk too. so Im assuming I would drill it . But as for breaking it so it makes the halves not break all weird what would be the best way to split it. I understand the freezing part to get the meat out and thanks I will do that. I just dont want to domolish the shell when splitting it. thats all.
my 13 year old looked in the frig and saw the coconut and asked me" mom, what is that thing that looks like a ball of hay" lol... that was so funny so I had to tell you all. I did tell her what is was and she even laughed at what she said.


as for the bedding and I know I asked you Steve but as you said I should get the opion of the people here and I will do that too. I still have to look up the sites that you gave me for the bedding you use but right now I dont have the money so if this stuff will work that I have that would be awesome.

I have a brick of Coco- fiber potting soil. Its the same size as a brick but it says to put it in 5 liters of water and it will expand 8x( making over 2 gallons of growing Medium) its 100% coconut palm fiber.free from weed seeds and pathogens.. It also says Expanded compost has excellent water-holding capacity , while maintaining porosity and air circulation. 100% organic and natural. No artificial or chemical ingrediants. I need to know if this bedding would be good to use for Pheobe. not only to have for in the tank but could I feed her on it also.

[kibakiba]

You know the 3 little spots on the coconut? Drill a hole in those and pour the milk out, then saw it in half when its empty

[RedSidedSPR]

YES, daggone it, i was half way through typing that!! :D

[Mommy2many]

Not quick enough...:D

[RedSidedSPR]

Well, i was working with two tabs...

[Mrs N1ntndo]

You know the 3 little spots on the coconut? Drill a hole in those and pour the milk out, then saw it in half when its empty

so I can just use any saw or what? just asking. and thank you fo helping

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Now back to the coco-bedding. I have seen in a cpl places on here and places elsewhere online that it is ok to use. which is awesome but I dont know how much I should make up of the brick because I dont know how deep to make it. she like to dig so Im taking it she will try to burrow and thats fine but I have a 20 gallon take and I dont know how thick to have the coco-fiber and I dont know how long it will take after putting it in the tank to dry. any help you have I will listen. thank you

[RedSidedSPR]

I'm able to take a needle nosed pliers, ad just poke them out.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Are you talking about the 3 spots RedSidedSPR?

[kibakiba]

It should be clean if you plan on eating it, but I'm sure any saw that's sharp and strong enough can do the job.

[RedSidedSPR]

Are you talking about the 3 spots RedSidedSPR?

I think... Those three circles on the top? Yeah.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

It should be clean if you plan on eating it, but I'm sure any saw that's sharp and strong enough can do the job.

Ya I do plan on eating it and sence i would be useing it on food I would make sur it was clean..lol thank you I am sure that when I do this encloser the way it should be Pheobe will loooove it. Thank you all for all the help and support.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I think it will be soon for her cause for the past hour she has been trying to burrow a lot more then she ever has. shes trying to do it everywhere in the tank.

My husband is picking up today.. paper towels so we can be more prepared when babies come and another spray bottle so that it works better then the one we have. also he is going to see what kind of fake plant type things are there too.

As for the coconut ..it has an easy breakway so that its going to be easier then I thought to break it.

I dont know if this is a stupid question or not but tuna... is it ok for Pheobe. Dont worry I havent given any to her but I was thinking of things the other day and I have tuna in water in the can and I dont know if thats ok. Im just wondering. If it isnt ok then can you please tell me why so that if I see someone asking Im able to give them a reason also. thank you

[guidofatherof5]

No tuna as a rule.
High sodium content and it's processed.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

ok thank you

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I saw that salmon is good for them so what if it is salon in a can with water? just wondering. Thank you.

[RedSidedSPR]

No tuna. No catfood. :D

[guidofatherof5]

I saw that salmon is good for them so what if it is salon in a can with water? just wondering. Thank you.

No canned salmon also.

[kibakiba]

It needs to be fresh salmon, as in unsalted filleted salmon.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Ok thank you. I didnt give her any but I was wanting to ask.

