Happy Time(the lock-up)

[guidofatherof5]

On Monday I took my new Iowa male albino radix out of quarantine and placed him in with a group of non-brumated females in the hopes at least one of them would be receptive. Up until this evening he had no interest in them and they to him.
When I walked into the big snake room this evening I opened the enclosure to say hi to this group(I say hi at least 10 times a day).
I saw that the male was out and that he was being dragged around by my girl Daisy.
Daisy came to me late last Summer from a neighbor and is a beautiful female with some nice yellow coloring.
As I type she's got him in the water dish and in a spin cycle(if you know what I mean)
Hopefully in around 90 days I'll have some little hets. from this meeting.
There's 10 other girls in there so he better recover fast.
Just kidding, I'm not breeding all of them.:D

*UPDATE*
They are apart and he appears undamaged.
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k501/guidofatherof5/happytime.jpghttp://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k501/guidofatherof5/happytime1.jpg

[kibakiba]

Gratz Steve. Mama likes using the "spin-cycle" on Snakey every time... Hah.

[ConcinusMan]

Dibs on a pair of hets!

[guidofatherof5]

Now Richard, You know I will have to prove this gene out before I let anyone go. Sorry.;)

Now, let's say ne breeds with the other 10 females. Then I might let some go.:D

[guidofatherof5]

Gratz Steve. Mama likes using the "spin-cycle" on Snakey every time... Hah.

I couldn't watch. I feel so sorry for these males as they get beat up by the females.:D

[kibakiba]

My mom feels sorry for Mama, but they wouldn't have locked if she would keep her "legs" closed. ;) I always feel sorry for Snakey.

[ConcinusMan]

Prove out Iowa albino? Pleeeeze. Sounds like an excuse to keep them all.:rolleyes:

[gregmonsta]

Congrats ;)

[guidofatherof5]

Prove out Iowa albino? Pleeeeze. Sounds like an excuse to keep them all.:rolleyes:

Yes, to prove out this Iowa albino. Something wrong with that?

[ConcinusMan]

No Steve, please don't get offended, I was only teasing you. However, last time I checked, it doesn't take an entire litter to prove out a gene.

Are you going to try mating one to the already proven Iowa gene to see if they're the same gene, or compatible? I'm still thinking it's your standard Iowa and will prove out to be the same gene we all know.

[guidofatherof5]

No Steve, please don't get offended, I was only teasing you. However, last time I checked, it doesn't take an entire litter to prove out a gene.

Are you going to try mating one to the already proven Iowa gene to see if they're the same gene, or compatible? I'm still thinking it's your standard Iowa and will prove out to be the same gene we all know.

No offence taken.
This is a new bloodline for the gene and I want to proven this gene out before I sell someone a het without knowing it's a true het.
It's just the way I am.
It also gives me a longer time with the snakes:D

[gregmonsta]

It also gives me a longer time with the snakes:D

The plot thickens ;) but nevertheless an expected twist :rolleyes:

[guidofatherof5]

The plot thickens ;) but nevertheless an expected twist :rolleyes:

Twist or not, my time with them is priceless;)
I suffer from radix separation anxiety:D

[mustang]

ouch after all of that she left him out to dry!
"
So if you are in sight and the day is right
She's the hunter you're the fox
The gentle voice that talks to you
Won't talk forever
It is a night for passion
But the morning means goodbye
Beware of what is flashing in her eyes
She's going to get you

All that she wants is another baby
She's gone tomorrow, boy
All that she wants is another baby, yea"-ace of base

[guidofatherof5]

I don't have a clue, Robert.:confused:

[mustang]

I don't have a clue, Robert.:confused:
about:confused:

[guidofatherof5]

ouch after all of that she left him out to dry!
"
So if you are in sight and the day is right
She's the hunter you're the fox
The gentle voice that talks to you
Won't talk forever
It is a night for passion
But the morning means goodbye
Beware of what is flashing in her eyes
She's going to get you

All that she wants is another baby
She's gone tomorrow, boy
All that she wants is another baby, yea"-ace of base


I don't have a clue, Robert.:confused:


This. I now understand from your post in the music thread. Thanks.;)

[mustang]

This. I now understand from your post in the music thread. Thanks.;)
ok haha for everyone else i quoted all that she wants by ace of base as the girl radix ditched the boy after initiating mating with him. hehehe:D

[guidofatherof5]

Here's a couple of photos of Daisy.
They are not as nice as I wanted but do show the yellow coloring she possesses. She's already starting to show an increased weigh.
I've been slipping her food everyday(small snacks) since she bred with Riverton. I'll get a new weight on her in a couple days. I plan on weekly weigh-ins.
She a very beautiful girl from the backyard.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy.jpghttp://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy1.jpg

[gregmonsta]

I like the thick black bars in the second pic ;)

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy
1/6/11 Conception
1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 128g-8g(2-4g worms)= a 20g gain in a week.

Hoping she'll(and babies) continue to grow. Just not 20g a week as she's not a big girl.

[gregmonsta]

Nice going ;) there's that phantom weight again. I was reading something about vipers the other night where an average weight gain of 20g was accounted for by ovulation alone. Nice to get more stats on this intitial part of the cycle :D

[guidofatherof5]

Nice going ;) there's that phantom weight again. I was reading something about vipers the other night where an average weight gain of 20g was accounted for by ovulation alone. Nice to get more stats on this intitial part of the cycle :D

I should have clarified something in this post. The 8g of worm weight was moments before I weighed her. Prior to the weigh-in she was fed small meals everyday.

I'm trying this tactic(daily feeding) to see if it will increase the amount of live born and help their overall their health.

[gregmonsta]

Ah, I see :) it's still a good jump in weight. I was reading Rossman/Ford/Seigel's book again last night. Nutrition does play a big part. Calcium with the worms might be a good idea ;)

[guidofatherof5]

Ah, I see :) it's still a good jump in weight. I was reading Rossman/Ford/Seigel's book again last night. Nutrition does play a big part. Calcium with the worms might be a good idea ;)

Got it covered. Thanks.

[gregmonsta]

Actually :D that's just reminded me that I need to order another bottle myself ..... scurries off to ebay ...

[guidofatherof5]

Finally, a photo that does her colors justice.
This is as close to her colors as I've been able to capture. Of course, it much better in person.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy2.jpg

[kibakiba]

She's so pretty. :D

[mustang]

ha she smiled

[ConcinusMan]

You would probably be smiling too after what happened.

[guidofatherof5]

I have to post about my Daisy. Since she mated, she's been on a one-way street called "Eat Everything". This is a huge change from her normal attitude. Although she's a good eater this is turning the dial up 10 notches. She's challenging much larger females for food and approaching me in an a "Feed me, NOW" mode.
I'm not complaining and am happy to see this change. I can only attribute it to being gravid and wanting more food for the egg development.

[kibakiba]

That's how Mama is right now, I fed her worms yesterday and I was going to give them all a little snack and she was the first one at the top giving me the evil eye for heading over to the babies ;) She even bit Snakey, who hadn't even had any food near him. Maybe she'll be like a mantis and eat her mate... Hah. Somehow, it wouldn't surprise me if she did try. Luckily we'll be picking up pinkies for the babies and Snakey, and fuzzies for her. I can only hope she can hold off until Monday. :rolleyes:

[guidofatherof5]

Riverton is at it again. Like a duck on a June bug.
I moved Riverton over to another enclosure 5 minutes ago. He's never been in the enclosure but apparently knew where he was going. He headed straight for Onespot.
She's never bred before but must be willing.
She is so big compared to him. He's been whispering sweet nothings in her ear but that won't do him any good as she's twice as long as he is.
I hope she doesn't kill him.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/riverton3.jpg

[kibakiba]

Well, good luck Riverton!
She does look pretty huge compared to him!

[ConcinusMan]

No biggie. (no pun intended) I see pairs mating in the spring with the male being half the size of the female.

[guidofatherof5]

I think I will stay to make sure he survives the night.
I've wanted to bred her for the last couple of years but just didn't have the right male. I hope this works out.
If both these females are able to breed it will save me the brumation time on them.

