Ribbon on the Ranch

[guidofatherof5]

I was delivered this beautiful Ribbon Snake today. It was abandoned by it owner and has made its way to the Ranch.
This photo doesn't do this female justice, much of the blue in her face is lost.
8-supralabials
Scale rows 3&4 for the lateral stripe.

Western Ribbon Snake (Thamnophis proximus) to the best of my abilities.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon.jpg

[BLUESIRTALIS]

That's a nice ribbon Steve.

[RedSidedSPR]

Nice. That's your first ribbon, right? Beautiful snake!

[drache]

she looks great

[RdubSnider]

Very nice Steve

[guidofatherof5]

She's very pretty and had been eating salmon before coming to the Ranch.
He first official act was to poop all over me when I first held her.:D

[d_virginiana]

She's very pretty and had been eating salmon before coming to the Ranch.
He first official act was to poop all over me when I first held her.:D

That's always a good sign :p If it immediately bites you, messes on you, or temporarily escapes, it always ends up being a good pet (random hillbilly superstition). Good looking snake; I love ribbons.

[RicMartin]

Very beautiful & sharp looking, Steve, this girl is awake!

[guidofatherof5]

She downed some salmon chunks this evening.
I'll have to work on hand feeding later on.
She's a beautiful snake.
Glad she made her way to the Ranch.
More photos to follow.

[guidofatherof5]

I've decided that once she's out of quarantine she'll be going in with a group of my big radix girls.
I'll have them work their magic on her.
Before I know it I'll have a perfectly behaved Ribbon.

[Bart]

Won't they eat her? I was wondering if I can join my Kleo with some garter snake, possibly male, because they are smaller (can they mix, btw?). How about that? Good idea, bad idea, terrible idea?

[guidofatherof5]

Won't they eat her? I was wondering if I can join my Kleo with some garter snake, possibly male, because they are smaller (can they mix, btw?). How about that? Good idea, bad idea, terrible idea?

No they won't.
The Ribbon is about the same size as the others.

Mixings with same sex and approximately the same size is recommended.

Wandering garters are the only exception. They have been know to be cannibalistic.

[Bart]

No they won't.
The Ribbon is about the same size as the others.


Well, I was thinking about T. sirtalis sirtalis. Comparing to T. sauritus they DO look way bigger! :eek: Am I wrong? :eek:

[guidofatherof5]

Not sure what photos you're looking at.
You just don't want to put a snake in that could be swallowed in a feeding accident.
Feeding time should always be monitored if you allow group feeding.

[Bart]

Just watching your photos, ladies and gentelmen. ;) And I know how big my Kleo is.
Well, according to my sources, garter snakes can get something like 120 cm long, while ribbons hardly grow over 70 cm. It's quite a difference. ;) Also, garters are thicker. That's why I'm little concerned. Is there a chance (or should I say - a big chance) that 120 cm long garter will swallow my 50 cm long Kleo? I'm not talking about feeding time.

[guidofatherof5]

Just watching your photos, ladies and gentelmen. ;) And I know how big my Kleo is.
Well, according to my sources, garter snakes can get something like 120 cm long, while ribbons hardly grow over 70 cm. It's quite a difference. ;) Also, garters are thicker. That's why I'm little concerned. Is there a chance (or should I say - a big chance) that 120 cm long garter will swallow my 50 cm long Kleo? I'm not talking about feeding time.

If you're dealing with Wanderings(Thamnophis elegans vagrans) it's a great possibility.
Otherwise I don't think you have to worry.
If it's a concern for you than don't house them together. Your peace of mind is also a consideration.;)

[Bart]

:)

Ok, last questions - how big can get T. sauritus male (maximum)? How big average speciment is? In centimeters please, because they are more accurate.

[Bart]

Thamnophis sauritus sauritus, to be specific.

[guidofatherof5]

This Ribbon is beginning to trust as she came out this morning to get a few pieces of salmon from me.
She's a great girl and I'm looking forward to finding her a mate in the near future.

[guidofatherof5]

I wish this would have been in more in focas. In any event.
Check out those eyes. Much bigger eyes than any of my other garters.
I can't wait until this beautiful female will trust me.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon11.jpg

[kibakiba]

She is so beautiful. I love it when they look at you like that, when my snakes do you can kind of tell what they want.. usually it's another pinky. ;)

[guidofatherof5]

She is so beautiful. I love it when they look at you like that, when my snakes do you can kind of tell what they want.. usually it's another pinky. ;)

She's still very unsure of her new surroundings and me.
Poor girls hasn't been settled in a home for the last 4 months.
I see a very nervous but special snake in that face.
She'll have a good future here at the Ranch.

[kibakiba]

I don't blame her. Snap and Ember still aren't settled it seems, or they're playing very, very hard to get! Ember will whip me with his tail if I move too fast or pick him up without him expecting it. Haha.
But what I meant was, when they look at you and you can see what's going on in their head, it makes you feel more connected to the snake.

[guidofatherof5]

This evening my Ribbon named Shy is making some great head way.
She came out to me an I was able to hand feed her some guppies.
She's a good snakes.

[guidofatherof5]

Shy got her first taste of scented pinkies today.
This photo doesn't do her justice as the flash washed out the beautiful blue coloring on the lower jaw and neck.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon3.jpg

[guidofatherof5]

Her name is Shyblue. I finally took a photo that captures some of the blue she has.
She took unscented pinkies today also. I'm real proud of the progress.
She seems to be fitting in well at the Ranch.
Can't understand why she was abandoned.
Look at those big beautiful eyes.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon5.jpg

[kibakiba]

Awwww. How could someone abandon such a sweet little girl. She'd get tons of love here. :D

[RedSidedSPR]

Nice. Love the blue. Shes awesome (sometimes theres just no other word :rolleyes:)

[guidofatherof5]

Another update.
When feeding her today she started with a fish scented pinky and ended with unscented ones.
While in the snake room this evening I thought I would offer her a few more unscented to see if it was really true and not just a overall eating response.
I'm happy to report she takes unscented pinkies without any trouble at all.
She still needs to be de-wormed but I'm confident she is going to do well.