UPDATE... Still no babies and Im actully kinda glad cause I have that gathering tomorrow and if they even come tonight it would be ok cause it is just one day I will be gone. Now she is trying to dig everywhere and all the time. So much more then normal. for the past 3 days shes been doing that and each day seems like shes been doing it more and more. she is a digger anyway but now she almost does it all the time. I havent done the coconuts yet but I did find an awesome hide. My girls drink Caprisuns all the time and last night I was needed to put something else in there cause what we did have in there just wasnt doing good. I knew I needed something stiffer. I grabbed the Caprisun box and shortened it and where the hole is on the side i made the hole bigger so that she can climb in and out and I also put a hole on the top. Its strong and thick cardboard and she seems to love it. Itll last longer and Im always getting the boxes so I know Ill have plenty when I need to change it.

QUESTION.... her hood is brighter in color now( I noticed it yesterday evening) and not as flush to the rest of her body like it was . also by her hood her body isnt as smooth down as in you can see that its wider there then it was. Are those signs of her being close. I would say it might mean she need to go to the bathroom but it hasnt changed even after her going potty. any suggestions as in is it close or..... Are there any more signs like physical signs to show shes close? She also seems a little more anxious then normal.

Thank you and I hope to hear something soon. Talk to you all later.

[guidofatherof5]

She may yell things like "Don't touch me" :D

[Mrs N1ntndo]

She may yell things like "Don't touch me" :D

She already started that for the most part about 2 weeks ago. All that she will let me do now is I can reach in the tank and rub her body with my finger.

Will garters get like an speed thing goin like right now pheobe is all over the tank and is faster then normal. she just started this about 30 min ago and she hasnt moved like that in 2-2.5 months since I got her. Its like she trying to hurry about something. Did your snakes ever do that?

[RedSidedSPR]

Well, I don't know much about this stuff, but I'd say it's gonna be soon. =)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Also heres naother question. Do garters give birth just laying flat on the bottom of the tank or can they do it draping or hanging around on things. Just wondering?

[RedSidedSPR]

Probably won't ever do it dangling...

[guidofatherof5]

My will wander and rarely sit still.
Not in a hurry, just not able to get comfortable.

Never had an up high delivery. Always the bottom of the enclosure.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Well, I don't know much about this stuff, but I'd say it's gonna be soon. =)

It would seem like that huh. :D:D Im so happy and very excited. I find myself staring at hear for hours. 1 reason is because I dont wanna miss it and 2 is because she is amazing. Theres something about her that no one would understand other than the snake people like us. shes awesome just to look at all the time even if shes just laying there doing nothing but breathe. I love it.

[RedSidedSPR]

I love watching my babies climb all over place like a klutz. :D so I get it.

Like Steve said, they often get restless before it...

[Mrs N1ntndo]

My will wander and rarely sit still.
Not in a hurry, just not able to get comfortable.

Never had an up high delivery. Always the bottom of the enclosure.

shes like that and has been for a few days now.

She just now decide to stop and relax but I dont know for how long.lol she is inside her box and looking out into the living room. she like to do that. that is also why I am glad I put the big opening to that side.
Also for htat the last couple days her breathing has changed some. faster at points and then slows down. still not eating even though I have been offering it to her. still lots of tongue ficking and when I was looking in the tank last night I had my face close to the lid and she came all the way to the top( I didnt wanna move and make her jump) and when she got to the top its like she kissed me....lol. flicked her tongue and ticked my lip...lol shes always going to the top all the time but not while I was close to the lidlike that.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I love watching my babies climb all over place like a klutz. :D so I get it.

Like Steve said, they often get restless before it...

I like to see that too. when we had our 90 gallon tank a long time ago with our 6 garters in it and then one morning we were surprised with 200 babies and seeing them all every where. it was sure fun trying to catch them all....lol

[RedSidedSPR]

200? Really? Awesome!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I was watching her and I think that she is getting ready right now to have her babies
slow loving botton of tail from a lil above hood and down and just laying there. I hope this is what is is and not poop...lol Wish me luch

[guidofatherof5]

I have to ask. You refereed to it a couple of times "hood"
I think I know what you mean but want to make sure.;)

[RedSidedSPR]

Wondering the same thing...

