I'm concerned - what is it?

[zirliz]

My plains garter recently has this sort reddish colouring along the right side of his head close to his mouth and now had reached his mouth, only at once side I'll get a picture but he's a little un cooperative when it comes to his head.

He is eating fine active but does tend to lie with his body upwards a bit more than he used to.

I'm thinking of taking him to the vet as I had a boa with an respiratory infection years ago and I'm concerned he may have the same.

[guidofatherof5]

A photo would be great. Any possibility of that?

There are a few things it could be but a Vet. visit sounds like a good idea.

[zirliz]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r314/zirliz/My%20pets/DSCF3259.jpg

[NikkiSixx]

It looks like an infection to me... How about you guys???

Sorry to hear that.. I hope he gets better..

[Stefan-A]

Stomatitis, but I'm not a vet.

[ConcinusMan]

That is indeed what it looks like. I've never seen it that widespread outside the mouth though. It definitely has the look of stomatitis. Looks like it has already caused a gap on the side of his mouth too.

I would get him a to a vet asap. He can be saved.

You need to take a long hard look at your husbandry and the conditions in his tank. stomatitis is a secondary infection that takes advantage of a suppressed or overtaxed immune system. Take a look at what might be suppressing his immune system. Could be secondary to a respiratory infection too. You should probably raise those temps up near 90 degrees to help his immune system and do this day and night, but do not fail to provide a proper gradient. Too much heat and low humidity without a proper gradient can cause respiratory infections too, not just too cool and damp.

I wouldn't attempt to treat this on my own. Proper treatment as early as possible by a qualified vet is his best chance for recovery.

[drache]

oops - sorry meant to post in another thread

[zirliz]

I've an appointment with vet today I hope my snake will be ok :(

[ConcinusMan]

Unless he is severely weakened and has been ill for a very long time (I doubt that) then his chances for recovery are good. Your vet should be able to clear this up, don't worry yourself. You can do your part by making sure the conditions in his enclosure are good. Proper range of temperature, (pay attention to air temps, don't just use a heat pad and think that's enough) clean substrate, a proper gradient, etc. Something contributed to him becoming ill. Could be stress from improper gradient/environment but could also be parasites or some other infection he caught before you got him that led to stomatitis if that is indeed what he has.

[zirliz]

the vet said looked like a fungal infection or something, she told me to call Monday as she had mislead the book that tells them which antiseptic creams one can use on reptiles.

Stomatitis she says is further in the mouth than this looked,

She gave me some liquid baytrail which I have to add to his water daily,

For respiratory infection,

I'm hopeful for him, she seemed somewhat surprised he was still eating.

[guidofatherof5]

Still eating is a very good sign. Glad a Vet. is looking into it.
Keep us posted.

[ConcinusMan]

I'm hopeful for him, she seemed somewhat surprised he was still eating.

They often do until they pass the point of no return. The baytril should help, along with keeping him warm and dry.

[zirliz]

4th day on Baytail - It's hard to tell I found a treatment in pet store called Tamodine it's supposed to be good for reptiles etc,

The vet said she was still looking for something else,

I hope he'll be ok while treating him, he shat one me :(

He seemed active and more skittish since moving him out on his own,

[ConcinusMan]

Out on his own? Wait a minute, there were other snakes in with him?

Tamodine is just povidone iodine. Personally, for topical skin infections or wounds in and around the mouth, I use chlorhexidine: Hibiscrub Solution 4%-Hyperdrug (http://www.hyperdrug.co.uk/Hibiscrub-Solution-4/productinfo/HIBISCRUB/)

For the mouth it must be diluted to about 1 percent. Both are good products but chlorhexidine is less toxic (if ingested) than iodine.

Don't worry so much about brand names or if they say it's for reptiles or humans. Just pay attention to the ingredients. That's all that really matters.;)

Some of this stuff is very inexpensive and also made for human use, but if they package and label it as a reptile product, the price seems to "magically" triple.