[jitami]

Great job getting her on unscented pinks! She's a pretty girl :)

[Bart]

Congrats from me and Kleo. ;) How big is she?

[guidofatherof5]

Just a guess but around 32 inches/81.3cm. I don't measure my snakes as a rule.
I'll see if I can't get an official length sometime today;)
She's a long girl.

[Bart]

Wow! She's big! Do you consider feeding her with something bigger, than pinkies?

[guidofatherof5]

In time. Just trying to get her taste buds/senses used to hairless mice at this point.
I doubt if she's ready to take on anything with fur.
She's not quick to grab anything I offer. She has to check it out first.

She's settling into a routine now. She comes out every time I open the enclosure so she's making great progress.
I'm guessing another 6 months and she'll be set.
I don't think she's a young snake but then again I don't think she's old.
Glad she's here though. Glad she's my first ribbon. Hope to find her a buddy someday.

[guidofatherof5]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon9.jpghttp://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon7.jpg

[RedSidedSPR]

Cool. I love her blue. She's really a cool snake

[kibakiba]

Her face reminds me of Embers. Ember always have the cutest, big, curious eyes. :D He's kind of fishy faced, too... Haha.

[Bart]

So you should see Kleo's face, Chantel. ;)

[RedSidedSPR]

Well do you have a camera? :D

[Bart]

In cell phone, but it sucks. :(

[RedSidedSPR]

Yeah, they do.... Never mind

[guidofatherof5]

Today Shyblue was out to me looking for some food. After a couple pieces of Salmon I scented a couple night crawlers. She took them right down. I've tried worms alone but she never showed and interest. Scenting with some fish did the trick.
Looks like her diet has expanded by one.
Fish
Pinkies
Night crawlers
She should do well.

[RedSidedSPR]

Awesome. Are you planning on feeding anything else?

[guidofatherof5]

Awesome. Are you planning on feeding anything else?

Nope. Just hoping to get her on larger(fuzzy) mice at some point.

She's becoming very bold and I like it.;)

[RedSidedSPR]

Ok, so said, increased by 1, so...

Yeah, those pinkies looked a little small :D

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue is in her first opaque phase(shedding) since arriving at the Ranch.
Looks like the food is agreeing with her. I'll try to get a before and after photo.
She's still jumpy and from what I understated about Ribbons she may never lose that attribute.
All-in-all I think ribbons are under rated in the tham. world.
Maybe this jumpiness and the fact they are a more specialized eater has more to do with it.
I think they are a wonderful garter snake.;)

[RedSidedSPR]

They are typically quite jumpy, but they can calm down..

[Starling96]

And mine is pretty calm
but never stops moving :P

[guidofatherof5]

Love to see a photo or two of your snake. Please.

[Bart]

Kleo isn't very jumpy - she reacts only when touched or when she sees hand above her (not running, just paying attention or twitch a little when touched). She doesn't move much either. She finds her spot and is sitting there until it's time to change. So: under the root, on the root, next to water dish hoping to be fed. :) Izy is way more jumpy and active than Kleo. Maybe because Izy is few month old. ;)

[Starling96]

i have no camera (anymore) so i use my moms phone but im not supposed so it might be a while

[guidofatherof5]

Not a problem. When it's convenient.;)

[Starling96]

good :p
does your ribbon climb?

[guidofatherof5]

good :p
does your ribbon climb?


Not much.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue is in her first opaque phase(shedding) since arriving at the Ranch.
Looks like the food is agreeing with her. I'll try to get a before and after photo.


I was hoping to get a deep opaque photo today. That's not happening as her eyes are back to normal.
Guess I will wait and get a freshly shed photo in the next day or so.

[RedSidedSPR]

Do you have a before pic?

[guidofatherof5]

Nothing lately. She's in hiding and rather grumpy at the moment.
I didn't want to bother her today.;)

[Starling96]

mine is acting the same haha

[Bart]

Hey, Steve, how do you feed her? I mean - from tongs, water dish, dry dish?

[guidofatherof5]

Hand feed and hemostats.
Lately it's been hand feeding.

[Bart]

It seems that T. proximus are different from T. sauritus then. Kleo preffers food from water; she takes guppies (her favourite food) from tongs and once or twice took smelts, but that's it. If I hold a scented pinkie or smelt right in front of her nose she KNOWS it's food, but will ignore it until I drop it in the water. I mean she expects that proper food will be in the water and needs to be hunted down, even if it's a pinkie. ;)

[guidofatherof5]

I've never offered Shyblue any food in the water. She seem to be content taking it from me, which I'm glad for.;)

[Bart]

Well, I tried it too with Kleo, but, like I said, she wants her food in the water. I think that T. sauritus are very strongly associated with water enviroment and it's just in their nature to seek it in wet places. :)

[RedSidedSPR]

Well, sure, but Kleo could learn to take them off the 'stats.

[Bart]

But she can do it! Like I said she did it at leat twice, but she's well mannered and likes to eat from the plate. ;) Izy in the other hand ALWAYS eats from my tongs.