[Mrs N1ntndo]

sorry trying to learn snake lingo.......lol

WAHOO.... The stork arrived. I will have pics later cause Im doing this up date for u from my phone. But here ya go. There were 8 still borns, 1 slug ( it think thts the name for it) and about 25 live babies(ill have final count later for u)
i have a little story for 2 of the babies i would to tell but will have to wait til Im on comp so tht I can type faster.
Steve u have my skype so tht if u would like u can skype me and I can tell u there.
Eeven though she had her babies and thts what led me to this site I will cont. To be on here and keep u all updated on the babies. Thanks again for all ur help. YAY PHEOBE

[Mrs N1ntndo]

200? Really? Awesome!

yes really. That was a combo of 3 mamas giving birth at same time. It was crazy but so freaking awesome.

[RedSidedSPR]

That's awesome!! Glad that went well! What do you plan to do with the babies?

[guidofatherof5]

Congrats on the babies.;)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

well Im keeping three for sure but I might keep a fourth. I have to let the others go because in MI youre aloud to only have m garters total.

I cant post the pics from my phone but I uploaded 2 pics onto my pics in my profile. So u can look there. 1 pic is of 3 of the babies im keeping and the other pic is of the 25 survivors right after Pheobe got done having them.

Im going to be taking half that brick of coco-fiber and expanding it for Pheobe. Them Im going to do her tank before I need to leave early early tomorrow. Im doing her tank tonight. Shell be soooo happy.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Congrats on the babies.;)

Thank you. Im happy. Also thanks for the talk on the phone tht helped a lot

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I told you all that I would put the pics in here when I get to the comp and here they are. I hope that you enjoy them. I do have more put I have to put them in my album later.

These are 3 pics of b4 the baby, then during the birth and them after coming out.Sorry for the water marks on tank
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Right_b4_baby_born.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Baby_half_way_out.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Baby_all_the_way_out.jpg

This is of all the babies after Pheobe was done giving birth. The was a total of 23 live babies, I think it was 8 still borns and 1 slug( if thats what the name is..sorry
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/About_25_live_babies_Pheobes_in_tank.jpg

This is of the first three I am keeping . I now will have 7 babies. 5 are mine and Im raising the other 2 for my mom until there eating good.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/The_3_youngsters_im_keeping.jpg

I will put more pics on of all that I have now on later when they are transfered onto the computer.

[guidofatherof5]

Good shots.
Sweet babies.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I forgot to tell you all. I changed the bedding in Pheobes encloser to the coco-fiber and she is loving it. Digging and moving the things around to the way she wants them. when I took out all the other stuff and wen to pick up the smaller rocks that are in there, I noticed that she had arranged them into a square. It was weird.

Also I have noticed that all but 2/7 of her babies have the same upper body strength as there mama because streching up so far without any assistance from anything. the other 2 are very docile and thats ok with me.

When do I move the babies from a paper towel bedding to the same as Pheobe (coco-fiber). Is ok to put then in with her sence they are still small or should I still keep them in the 10 gal that they are in now.

I did the coconut for the encloser and I froze it like suggested to get the meat out in bigger pieces but after it is froze what the heck do I use or how do I get it out...lol

[katach]

Congrats!! Great looking babies!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Good shots.
Sweet babies.

Thank you. I thought the pics were good other then the water spots.Im glad they can be seen good and Im glad I was able to get them. I have more but I gotta see what they look like on the computer before I post them . I hope they look good so that I can post them too.

Thanks again for the help on the suggestion for the lid. I was worried at first on what I would do and it worked perfect.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Congrats!! Great looking babies!

Thank you.

[RedSidedSPR]

Nice pics! They're awesome

[guidofatherof5]

Thanks again for the help on the suggestion for the lid. I was worried at first on what I would do and it worked perfect.