[zirliz]

he was with another male who I am keeping an eye on in case I need to treat him also,

ok hopefully I can find this Chlor.... (long name)

I guess if UK have ireland should have it also

thanks

[ConcinusMan]

Povidone Iodine works just as well if you can't find the chlorhexidine. You just have to be very careful and avoid letting them ingest it.

[zirliz]

I'll see if I can add an updated picture tomorrow, he is in shed at the min so not happy with me handling him,

I'm hoping he looks better at least a little comparing pictures should give a good indication (hopefully)

The vet wants to know also so hopefully he is

[zirliz]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r314/zirliz/My%20pets/DSCF3269.jpg

I've no idea if it looks better or same, I think I'll be going back to vet next week :(

As he is in shed it may look better after but I've no idea

[guidofatherof5]

I think you are right. It will look better after a shed.
This area looks dry and non-swollen. That's a good thing(in my opinion)
A shed is on the way.

[ConcinusMan]

Steve is right. It does look a little better. It's showing signs of healing. Any healing that has occurred will be much more obvious after a shed. The shed tends to remove the dry dead material away from a wound, leaving behind healed live tissue. Sort of like when a scab finally falls off a human's scrape wound. It might take more than one shed to remove all that "crust" though.

[zirliz]

updated picture after shed

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r314/zirliz/DSCF3286.jpg

[ConcinusMan]

Oh goody. Looking much better. It's definitely healing.

[zirliz]

updated picture after shed

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r314/zirliz/DSCF3286.jpg


opps sorry about that

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r314/zirliz/My%20pets/DSCF3286.jpg

I think he is looking better also, should I continue to use the iodine?

[ConcinusMan]

I don't think it needs iodine at this point but I don't think it will hurt anything to continue it for a little while longer just to be on the safe side.

[guidofatherof5]

Looking much better after the shed.
Keep up the good work.

[zirliz]

He ate today after refusing last week :)

[guidofatherof5]

He ate today after refusing last week :)

That's great!
Ate what?

[zirliz]

He eats fish (he's a picky bugger), he likes salmon etc (which I add vitamin to frequently (for the whole thiamine vitamin thing)

He also likes earthworms hopefully I can get him some,

he just never switched, he loves live fish but they are pricey.

Since my female orochi became gravid I've been working on getting my guppies to bred as food supply if needed, he loves guppies when I can bear to give him one.

[zirliz]

I'm worried as he shed but it looks not a lot better can't see it really close as he just ate yesterday so I'll take him out and get an updated shot hopefully I'm wrong,

[ConcinusMan]

Hopefully you're wrong about what? Anyway, if your snake will eat salmon, it's not hard at all to get them to take pinkies. You just have to scent, be patient, and keep trying.

To be totally honest with you, I know you're complaining about the fish being expensive but the only salmon that is really safe to feed frequently is wild alaskan pink salmon and it's not cheap. All the rest (all other salmon) you must limit intake. It's not safe to eat a lot of it due to methyl mercury and PCB's. Those two contaminants are in all salmon, but wild alaskan has the least. That stuff builds up in their system over time until it becomes toxic.

Tilapia is about the only safe fish from the supermarket that has nearly zero mercury and no PCB's. I've seen what happens when you feed them too much salmon. They start twitching and having what appears to be seizures. Not good.

[Spankenstyne]

Trout is a good option as well.

[ConcinusMan]

Yeah, farmed rainbow trout or steelhead is pretty safe but still has more contaminants than tilapia.

[Spankenstyne]

True. Here's a good link that shows contaminant levels of some different fish & which ones are safer than others. It's geared towards kids but the info is great for us for our garters as well:

KidSafe Seafood - Best Choices (http://www.kidsafeseafood.org/bestchoices_alaskansalmon.php)

They've compiled data from the following sources:

Environmental Defense
Monterey Bay Aquarium
Blue Ocean Institute
Food & Drug Administration
Environmental Protection Agency
Various academic studies

There's a handy chart in the "other fish" section here:

KidSafe Seafood - Best Choices (http://www.kidsafeseafood.org/bestchoices_otherkindsoffish.php)