[Starling96]

Mine doesn't mind it being on a tray
He ate out of my hand for the first time lastnight!!! :D

[guidofatherof5]

I had an interesting thing happen with Shyblue tonight.
I had thawed a boneless/skinless chicken breast for Tank(Snapping Turtle).
I wondered if some of my big girl radixes might like a taste. So I cut some small pieces and headed down to the snake room.
Shyblue was the first to greet me so I offered her a piece. She didn't hesitate and downed it and a second piece.
Looks like Shyblue has a good varied diet:

Salmon
Worms
Pinkies
Chicken

[katach]

Aren't you worried about the hormones in the chicken or do you buy organic?

[kibakiba]

I wouldn't think he'd feed it too often if there were hormones in it. I'm not sure how much they would effect a snake in a small amount, though, snakes are pretty small... I'm not really sure. I'm wondering about that as well now.

[guidofatherof5]

Aren't you worried about the hormones in the chicken or do you buy organic?

Not the chicken I buy.
I use it as an every once in a while treat.;)

[Bart]

Gotta try it with Kleo... Great news, Steve!

[snakehill]

I thought that they didn't like worms. How did you get her to eat them?:confused:

[guidofatherof5]

I scent with salmon. I just rub the front of the worm on a salmon fillet.
She takes them right down. Shyblue is a good snake, I'm so glad she lives here.

[Bart]

Is she CB or WC, Steve?

[guidofatherof5]

I don't have any history on her, other than she was abandoned at a local Zoo. I was contacted to adopt her. I'm so glad I did.
She's an awesome snake. I would love to find her a mate.

[d_virginiana]

That's a neat story behind her.. Never heard of a ribbon eating chicken before!

[katach]

Not the chicken I buy.
I use it as an every once in a while treat.;)

Thanks. I saw someone else feeding chicken hearts and I wondered about that.

[guidofatherof5]

I would love to feed chicken hearts if I could find some.
Some as in more then the 1 or 2 in a package of gizzards.
I'd buy a couple thousand if I could find them.
Not available in those amounts here.

[katach]

I love chicken hearts! I can get them at fred meyer for less than $2 for about 30 of them. Yummy!

[RedSidedSPR]

I'm eating here! Blech!!!:D

Really?! Never tried them (don't intend to)

[katach]

Oh they are sooooooo good! Pan fried with a flour and spice dusting. I'm getting hungry now!

[RedSidedSPR]

Bleh. I'll take your word for it.:D

Maybe Ill they em sometime.

[guidofatherof5]

Here's Shyblue eating a fish scented night crawler.
Hoping to get her on unscented someday.
She is such a pretty girl. Jumpy but pretty.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue.jpg

[katach]

Great pic of Shyblue!

[RedSidedSPR]

nice pic! Shes awesome!

[guidofatherof5]

Thanks. She can be difficult to photograph since she's seems to be on the move all the time.
I must say she is usually the first to greet me in that enclosure.
I feel blessed to have such a beautiful snake on the Ranch.

[Starling96]

From what ive seen from ribbons they will take anything that smells like fish
:p

[guidofatherof5]

My Shyblue is going opaque again. Not 30 days from the last shed.
Ranch life must be agreeing with her.
She's a funny girl. Her eyes don't go opaque at the same time. This time her left eye is more opaque in the beginning. Last time it was the opposite one.
I'll get some photos when I have the strength to lift the camera.
Down sick with a seasonal virus.

[BLUESIRTALIS]

[QUOTE=guidofatherof5;180027]My Shyblue is going opaque again. Not 30 days from the last shed.
Ranch life must be agreeing with her.
She's a funny girl. Her eyes don't go opaque at the same time. This time her left eye is more opaque in the beginning. Last time it was the opposite one.
I'll get some photos when I have the strength to lift the camera.
Down sick with a seasonal virus.[/QUOTE

I hope you get well soon Steve.

[guidofatherof5]

That or I'll die:D
It will take about a week to get better. Every Spring and Fall I go through this.
Coughing up aliens for a week then I get better.:D

[RedSidedSPR]

Ditto. Get well soon.

[kibakiba]

Get well soon Steve!


You're the only other person I know, besides myself, that says coughing up aliens! Haha.

[guidofatherof5]

Yellow and green ones:D or it's lung material :D

[katach]

Hope you get well soon! Try zinc. It helps shorten how long you are sick.

[guidofatherof5]

Moments after finding my Honda has passed I saw Shyblue becoming the new Shyblue.
A couple hours later she was ready to eat and get prepared for another shed.
She's putting on some size and is a beautiful girl.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue1.jpghttp://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue2.jpg

[katach]

Shyblue is a stunner!

[RedSidedSPR]

Very much so!

[guidofatherof5]

There is something special about this snake.
I have had no trouble with feeding. She eagerly eats fish and chicken.
She takes unscented pinkies and night crawlers if I fish scent them.
It will be a great day on the Ranch when I can find a male and bred these wonderful snakes.

[RedSidedSPR]

I would love ribbon snakes to be captive bred!

[hjelte]

It will be a great day on the Ranch when I can find a male and bred these wonderful snakes.[/QUOTE]

Let us know if you do, I absolutely love these guys! :)

[Starling96]

There is something special about this snake.
I have had no trouble with feeding. She eagerly eats fish and chicken.
She takes unscented pinkies and night crawlers if I fish scent them.
It will be a great day on the Ranch when I can find a male and bred these wonderful snakes.
that would be awesome!
i just recently lost my ribbon

[guidofatherof5]

that would be awesome!
i just recently lost my ribbon

Sorry to hear about your loss.
Any idea what happened?

[guidofatherof5]

I had a first occur with my ribbon(Shyblue)
She came out and rested her head on my hand.
Then bolted the second I moved.
She's a good snake and will need more time to adjust to life here.
She also has to adjust to living with a bunch of pushy big radix remales.