Not a problem. Glad to help.:)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I forgot to tell you somthing else. I let go of the other babies and I let them go over by my house. THeres this wooded section by our house that also has a lake by it. So not only do they have a wide area to play and go on there on but theres fresh water out there too. I know theyll like it and I felt bad cause I wanted to keep them all but I couldnt cause of money, room, and laws. but I feel better now cause I know they will be fine.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Not a problem. Glad to help.:)

Im glad theres people like you that can help cause I didnt know enough to take care of these cuties and I have to still learn more but I know enough now to get strted and you all better bet if I have another question I know where to go. This site Rocks!!!!!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Well I got the pics on the computer that I took a couple days ago and I have to say that Im proud of these pics. I had read in a thread that a good way to get close up pics is to just take a lot and see what happens and I found out that the setting for close up things would work good. I have tried it before but I tried it a little differently this time and these are some of my results. I love these and these are awesome pics.I was bad at tongue shots but OMG this is awesome and I even got moore then this one.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5953.JPG
I think that she is tring to say cheese. she just got done with eating a big crawler.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5950.JPG
Another great tongue flick.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5946.JPG
This is right before finishing her worm
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5949.JPG

THis is almost a once in a lifetime shot and this is deffinately my favorite pic that Ive ever taken.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5948.JPG

[Mrs N1ntndo]

These are some of the 7 that I still kept. 5 are mine and 2 are my moms. She wants me to make sure they are eating good before she takes them. So you all know they are eating and everything is looking wonderful. I have hides in the babies tank now(just put awesome ones in today) but they still have the papertowel down on the bottom. I want to make sure there bigger before using anything ele. I hope you like these pics and dont worry I have a lot more I just want to put these on now cause its late/early...lol its almost 4am here. But anyway these pics are taken right about feeding time.I hope that you will enjoy. i do.Oh and the date is wrong at the bottom of the pic. THese were taken on 7-3-2011
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5835.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5837.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5849.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5824.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5834.JPG

[ScimitarX]

awesome pics, those babies are pretty :)

[RedSidedSPR]

Nice shots!! I've still never gotten agood toungue shot!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Thank you all. I like these pics a lot and Im glad that I got to show you Pheobe like I see her. The colors and everything cmae out soo well and thats what I was hopeing for.


Nice shots!! I've still never gotten agood toungue shot!

Like I heard on other forum and Im sorry that I forgot who said it but you put your camera on the flower setting( the one for closeups) and I turn the flash part on cause it shows better but Im also inside so it helps. Also just keep ajusting the distance that you are away from your subject and the view up closer with the lens. I hadnt taken any good pics of the tongues until this batch of pics. Up until now they were all blurry. The same person who said how do do the pics also said ( and I very much agree...lol) for about every 10 pics you keep 30 will probably be deleted.

[RedSidedSPR]

Trust me I know. I fill my memory card (200 pictures) every day, and only keep 20 or so. Their good, but have never gotten the toungue like that. Your "flower setting" is called macro. From my experience outside is better, the cameras shutter speed increases.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I would love to take pics of Pheobe outside but with her being a recent WILD catch she scoot away and quick. I fill my SD card a lot too...lol but its fun. I love taking random pics sometimes cause you dont know what to get. try this mode if you havent. I dont know what exactly its called but it takes 3 pics with just one push of the button. I love that one too .
Im hoping that since these babies are going to be with me from the start that when they get older i can take them outside for pics. I would like to try to be in the contest for this month but I cant cause I cant take Pheobe out and just set her down.
Any suggestions to how I would do this with her? I can take her out which I do but I cant just set her down. Its quite a bummer. 1 of the babies I might name Pozer cause I swear that when Im taking pics of the babies he/she tilts their head like a dog saying" what you doing" and does that all the time as if he/she was posing for pics. Its cut. I have a blurry one of that which i will show you and its cute.

