Don's Massive Garter

[Cazador]

How many babies do you think ssssnakeluvr's (Don's) massive garter (below) will deliver? Let's include all offspring (live and otherwise) in the total. Rossman et al. say that average clutch size for T. radix varies from 9 to 29.5 with significant geographic variation. Don mentioned that litters of over 40 and 50 have been reported and that this female is 21" (53cm) long.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//504/medium/prego_albino.jpg

[Stefan-A]

21 (half of 42).

What a coincidence, it's 21 days to Towel Day. :D

[GarterGuy]

I'll say 26....why...I don't know.:cool:

[Snaky]

Let's try just a little higher: 33

I'd like to see a pic of the Radix of Gijs & Sabine, a massive snake that will probably reach 40-50...

[CrazyHedgehog]

I am guessing 18 big healthy babies!
(do we win one if we are correct?)

[snakeman]

12 babies, captive bred and rodent diet makle a big difference.

[LeapinLeo]

Well probably 15+

[mikm]

11 ...

all the best with her Don,
marian

[KITKAT]

20

Does the winner get a baby? :D

[Stefan-A]

Or anything? ;)

[otis lee]

i know it will have 17 with 2 sm stillborns.

[adamanteus]

I think 22 healthy babies, no still-births.

[ssssnakeluvr]

This will be her first litter so I don't know how many it will be either... Both snakes are captive bred by Scott Felzer. The christmas albino is from the Iowa albino line and isn't compatible with the nebraska line..that means the babies would (according to Scott) be double hets, carrying genes for nebraska and iowa albino and christmas albino. Scott posted a pic of a cross similar to this done with a high red and a nebraska albino...the pic is on the garter snake forum on kingsnake. These babies should produce a variety when bred back to each other...hopefully some christmas nebraska albinos. :D I am hoping some albinos pop out! :rolleyes: Scott has already expressed interest in some babies as he hasn't done this cross himself (surpisingly...he has so many different snakes already!!!). I am hoping she has around 20....(not making any official guess since she is my snake..:rolleyes: but will be surprised anyway..the more the better too!!!) :cool:
hopefully she will pop soon!!!!!!!!!!!

[drache]

okay
guessing 17

[Cazador]

I'll guess 19.

Rick

[duh duh duh]

I'm going to go way off the charts here and say....33

[Sid]

My guess is 28. All healthy.

Sid

[abcat1993]

How about 20, just because it's her first time

[jewel-dragons]

i think 26...

[Thamnophis]

I go for 29.

[Odie]

I'll go with 23 :D

[drache]

Don
when's that girl gonna pop?
the suspense is starting to get to me

[ssssnakeluvr]

Any time now!!!! It's driving me nuts also!!!!!

[adamanteus]

Don, let's hope it happens while you're around then you can post loads of great photos.

[Gyre]

That is the biggest garter I've ever seen. :D

I'll guess 35.

Best of luck!

[Stefan-A]

Don't forget, it's not very long. :) I think the 11-15 guesses are going to be the closest, but I'm sticking to my original answer. :p

[abcat1993]

Don, it's been 6 whole days since somebody posted in this thread. Anything happening yet?

[Gijs & Sabine]

I forgot to make a gues, so I'm just in time, before Don comes with the answer;)
I think she'll have 24 babies

Our plains female gave birth to 55 babies last year, but than again she is 47 inch.

[adamanteus]

Our plains female gave birth to 55 babies last year, but than again she is 47 inch.

Wow! That's a lot of babies! is it a T. radix radix or a T. radix haydenii?

[Gijs & Sabine]

Wow! That's a lot of babies! is it a T. radix radix or a T. radix haydenii?

radix radix
I really love this girl, she my absolute favourite

http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/138-biggest-garters-3.html

[adamanteus]

Sabine, that is a truely magnificent beast! I too love radix, one of my all time favourite Garters (but now I have none!)

[Gijs & Sabine]

My giant girl expect a lot of babies soon, so when did you come to Holland ? :D

[adamanteus]

I think I should make a plan to come and visit you this year!

[Gijs & Sabine]

You're more than welcome, James:) And our enlarged garterroom is almost ready, so there will be a lot to see !!

[adamanteus]

Perhaps in the summer? I will PM you later and we can make a definite arrangement. I would love to see your set-up and your snakes. (I have seen the photos and I was blown way!)

[ssssnakeluvr]

she is going into shed now so hopefully within the next week!!! I can't wait!!! :D

[Cindy]

Hi! Don I will say she will have 10 healthy baby snakes. Nice looking garter snake.