[RedSidedSPR]

Is she? I thought she was alone.

[guidofatherof5]

Is she? I thought she was alone.

Once she came out of quarantine she went in with a group.
I was hoping it would calm her down some.

[RedSidedSPR]

Ah. Cool. So does she like being with the radix?

[guidofatherof5]

She seems to get along just fine with them. She share the hides with them.

[RedSidedSPR]

Sweet.

[guidofatherof5]

She seems to get along just fine with them. She share the hides with them.

Here's my Shyblue sleeping with Tourette and Paver beside her. I love the thick laterals on the Ribbons.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue3.jpg

[katach]

She's got some red in her. She is so pretty!

[guidofatherof5]

You must mean Paver.
Shyblue has no red. I wish she did.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/ribbon10.jpg

[Finalflash50]

That's a beautiful ribbon snake if I ever saw one. Also big. I had a pet ribbon in the past. He was very small. In his 9 years, he only grew up to about a foot and a half, and three quarters of a centimeter thick. That's a good ribbon.

[katach]

Yeah I was looking at Paver. Sorry about that.:o They are all gorgeous though. :)

[kibakiba]

Females are always larger than males, finalflash. Shyblue is a girl so naturally she's pretty big ;)
Big girls make the world go 'round.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue is in opaque phase(shedding phase, Ecdysis) again.
She's a growing machine.

[chris-uk]

When they shed it's a good reminder that they are doing well and growing.
Random thought about shedding... have you ever found something interesting to do with the shed skins? I check them for the eyecaps and tail tips, then they head for the bin.

[guidofatherof5]

I attempted to turn a wet, fresh shed rightside out the other day.
It was a total failure.:D

[chris-uk]

I can see how that would have been unsuccessful. Esk shed in his water yesterday while we were talking, and after fishing the wet shed out it was difficult enough to check the eyecaps were there. I suppose with a small shed and some hemostats you may be able to invert the shed skin. :-)

[RedSidedSPR]

I attempted to turn a wet, fresh shed rightside out the other day.
It was a total failure.:D

hehe. I've tried it too.. doesn't work out so good...

[kibakiba]

I keep all my sheds that come out perfect (or nearly) in a drawer. It's kind of like keeping a child's piece of scribbly art...

[RedSidedSPR]

I've found myself keeping some too mostly because i want to see the growth once they're bigger. I mean i have Smoke and Red's first sheds so that'll be cool to see them once they're adults!

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue may not be as cuddly as I want but she sure is adjusting to Ranch life in other ways.
She came right out to me for some fish and turkey heart. She also had to defend her food against an aggressive radix.
She did a good job and never backed down. I also saw her challenge a big radix female for a piece of fish.
I can see she's not going to be a pushover.
The more I see of her the more I love this ribbon snake.

[EasternGirl]

Just looked back on the thread at the pic of her you posted in the beginning. Realized I had never seen a pic of her before. She is really a very stunning snake.

[guidofatherof5]

Thanks. I think so too.
Glad I was asked to care for her.

[guidofatherof5]

This afternoon I passed Shyblue's enclosure and saw her watching me. I moved toward the screen door and she did also. Hoping she wanted to make some contact I opened the enclosure. Shy continued coming toward me so I held very still. She reached me and touched me with her tongue.
Then like a fool I blinked. She bolted to the back of her home.
She is so jumpy and fast. She's getting more bold with the other snakes and is a joy to have.

[EasternGirl]

She reminds me of Cee Cee when you describe her and how skiddish she is...Cee Cee does stuff just like that. Makes my heart go out to her.

[guidofatherof5]

I think Shyblue's reaction is just a built in survival skill.
She will probably stay this way.
In any event she is a beautiful snake and will always be welcomed here.

[guidofatherof5]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue4.jpg

[EasternGirl]

She is so beautiful!

[guidofatherof5]

While down in the snake room a few nights ago I observed something interesting about Shyblue.
She was in the warm hide with many of the other snakes. Her side was exposed to the front opening of the hide.
I started rubbing her side. She couldn't see me and I just assume she thought it was one on her cage mates touching her.
It didn't seem to bother her and she accepted it.
I can imagine if she knew it was me. She would have bolted out of the hide.
It was nice to able to touch her without any of her jumpy behavior.
I dream of the day she will accept me like the radixes do but I don't think that kind of trust is in her DNA.

[EasternGirl]

You never know...you may get a nice surprise one day.

[guidofatherof5]

You never know...you may get a nice surprise one day.

I hope so but will love her no matter what. She is a real joy to have here.
I'm glad I was given the chance to adopt her. She's a great snake.

[kibakiba]

Like I've said, you bring out the best in your snakes, I'm sure she'll trust you one day.

[guidofatherof5]

Like I've said, you bring out the best in your snakes, I'm sure she'll trust you one day.

Thank you for your confidence in me and your kind words.

[chris-uk]

Thank you for your confidence in me and your kind words.
Although this is a ribbon you're talking about, so you have realistic expectations. It's got nothing to do with you and more about the nature of the animal. Having said that, a snapping turtle as a family pet in the living room...
But I'd still eat my hat if you end up with a ribbon that's happy to be handled frequently.

[kibakiba]

Come on Shyblue! Make Cris eat his hat!