This is Pozer posing for the camera which he/she always does. Its cute
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/109_5846.JPG

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I know that the paper towel was too wet but they had all decided to play i the water and I know I shoulda takin pics of that but wasnt thinking at the time cause it was so cute to watch. They ended up spilling it. I took care of it but it was cool watching them. It was almost liket hey were playing tag. It was great.

[Mommy2many]

Congratulations on all of the squiggles!

[katach]

They are great! Congrats!!

[Mrs N1ntndo]

thank you . Ok ive heard so many names for baby garters. So what are all the names they are called. Just curious.

[kibakiba]

When mine were born, I just called them by what they looked like. Pumpkin was orange like a pumpkin (and smelt like baked pumpkin seeds), Silver is silvery... Speckles, Spots, and Dots(now Azul) had lots of dots and spots all over them. I decided to keep Azul, so of course I named him something different, as a new permanent name.

[katach]

Scrubs? Squiggles? That kind of thing?

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Cool I have already named 2 of mine and they are nutruel names . Theres Pozer which likes to pose for pics(no joke) also Pozer does something I forgot to tell you all which I think is kinda cool. Pozer likes to look at you sometimes upside down like if Pozer is on one side of the tank and I open it he( i dont know the sex but Im gonna say boy right now cause he looks like one, but im not sure)tiltes his head back to look at me almost every time. also what he like to do is sometimes when Im holding him he will do that too and when I put put him back in his tank he like to slither backwards off my hand so that he is on his back for only about 2-5 seconds and then flip himself back over. I know they dont normally do that so I call him a joker. then I have one I say is a girl but again I dont know for sure but I call her Sweetpea cause she was the 3rd one I decided to keep cause when I reached in the tank to get her after being born she was so calm and came right to me and she sits calm in my hand all the time I have her out and if she moves she almost seems so elegant. Shes such a sweetie pie. So i call her that sometimes too but mainly sweetpea. Shes also one of the 2 I think that are just different shades of tan right now.I hope she stays like that. That would be cool.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Scrubs? Squiggles? That kind of thing?

thank u

[kibakiba]

Honestly, it's not normal for any snake to slither on it's back. Some of mine will slither slightly on the side after falling off a branch, but they should be slithering right side up.

[katach]

You're welcome.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Honestly, it's not normal for any snake to slither on it's back. Some of mine will slither slightly on the side after falling off a branch, but they should be slithering right side up.

Its not often just somtimes coming off my hand onto the papertowel. He doesnt do it any other time. He eats fine and slithers fine and is fatting up like the others and acts fine. lots of tongue flicking like normal.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Well here it goes. The other day I posted either in here or in another thread that I hadnt gotten bitten by Pheobe yet. Well Im here to say that yesterday I was bitten by her. It was feeding time and I was getting ready to hand her her 3rd worm and when I lifted the lid to give it to her she launched and got the tip of my middle finger. I dont remember who said that it felt like sand paper but hers didnt at all. Maybe when the snakes are smaller they do but hers sure didnt. I got bit but her good. Just a small amount of blood and it scared the crap out of me,lol. Only cause it shocked me. Im not afraid of her all but man it still stings. Ive been bitten by smaller garters before and yes those felt like sand paper but man she deffinately stuck a fang or 2 in me and when she realeased it her fang drug on my skin. I dont understand why it would still stings though. to me it feels like I had a splinter and when you take it out it still stings. I just had to tell oyu all that news.