Cindy

[Cazador]

Don,

How exciting! I'm guessing that she'll have them on 29 May because that's when I'll be leaving for a 5-week training session and will have limited access to the forum. I hope it's much sooner, though ;). Cheers,

Rick

[ssssnakeluvr]

I hope it's sooner also!!!! Don't know if her body can stretch any further!! :eek:

[flakgunner]

hey ,
I'am thinking 27.About 15 years ago we where give a large eastern garter snake,she was pushing 40",first week of sept.,she gave birth to 65,4 where still born,and the average length of the offspring 4/5 inches.
Joe

[adamanteus]

So, if someone gets their guess spot on, do they win a couple of the babies?;) I think they should, especially if it's me.:D ;)

[Serpentine99]

Yeah, we work so hard to caculate these guesses with complex Math Formulas that I think the winner deserves a few...:D

[adamanteus]

Perhaps the one who's guess is farthest from correct should be responsible for delivery!;) :eek:

[Serpentine99]

or blackma... I mean persuading Don to sharing the newborns with the winner.:D

[duh duh duh]

still no word?

Come on momma, lets have a big litter!!! and all healthy of course.

[ssssnakeluvr]

She shed yesterday so anytime now!!!!!!

[ssssnakeluvr]

well, no babies as of this afternoon....yet.... I thought about it and it sounds like a fun idea.... I will give the winner one of the babies...will have to decide how to do the shipping....but will work that out with the winner... :D :cool:

[GarterGirl]

I'll go with 29.

[ssssnakeluvr]

nice high number....hope you are right!!! lol!!! :D :eek:

[Cazador]

I will give the winner one of the babies...will have to decide how to do the shipping... but I'll work that out with the winner... :D :cool:

Don,

That's VERY generous of you! Thanks for being such a good sport.

Rick

[ssssnakeluvr]

No problem....kinda fun for me too!! might consider it every year...pick one and put her on here for a contest..... :cool:

[garterchick]

let me throw my 2 cents worth in: 19

[Cazador]

Given Don's recent disclosure, I'd like to change my guess from 19 to somewhere between 12 and 40 :D.



Kidding ;)

[drache]

hey
I've been thinking about adjusting my number
I did make sure, Mikhaila would pick a different one
she was very careful to pick one that no one else picked, to save Don from a Salomon's judgment kind of scene

[Dracaena828]

Well I've been following this thread for awhile now and having fun seeing all the different guesses, and I suppose if there is a baby up for grabs I'll throw my guess in the hat and say 16 big healthy babies :) I hope the poor girl drops them soon, she can't be too confortable with all that weight to lug around...:eek:
Angela

[adamanteus]

Don, that is really generous of you! If I was to win I would donate my prize to the UK member with the highest number of posts......wait a minute...that's me!:D

[salzar]

okay , I say 33:) . wow she is a biggie... good luck, salzar:cool:

[abcat1993]

One question: Does the number of babies include slugs and deformed ones?

[Daniel]

Hey abcat,

just have a look on the first post:


How many babies do you think ssssnakeluvr's (Don's) massive garter (below) will deliver? Let's include all offspring (live and otherwise) in the total. Rossman et al. say that average clutch size for T. radix varies from 9 to 29.5 with significant geographic variation. Don mentioned that litters of over 40 and 50 have been reported and that this female is 21" (53cm) long.

So all "things", that look like a babysnake should be counted, excluding slugs.


Because of the small size of the female and because it´s her first litter I guess she will give birth to 13 babys.

[adamanteus]

Don, no sign of any action yet? She's going to be as big as a bus!

[stonyloam]

25 :confused:

[stonyloam]

You know, you would think that I would have better things to do with my time, but I went over the numbers and found some duplicates, and a couple of questions. OK here we go:
Lepin leo picked 15+ shall we call that 15? The number is open.
The following picked numbers that had already been picked:
20 abcat1993
26 jewel dragons
29 gartergirl (sorry mikhaila)
33 salazar & duh duh duh
I would think that they all should get another guess.
Open are 1-9, 14, 27, 30, 31, 32, 34,36 and above.

Maybe I will go and do something useful now.

[adamanteus]

I would just like to point out that if anyone else picks 22, I said it first...so the prize is mine, I tell you, all mine! Having said that, if we have to wait much longer the winning number might be nearer to 122! Come on Don, give her a squeeze!

[drache]

you must have missed something, because Mikhaila informed me, that someone else picked 17 too, but I'm not sure whether they where before or after me

[stonyloam]

Wel l l l not really, otis lee picked 17 + 2 slugs, and according to the rules slugs count, so that's really 19. I think :confused:. OL specified 17 + 2 so that is not quite the same as 19 picked by garterchick. This is all too confusing!:eek:

[KITKAT]

I also chose 20.:rolleyes:

KITKAT


You know, you would think that I would have better things to do with my time, but I went over the numbers and found some duplicates, and a couple of questions. OK here we go:
Lepin leo picked 15+ shall we call that 15? The number is open.
The following picked numbers that had already been picked:
20 abcat1993
26 jewel dragons
29 gartergirl (sorry mikhaila)
33 salazar & duh duh duh
I would think that they all should get another guess.
Open are 1-9, 14, 27, 30, 31, 32, 34,36 and above.

Maybe I will go and do something useful now.