[guidofatherof5]

I have to say there has been some improvement in her trust. She comes out to me quicker and doesn't jump away as quickly.
When the other snakes are up seeing me she will come up with the group but hasn't gotten to the point where she'll climb onto my arm.
I see her watching the other snakes to see what they are doing. I love my radixes but must admit seeing her face and those big eyes brings a smile to my face every time.
I'm still looking to acquire a male and do some breeding of these awesome garters.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue continues to slowly trust me more and more.
For the first time today she let me touch her face and didn't bolt.
She is also more readily coming up to the screen to see me.
I don't think she will ever be as touchy-feely as my radixes but I'm hopeful things will improve to the point I can hold her.
Ribbons are a great Thamnophis.

[EasternGirl]

She reminds me of Seeley in the behavior that you are describing. Seeley is now to the point where he is not bolting when I reach my hand down to touch his face in the enclosure. He always watches everything I do. He comes out to see me and usually freezes in place with this terrified look on his face...but he doesn't hide now...he will let me pet him. Melts my heart.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue was hungry tonight and sure enjoyed her Tilapia. You can see on her lower lip a bite mark.
She had to defend her food against an equally hungry radix. She doesn't take any crap from any of her roommates.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/shyblue41.jpg

[EasternGirl]

Great pic! You give em heck Shyblue!!

[chris-uk]

I worry about the safety of my hat when I see this thread updated.... I fear that one day there will be video posted of Shyblue slithering out to the front of the tank, staring at the camera, looping her tail around to to her head and repeatedly pointing at her mouth to make her demands, before Steve's hand appears in shot with a piece of fish in his palm, which Shyblue then eats from his palm before curling up to sleep in his hand.
Just thought I'd lay down the criteria for when I will eat my hat, she's doing really well which is great... Unless you're my hat or my digestive system.

Great feeding photo Steve.

[EasternGirl]

She really is coming around isn't she? Munch munch Chris! Lol...

[PINJOHN]

She really is coming around isn't she? Munch munch Chris! Lol...
i think you have dug your self a hole here Chris.. .knowing Steve's patience and abilities with his friends you are going to need a back up plan,
SO HERE IT IS.... get your self a can of alphabet spaghetti sort out the letters M.Y.H.A.T and you are off the hook.
of course advice like this doesn't come cheap....... i had some coffee in mind;)

[guidofatherof5]

i had some coffee in mind;)

Didn't see that one coming :rolleyes: Who'da thunk.:D

[PINJOHN]

hey Steve there is a chance of my daughter fixing me up with a bit of Skype time, she is due home in a couple of hours what do you think will you be available :confused:

[guidofatherof5]

I'll be waiting.

[EasternGirl]

I like the alphabet soup idea...very clever!

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue continues to calm down. Yesterday she was at the screen when I looked in. In the past she would back-off if I opened the door.
This time she stayed at the screen and actually crowded to the front of the group.
For this bold move she received an ample reward of tilapia.
I don't think Chris will ever have to eat his hat as she will never be as calm as my female radixes.
In any event I'm still excited to see she's relaxing some.
This is one fine snake and I only hope I can someday find a male and do some breeding.

[EasternGirl]

I think Chris should eat his hat anyway and Char should take a pic of him doing it for us :p.

Glad to hear Shyblue is doing so well!

[mikem]

she's a beautiful snake! love that shade of blue. i hope you find a mate for her! keep working with her, i'm sure she'll calm down a bit more.

[guidofatherof5]

As I prepared to feed Shyblue and her crew of T.radix buddies I opened the front of the enclosure and turned to get a worm out of the container I was using.
When I turned back I was met by my Shyblue. She didn't jump or show and uneasiness. The worm in my hand was unscented but I offered it to her anyway.
She smelled it and then gave me "the look" I turned and quickly brushed the worm's front end on a piece of tilapia.
When I turned back Shy was waiting for me.
I know this doesn't sound like much but for a snake that has been so jumpy this was a great day.
She stayed out with me and didn't bolt when I moved. For the first time I was able to feed the group at normal speed.
Shyblue is a very good snake and I hope she'll stay on the Ranch for a long time.

[EasternGirl]

Chris needs to get some salt and pepper and a fork ready....

[aquamentus_11]

very cool. some cb ribbons would be awesome. i like that name for her, btw. was very very close to picking up a ribbon, like i said. they sound a bit touchier than garters and need a more deft hand.

[chris-uk]

Chris needs to get some salt and pepper and a fork ready....

Meh! Real men eat their hats raw and unseasoned. I may even consider serving it up with a slice of humble pie.
I want to see the video I specified first though.

[guidofatherof5]

Meh! Real men eat their hats raw and unseasoned. I may even consider serving it up with a slice of humble pie.
I want to see the video I specified first though.


I will see what I can do since you don't trust me.:D

[Stefan-A]

Meh! Real men eat their hats raw and unseasoned. I may even consider serving it up with a slice of humble pie.
I want to see the video I specified first though.
Real men eat their hats seasoned with fistfuls of habanero.

Yeah, I have no idea what we're talking about here.

[EasternGirl]

My ex eats habaneros..of course he is Mexican. Yeah...what? Now I don't know what we're talking about anymore either...lol. I think we want to see Chris eat a hat full of habanero peppers.

[PINJOHN]

Meh! Real men eat their hats raw and unseasoned. I may even consider serving it up with a slice of humble pie.
I want to see the video I specified first though.

​o ye of little faith....

[aquamentus_11]

hey steve,

there are a couple of what look to be southern or peninsula ribbons at the local pet store in town: light blue-grey backs split up the middle by a very pale off-white stripe. they're gorgeous. can garters and ribbons live together peacefully? i've read in a few places that garters do better in small groups. do you think getting a little ribbon for the tank would help or hurt Hydra? (i told myself i wouldn't get the multi-garter fever, but i think it's struck).

[EasternGirl]

You have been infected by us...muahahahaha!!! Our job is done here. You didn't really think you could come on this forum and continue on with one garter did you?