Well I also want to update you on the babies. There all doing welll from what it looks like. Still lots of tongue flicking and lots of moving around. But i do have some questions though. I know that a few are eating cause ive seen them eat but when I leave the worms in the tank after to make sure that all do theres always a few extras gone when I come back but Im no tsure who is eating them. last night I saw 1 baby eat and then I decided to put all in dishes and a piece of worm and left them there for a while and none ate any. Im trying to figure out which ones i need to watch more for eating but I cant figure out all that are for sure eating to watch. How long am I able to leave them in the containers before putting them back into there encloser. Also how much do I feed all them, like when do I actully say stop. even with Pheobe do I let her eat til she decides to stop or what do I do. I believe I had more questions but at this moment Im not able to remember them...lol so If I figure them out I will come back to post them.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Here is the other question I had. I am looking around to find a good nice spot to buy pinkies so that I can start feeding these to my snakes. I havent found one that sells them frozen or anthing yet but I found a spot that sell them live and they are $1.10 a peice. A) Is that a good price cause I trust this place but Ive never bought pinkies before. B) when I get them live do i just stick them in the freezer or what I dont what to do for any of that. I dont know how to prepare. I know for Pheobe I would juse defrost and give them to her but what about for the babies. how do I do any of that. I would like to know step by step if possible cause I dont wanna mess this up and if some of these babies just dont want worms and will eat pinkies Im going to do it. Ive done awesome so far and my hubby thinks its cool that Im not only having a blast with raising these guys but that Ive done so well and havent lost any. Im happy too cause this is the first time raising babies and yes they are more work them Pheobe but I think also thats a reason why it is so much fun. Please help ... thank you and I hope to here something soon. Also to remind you the babies were born the 29th of July.

[guidofatherof5]

A- That's a good price compared to some Pet Shops. I usually buy them for around .08-14 cents a piece ordered from Mice Direct. Then the shipping has to be factored in per mouse. That cost all depends on how many I order.
Sorry if this isn't very helpful.

B-You will have to freeze them first or feed them alive. Frozen/thawed is the best way to go, if your willing to do that.
I thaw pinkies in hot water. Then I use a good sharp pair of scissors and cut them into small chunks. It can get messy but after a few times it's much easier.
I thaw in hot water to up the moisture content of the pinkies. I have tried to air thaw but found the pinkies were sometimes too dry. Some of my snakes didn't like the feel of the dried feet and legs.
I then feed the parts to the babies with a pair of hemostats. After a few times they jump right in and feed themselves, other then the ones who want to be hand fed.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

A- That's a good price compared to some Pet Shops. I usually buy them for around .08-14 cents a piece ordered from Mice Direct. Then the shipping has to be factored in per mouse. That cost all depends on how many I order.
Sorry if this isn't very helpful.

B-You will have to freeze them first or feed them alive. Frozen/thawed is the best way to go, if your willing to do that.
I thaw pinkies in hot water. Then I use a good sharp pair of scissors and cut them into small chunks. It can get messy but after a few times it's much easier.
I thaw in hot water to up the moisture content of the pinkies. I have tried to air thaw but found the pinkies were sometimes too dry. Some of my snakes didn't like the feel of the dried feet and legs.
I then feed the parts to the babies with a pair of hemostats. After a few times they jump right in and feed themselves, other then the ones who want to be hand fed.

First how many do you buy to get them at that price.

Second.. How long do they last in the freezer and how/what should I store them in?

3rd.. I have a pair of those kinds of scissors that cut thru bones and things like that that are really sharp and Ive been using them to cut the worms cause its not as messy as using a knife. How big should the pieces be especailly sence the babies are still so young.

[guidofatherof5]

First how many do you buy to get them at that price.

Second.. How long do they last in the freezer and how/what should I store them in?

3rd.. I have a pair of those kinds of scissors that cut thru bones and things like that that are really sharp and Ive been using them to cut the worms cause its not as messy as using a knife. How big should the pieces be especailly sence the babies are still so young.


For me they don't last very long. Never had any here longer then 8 months.
I store them in the same bag they come to me in.
Maybe another member can comment on how long they will stay usuable in a freezer.

I cut the head in about 3 pieces. I remove all 4 legs at the shoulder a try to include as much muscle as possible. The tail is one piece.
Then I just dice up the rest into a bunce of small chunks.
Hope this helps.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Thank you so much and I will deffinatly try this when i get them. I thank you again for the help. You are usually the first person I think about when wanting a question answered. Everyone though is so very helpful and again I love that about these forums. My check will be coming in soon and that is when I will be ordering some. They order there stuff every tues. and get them on Wednesday so itll probably be next week.