[ssssnakeluvr]

I'm still waiting..I'm in Denver for the holiday weekend with family..knowing my luck she will pop while I'm up here.want to get photos of it happening...got a neighbor watching them for me!!

[adamanteus]

We seem to have been waiting forever for this girl to pop. The suspense is killing me!

[ssssnakeluvr]

ME TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

[adamanteus]

It's been so long now,Don, I can't remember what species it is that's keeping us waiting. It's a Garter, right?:rolleyes: It must be driving you nuts!

[salzar]

okay I will go with 14 , thats easy ... heeee
bye salzar:eek:

[Cazador]

Just a reminder that I predicted she'd give birth on the 29th (http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/thamnophis-contests/855-dons-massive-garter-4.html#post11827) because that's when I'm leaving for a while and will be out of contact. Could be the 30th, though since I'll be here during the morning of the 29th ;).

I'd also suggest that if there's a tie for the winners that the first option might be to see if the winners could sort it out. For example, I'd relinquish the prize to anyone who ties with me. If an agreement can't be reached by this method, I'd recommend that the first person to make the guess gets the prize. Just my two cents, Don. Cheers,

Rick

[adamanteus]

Because of the obviously logistical inpracticalities of shipping just one baby snake from The States to the UK, if I were to win I would donate my prize to the forum, as the forum mascot. I would ask Don to keep her on my behalf and give her special individual care. He could post regular photos of her for us all to enjoy, in a new "forum mascot" thread.

I would just ask that I get to name her.

Right, but I bet I don't win!:rolleyes:

[Stefan-A]

James' suggestion has my full support. It's hardly practical to ship that one baby outside the US, which is why I'd like to make the same donation. In fact, I think it could become the forum mascot no matter who gets the snake.

[duh duh duh]

ok, because I duplicated a previous guess, I'll go to 32.

[otis lee]

still no babys??????!!!!!!!!!

[abcat1993]

Wow, it's been five days less than a month since this thread was started, and she was huge then. Either she's got problems or she'll have a TON of babies (I hope). Do you have any pictures of how big she's getting Don?

[adamanteus]

Don, I really think you need to give her a squeeze, or feed her a good hot curry!!:D

[drache]

Yeah - Thai food did for me

[Sputnik]

A walk along the river worked 3 times for me...ok,ok, not really the solution for a snake. But as 3 is my favourite number I'm guessing she'll have 33 and they will be born on a date containing a 3. :D

[garterkeeper]

I'll go with 23. That's what my quad het just had last week. 10 anery. 10 Iowa snow. 3 Nebraska snow. Hope there all well and no jellybeans.
clark:D

[MoJo]

Don, I really think you need to give her a squeeze, or feed her a good hot curry!!:D

Or put the male in her viv!

Joanna

[ssssnakeluvr]

still no babies...she is crawling all over the cage so I am expecting them anytime now....will try to get some pics tomorrow!! :cool:

[Sputnik]

I'll go with 23. That's what my quad het just had last week. 10 anery. 10 Iowa snow. 3 Nebraska snow. Hope there all well and no jellybeans.
clark:D

Mmmh, Clark, I have read that somewhere before. ;) You don't happen to be part of the Yahoo Gartersnake group?
Very nice babies, if that's you.

[garterkeeper]

Yes that is me on the garter group.Thank you.They have eaten twice and will be getting a third meal today.:D
clark

[Sputnik]

They are gorgeous little things. Don't forget to post some pictures on this forum, too. ;0)

[boeh]

I'm sure that she will pop out about 23.5. The 0.5 is for a very small one, that just cannot be counted as a full one :D

[kjell]

can i choose 16?? I hope that they are all healthy :)

[Stefan-A]

I'm afraid you're too late. :)

http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/thamnophis-contests/1036-winner.html

[zooplan]

She is look realy big but 21" is a little bit short even to a radix.
23 all together would be enough.
Is it her first Time being gravid?

[ssssnakeluvr]

Yes, this was her first litter...she had 18.

[David]

I had a 25" garter give birth to 51 healthy neonates. I currently have a 36" female ready to burst. Alot has to do with genetics, health, and age. The 25" female was much younger than this 36" female. Although this 36" was eating Bullfrogs the size of my fist, she may give birth to a small litter because of her age, maybe not, she is ready to burst. David

[ssssnakeluvr]

also depends on the species....plains have huge litters. some western species have bigger babies and smaller litters...wanderings average 12-14 babies...all around 7-8 inches. easterns have smaller babies, but many more and smaller.

[David]

Your right, the field work I've been doing for the Bureau of Endangered resources here in Wi. shows Butleri have small litters and decent size neonates, We jokingly refer to the Butlers here as Little rosy Boas mostly because of their build. David

[enigma200316]

I say 25 just a nice number!!!!!

[drache]

I say 25 just a nice number!!!!!
you do know I hope that she popped a while back and that the winning guess was from a european member who decided to leave the prize with Don as a forum mascot, called Cariad, updated on this thread:
http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/1220-cariad-mascot.html