Steve keeps Shyblue with garters...but ribbons can be hard to deal with...they are generally very skiddish and don't like handling from what I understand. I would think getting another garter would probably be good for her...I think putting another snake in always helps a shy snake to become more social...but I would probably get another garter instead of a ribbon. Just my opinion...not that you asked for it...lol. I'll let Steve give his opinion now....

[guidofatherof5]

hey steve,

there are a couple of what look to be southern or peninsula ribbons at the local pet store in town: light blue-grey backs split up the middle by a very pale off-white stripe. they're gorgeous. can garters and ribbons live together peacefully? i've read in a few places that garters do better in small groups. do you think getting a little ribbon for the tank would help or hurt Hydra? (i told myself i wouldn't get the multi-garter fever, but i think it's struck).

I have some large groups of radixes (10-15 adults) and they are doing great. One big happy family.
Not sure a Ribbon would be good at this point.
I by no means know a lot about ribbons but it seems they are very jumpy. That might not be the behavior you want shown to your Hydra.
Also keep in mind a quarantine time for any new snake.

[aquamentus_11]

yeah, i actually took one of them out the other day and it was pretty jumpy. it did settle down nicely once out though. do snakes learn from each other? i've never kept more than one at a time. i was actually hoping that a better eater might stimulate Hydra to eat a bit better herself. also, how long should a quarantine be?

[guidofatherof5]

http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/husbandry/7224-quarantine-talk-thread.html

[aquamentus_11]

yeesh 60 days; if she hasn't starting eating by then, there'll be no need for the quarantine. although, by the time the 60 days are up and i would introduce the ribbon, she will be settled in (ideally). why the 60 days for cb's too?

[guidofatherof5]

Better safe then sorry.;)

[aquamentus_11]

agreed. how's shyblue doing? any new breakthroughs?

btw, if hydra didn't eat tonight, i'll be stopping by the pet store to take a look at them again. i'm not ignoring the advice you and marnie gave, just have my sights set at the moment. i don't have the equipment for another snake anyway. plus, the girlfriend says no more snakes, but we'll see.

[EasternGirl]

Time to get a new girlfriend then...:D. I will not get another man until I find one who loves snakes and well...many animals...lol. Well, I guess he would have to if he was going to come over here. I know the quarantine thing is tough...I am getting this new snake because I want a roomie for Hermes asap...but I have to think of Hermes and the fact that I wouldn't want anything to happen to him. You especially have to be careful with pet store animals. When doing a quarantine some people use plastic containers I think...since it's temporary...plastic tubs instead of making a whole additional tank for the snake. I think...you could ask other members about that.

[guidofatherof5]

agreed. how's shyblue doing? any new breakthroughs?

btw, if hydra didn't eat tonight, i'll be stopping by the pet store to take a look at them again. i'm not ignoring the advice you and marnie gave, just have my sights set at the moment. i don't have the equipment for another snake anyway. plus, the girlfriend says no more snakes, but we'll see.

Only that last one I posted about. Post 152

[guidofatherof5]

Today was a feed day for the group with Shyblue. She was the only one that didn't get fed as I was out of tilapia.
Shy was in rare form as she came out to see me while I fed the others. She even let me rub her back once.
I see her watching the radixes to see how they react to me. If they are crawling on my hands and arms she'll move right in with them.
It used to be that blinking would cause her to bolt. Today we had a staring contest and I was aloud to blink all I wanted.
I've also started talking more to her through the screen when she is at her most relaxed. She is really a fine snake and I hope we can become good friends.
These are all tiny steps but Shy is well worth all the time.

[EasternGirl]

You should get one of your kids to make a video when you are spending some time with Shyblue...it would be really nice to see her progress!

[chris-uk]

You should get one of your kids to make a video when you are spending some time with Shyblue...it would be really nice to see her progress!
No. We don't want to see any video evidence of Shyblue taming up nicely.

[kibakiba]

Grab your hat and set it on the plate. Now.

[guidofatherof5]

Video will be forthcoming. Sorry Chris.
To be honest, I just want to show my Shyblue off.
Every time I look at her and wonder how anyone could abandon her.
I wish I knew more about her past.
No matter, she's safe and has a family now.

[EasternGirl]

Get those habaneros ready Chris!

[guidofatherof5]

The Shyblue video is cooking and should be done soon.

[Selkielass]

Cool! I'm looking forward to seeing her 'in action'.

[chris-uk]

The Shyblue video is cooking and should be done soon.
I wait with baited breath and a knife and fork.

[guidofatherof5]

Here you go.


RDQ_M4p84kg

[EasternGirl]

Wow Steve! Just amazing...she has really come around. She is less jumpy than Cee Cee. I mean, she actually lets you touch her more than Cee Cee usually lets me touch her. Very, very impressive. I think we need to see a video of Chris eating his hat now. Beautiful girl Steve!

[aquamentus_11]

she's HUGE. What a well-mannered girl too

[EasternGirl]

I love Shyblue....:).

[guidofatherof5]

I hope she has a long and healthy life on the Ranch.

[angrygamer]

Very nice!

[aquamentus_11]

I hope she has a long and healthy life on the Ranch.

something tells me she will

[chris-uk]

...
But I'd still eat my hat if you end up with a ribbon that's happy to be handled frequently.

Hmm, I thought I'd said I'd eat my hat if Shyblue was as happy to be handled as your big female radixes, having read back I might have set the criteria a little low by just stipulating "happy to be handled frequently"...
She's still jumping back though and I note that she wasn't one of the snakes trying to escape round your neck. Can I delay researching hat recipes much longer?