Have you gotten live ones and then froze them or have you only gotten frozen ones. I know I will feel kinda bad at the beginning just taken a live creature and sticking them in my freezer but I know that its for my snakes . I know it will get easier but Ive never done it before so thats why the feelings. I wont cry or anything...lol but I know you all should understand. Thanks again

[ConcinusMan]

First how many do you buy to get them at that price.


You have to spend small fortune and buy hundreds. For example, $16 at mice direct for a bag of 100 mice sounds great and you save a few pennies per mouse when you order more. However, go to calculate shipping and that $16 bag of mice would cost me about $132 or $1.32 per mouse. Local mouse breeders here charge around $1 or little less for each pinky:cool: I'd have to order a heck of a lot of them online to close that price gap. It's pretty much the same story anywhere. Nobody is paying 12-16 cents per mouse that you see online. Unless you need about a thousand of them and can pay all that at once, forget about it.

[katach]

Second.. How long do they last in the freezer and how/what should I store them in?



Mice direct says they last about 12mo in the freezer as long as you keep air out of the bags as much as possible.

[ConcinusMan]

"as much as possible" really translates to "almost none". Air is the enemy when freezing any food. If they're vacuum sealed with no air pockets, they'll last 1-2 years. Bottom line is, if it isn't under vacuum, then there's air in the bag and there's no way they will last a year. Simply squeezing excess air out of the bag won't do. It has to be negative air pressure.

I use a foodsaver system. That removes virtually all the air from the bag. With soft foods (like pinkies) you do that when they're frozen so they don't get squished.

[BLUESIRTALIS]

You have to spend small fortune and buy hundreds. For example, $16 at mice direct for a bag of 100 mice sounds great and you save a few pennies per mouse when you order more. However, go to calculate shipping and that $16 bag of mice would cost me about $132 or $1.32 per mouse. Local mouse breeders here charge around $1 or little less for each pinky:cool: I'd have to order a heck of a lot of them online to close that price gap. It's pretty much the same story anywhere. Nobody is paying 12-16 cents per mouse that you see online. Unless you need about a thousand of them and can pay all that at once, forget about it.

They quoted me like $45.00 shipping and that was for 600 mice.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

thank you all. I know that Im not gonna buy that many . I wish I had 1 of those freezerlock things, that would be awesome.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

I am probably going to be either letting go of Pheobe because when I had found her she was mellow and gravid. I didnt know then that she was gravid. Well after she had her babies she became more high strung and very hyper. She needs more room and I cant get a bigger tank now. She also likes to climb and I dont have a tall tank so she cant do that either. I am still keeping some babies and so is my mother but we cant handle her right now . I think that this is the way she will continue to be hyper and high strung. I used to hold her a lot at the begining and throughout her pregnancy but cant do that now due to her wanting to jump out of hands or try to strike. I personally am not worried about getting bit. Its happened...lol. But I dont want the girls getting bit right now . I would like her to go to a good home but I dont have the money to ship or I dont know who to give her to. I asked Steve and he said she wold be welcomed to the ranch but he cannot right now because of the flooding situation and I totally understand. So if I am not able to find her a home then I will be letting her go. I just need to know what would be the latest I can let her go and her have enough time to find a spot . If I did let her go I would be releaseing her where I found her.

[guidofatherof5]

If it were me I wouldn't even look at the least amount of time.
She needs the most amount of time possible.
Just my thoughts.

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Ok thank you for your thoughts. I do very much respect your thoughts and I thank you for commenting Steve. I wrote Shannon a message about maybe taking her. I dont know yet what her thoughts are, I just wrote her today. So if I waited till the end of next week is that still a good time you think or should I just wait til the end of this week and is hse cannot then I will let her go.

[guidofatherof5]

It truly becomes your call.
The more time she has the better her chances;)

[Mrs N1ntndo]

Ok thank you then I will wait till the end of this week and if Shannon does not want her I will let her go this weekend. I will be going to moms this weekend and I would like her to have the amount of time she needs. Thank you again Steve.