[guidofatherof5]

Of course you can. I want to be fair. No need to rush into this.
It just means I need to spend more time with her which is a good thing.

[EasternGirl]

As long as there are habaneros on the hat and a video of the fire coming out of your nose when you eat it. :D

Why You Should Never Ever Eat a Habanero Pepper - YouTube (http://youtu.be/L8ip5oGlMfU)

[chris-uk]

As long as there are habaneros on the hat and a video of the fire coming out of your nose when you eat it. :D

Why You Should Never Ever Eat a Habanero Pepper - YouTube (http://youtu.be/L8ip5oGlMfU)

Not sure about the habaneros. I was thinking about chocolate sauce and sprinkles.

[RedSidedSPR]

Here you go.


RDQ_M4p84kg

Loved seeing her in a video and your radix are freaking huge

[EasternGirl]

Steve does have some really big radixes out there on the ranch! Shyblue is a good sized girl herself.

[guidofatherof5]

With the right amount of water, sunshine and TLC and you get big T.radix girls. :D

[aquamentus_11]

her darker stripes even look like they're blue. a very deep blue. her coloration is so striking, i wonder why that was selected for.

[chris-uk]

her darker stripes even look like they're blue. a very deep blue. her coloration is so striking, i wonder why that was selected for.
Perhaps it makes them more difficult to see in water?

[aquamentus_11]

yeah that could be it. i wonder if there's a correlation between the darker-colored snakes and a more aquatic lifestyle......

[Selkielass]

What a fine looking girl!
I think the good company she is keeping is helping her to relax- they set a good example for her to follow.

[guidofatherof5]

yeah that could be it. i wonder if there's a correlation between the darker-colored snakes and a more aquatic lifestyle......

The darker color may help them heat up after the water time. Just an idea.

[Stefan-A]

The darker color may help them heat up after the water time. Just an idea.
If there is a correlation, that's probably what it is about. Water should cool them down pretty quickly.

[aquamentus_11]

ah yeah never thought of that one....

just had to get rid of my ribbon, btw i wound up finding mites and while i could have treated her, i decided it wasn't fair to Hydra to put her at risk. like we said before: better safe than sorry.

i still can't get over how big shy is for a ribbon. i didn't think they got that big; she looks like a big female garter size-wise

[mikem]

just watched the video! awesome ribbon! gorgeous :)

[guidofatherof5]

Thanks to everyone for your kind comments about Shyblue.
She is a special snake.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue update.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/ribbon4.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/Ribbon_parts.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/ribbon_look.jpg

[EasternGirl]

Great pics! I like how you pointed out some of the anatomy...very helpful.

[guidofatherof5]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/ribbon_scale_count.jpg

[RedSidedSPR]

Awesome

[gregmonsta]

Nice informapics ;)

[guidofatherof5]

Here is the range map for Thamnophis proximus and sub-species per "The Garter Snake- Evolution and Ecology" by Rossman, Ford and Seigel

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//744/medium/tpo_range.jpg

[Selkielass]

That labeling of the labials is great!
This would be a great picture to link to from the info and care sheets page or whenever the 'what is it question' comes up and people start talking about counting scales.

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue was fed first today. She downed 5 large scented night crawlers and 2 pieces of tilapia.
I was also able to reach in a rub her back with no attention paid to me and I did see some aggressive feeding behavior from her.
As I offered a piece of fish a large radix stepped in and tried to grab it. Shyblue pushed that radix aside and took the fish.
It happened in the blink of an eye but seeing her response made me feel good.
She's doing so well.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/tpo1.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/tpo2.jpg

[chris-uk]

Nice update Steve.

[EasternGirl]

Always love to hear a good update on Shyblue...I can't believe how much she looks like Cee Cee in that first pic of her face!

[mikem]

thanks for the update! sounds like she's coming along great. :)

[guidofatherof5]

I just had to report on Shyblue.
I fed all the radixes night crawlers this morning. Poor Shyblue kept looking at me wanting some food but refusing to eat unscented worms.
This afternoon I went to the store and picked up some tilapia and prepared her meal.
She was first out and gladly took the first two pieces I offered.
While offering the third piece Tourette came over to have a taste.
Just as Tourette was about to grab the fish Shyblue punched her in the side of the face with her head.
Tourette took off and Shyblue took the fish.
I like to see her standing up for herself.
She's fitting in nicely with the group.

[EasternGirl]

That made me laugh out loud...go Shyblue...go with your bad self!

[Reptiliancousin]

She is beautiful! Very lucky find.

[guidofatherof5]

She is beautiful! Very lucky find.

Thanks you for your comment. I am blessed to have her here.

[guidofatherof5]

Tonight Shyblue had 3 scented crawlers and 3 pieces of tilapia.
She's a great eater and a joy to have around.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/sb.jpg

[guidofatherof5]

I usually try to focus on Shyblue's beautiful face but she is a beauty from head to tail.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/sb3.jpg

[RicMartin]

Very nice!

[guidofatherof5]

For the last couple of weeks I've been concerned about Shyblue. She's been off food and more jumpy then she's been in a long time.
I pulled her out a week ago and gave her a check-up. All seemed fine, so I waited.
This morning I turned on the snake room lights and found Shy at the screen with that "I'm hungry" look on her face.
After 3 large pieces of tilapia and I'm feeling better.

[chris-uk]

Glad to hear that she wasn't waiting for you at the screen door, slithered out onto your hand, ate in the palm of your hand, before slithering back in to viv to round up a couple of radix.
From a non-selfish perspective though, it's always good to see updates on Shyblue. :)

[katach]

Great news, glad she is eating again!

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue met me this morning with a false strike, first time for that. Guess she was telling me she was hungry.
I don't mind it one bit as she had to touch my hand to send the message. She chose to make that contact and I look at that as headway.
She downed 3 large scented(with tilapia juice) night crawlers.
Nice job Shyblue.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/shyblue_worm1.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/shyblue_worm.jpg

[kibakiba]

Poor girl.... You must be starving her, and that's why she lashed out! How dare you, Steve!
:D

[Invisible Snake]

Awesome pics Steve!

[ProXimuS]

I love seeing pictures of Shyblue! I wish mine was a female so he would get as big as her :D

[guidofatherof5]

I saw a very interesting thing with Shyblue today. As I passed her enclosure I noticed she was out so I stopped and talked to her.
She immediately saw me and came right up to the screen for a closer look/listen.
It's interesting how she feels so much more secure with the screen between us and that fact she knows the difference.

[-MARWOLAETH-]

Is she much more blue in real life? [she looks beautiful anyway]

[guidofatherof5]

Yes. Much of her color is washed out in the photos.

[ProXimuS]

I love Shy!! That is pretty interesting she pays attention to the screen being there and not. But maybe not that unusual if they made such a big deal about you not wearing your glasses. They must pay more attention than we give them credit:)

[ProXimuS]

BTW I'm sure I'm not the only one that would love to see some recent pics of the girl, if you get a chance ;)

[guidofatherof5]

I love Shy!! That is pretty interesting she pays attention to the screen being there and not. But maybe not that unusual if they made such a big deal about you not wearing your glasses. They must pay more attention than we give them credit:)

I think you are right.
I think garters are intelligent.

[guidofatherof5]

Last night I saw that Shyblue had a couple inches of retained shed on her tail. I picked her up and dipped her tail in the water dish and started removing the shed. She was less then happy about being held and even more unhappy about the treatment she was receiving.
During this time she bit at me and grabbed my shirt. That's a first.
She'll get an extra helping of fish today.:D

[ProXimuS]

What a mistreated snake:p

[guidofatherof5]

Shyblue really enjoyed munching on her pinkies yesterday.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/shyblue_pinkies.jpghttp://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//769/medium/shyblue_pniky_1.jpg

[ProXimuS]

Yay for Shy! She must be taking rat pinkies(?), because those look quite a bit bigger than my mouse pinkies. And I now Shy is considerably larger than my boy:p

[guidofatherof5]

Yay for Shy! She must be taking rat pinkies(?), because those look quite a bit bigger than my mouse pinkies. And I now Shy is considerably larger than my boy:p

Nope, they are small mouse pinkies. I don't serve rat on the Ranch.

[ProXimuS]

It just must be the way the picture is taken, they look really big :p

[guidofatherof5]

Shy is such a sweet snake. I wish she wasn't so jumpy. I guess she'll never be like my big radix girls.

[kibakiba]

Give her some more time steve, there's still a possibility that she'll come around :) As I always say, you bring out the best in everyone! (not everyone but you know what I mean!) Perhaps, if you have time, you can bond a little more with her.

[guidofatherof5]

Give her some more time steve, there's still a possibility that she'll come around :) As I always say, you bring out the best in everyone! (not everyone but you know what I mean!) Perhaps, if you have time, you can bond a little more with her.

Thanks for those kind words.
She'll get all the time she wants.
I'm the one that is honored to have her here.

[thamneil]

Just read the whole thread over to try to pull out some tips. Plenty of things im going to apply to my ribbon. Right now she is being kept alone in an aquarium. I feel bad about startling the poor girl every time I open the lid. Once I am able to move her into a front opening cage, I really hope to be able to form somewhat of a bond with her.

[EasternGirl]

Great to see and hear about Shyblue! I have a special place in my heart for her. She has really come around...good work Steve. Bella acts much like Shyblue...she interacts with me and feels safe as long as she is in her enclosure...but freaks out if I hold her...she musks me every single time! Little stinker. As far as intelligence in garters goes...I know they are very intelligent. Sadie has figured out when it is feeding time just by watching me move snakes into feeding tanks. She couldn't possibly smell the food...so she must have actually put together in her head exactly what happens at feed time. So smart!

[guidofatherof5]

Things have taken a few steps back with Shyblue. Over the last month she has gotten much more jumpy. I'm not sure what has caused this change but it is very noticeable.
I've decided to move her to another enclosure that is larger and has a few less snakes in it.
She is now living with my 4 T.s.concinnus girls. I'm hoping this change will help calm her down.
She's a wonderful snake and I maybe fighting a losing battle but we'll give it a try.

[snake man]

Good luck hope she comes around.

[ProXimuS]

I hope she will feel more comfortable in her new enclosure!

[EasternGirl]

I wouldn't give up hope yet. I have noticed my snakes going in and out of phases. Cee Cee will seem as though she is making incredible progress with me in terms of trust and then go through a few weeks of acting as if she has no idea who I am anymore...then she will snap out of it. Right now she has decided she does not like my red fingernail polish and she wants nothing to do with me half the time. Sadie, on the other hand, has decided that she is not afraid of me now...and she wants me to hold her. I do hope that Shyblue comes around. She is such a lovely, sweet girl.

[guidofatherof5]

I've seen Shy out cruising with her roommates. She's been off food for the last couple of weeks.
Hoping that will change at her next feeding time.

[EasternGirl]

Well...at least she is out and about with her friends...that is a good sign. Hope she eats for you soon. Keep us posted...love that girl!

[guidofatherof5]

This is a good day.

Shyblue ate some tilapia this afternoon. I set the first piece on a log near her and a few moments later she was eating. The second piece came off my hemostats.
She's still jumpier then before but she eating again and that's a good thing.

Way to go Shy.:)