[guidofatherof5]

This morning I was feeding Daisy's group when I became worried, since I didn't see her.
Come to find out she going into opaque phase and all her color is gone. That beautiful yellow on her sides is gone and she looks very dull.
She's still eating and getting bigger. Tomorrow is a weight check day so I'll post another update.
I'll be glad when she sheds and I have my pretty little Daisy back.

[mustang]

You would probably be smiling too after what happened.
yes i would!!........i hope:o

[guidofatherof5]

Smiling or regretting.:D

[mustang]

Smiling or regretting.:D
one of em:o

[guidofatherof5]

No, maybe both:D

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy
1/6/11 Conception
1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 128g-8g(2-4g worms)= a 20g gain in a week.


1/23/11 131g

[gregmonsta]

Steady as she goes ;)

[guidofatherof5]

She just finished a shed over the weekend. She's a beautiful girl. Looking forward to a nice group of hets.
Holding her I can really feel how she's filling and plumping up.
She's not a big girl so I expect a small litter 11-15.

[mustang]

No, maybe both:D
oh god you can have both of the fealings!:eek: so its not just a HOORAY!! or neigh thing:p

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy
1/6/11 Conception
1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 128g-8g(2-4g worms)= a 20g gain in a week.


1/23/11 131g

1/29/11 141g
She's really starting to fill out. Looking plump. I'm excited.
Should be some Mid-Winter babies.

[ConcinusMan]

Awesome news Steve. Lord knows there's not enough radixes around.:rolleyes:

Wait, how did that 7-11 commercial go?... "Too much good stuff":p

*walks away whistling sarcastically*:p

I'm starting to think that when He said "go forth and multiply", He didn't mean just us.;)

[guidofatherof5]

Dead of Winter babies are the best. There's just something about new life that warms up a Winter.
Babies are the best(anytime of the year);)

[kibakiba]

Babies!!! :D

I love baby snakes... There are never too many baby garters, Richard. You should know that. You can't say that your heart doesn't melt when they look up at you and beg for some food! :p

[Stefan-A]

You can't say that your heart doesn't melt when they look up at you and beg for some food! :p
Granted, I've only had wandering garter babies, but when they look up at you, you know they've just declared you food and at that point you better put the lid back on, or have something ready to appease them with.

[kibakiba]

Mine aren't like that, they slither around all over my hands and have the cutest little faces. They're even cute when they declare me as food. Cause, you know, they are tiny and I'm big... And they look angry and cute at the same time. :D

[mustang]

Mine aren't like that, they slither around all over my hands and have the cutest little faces. They're even cute when they declare me as food. Cause, you know, they are tiny and I'm big... And they look angry and cute at the same time. :D
somehow i think you and a lot of people here have secretly been interviewed by animal planet for Fatal attractions...
(wasnt too happy one episode they killed all this girls snakes caus she died and they needed to know which fangs fit the bite....NIMORODS COULDNT GUESS THE WAY A GABOON VIPER's VENOM KILLS PEOPLE EVEN IF IT BIT EM IN THE *censored*)

[kibakiba]

Hah. My attraction to garters may be fatal, I'm allergic to their saliva. One bite from Snakey makes my hand swell and turn red and purple. I'm lucky Mama hasn't bit me too hard like Snakey has. That and I just love my snakes to death. I don't like animal planet.

[mustang]

Hah. My attraction to garters may be fatal, I'm allergic to their saliva. One bite from Snakey makes my hand swell and turn red and purple. I'm lucky Mama hasn't bit me too hard like Snakey has. That and I just love my snakes to death. I don't like animal planet.
annonymous deep voice
"and one day chantel yet agin went into her snake room to hold her snakes.....unfortunatly for her it would be her last time...COMMERCIAL":D:D

[kibakiba]

I bet Snap wishes that all the time.

[mustang]

I bet Snap wishes that all the time.
i bet he just wants more munchies and crunchies:D

[kibakiba]

She gets more food than the others, she steals it usually. She's just a little spitfire, though she is getting calmer.

[mustang]

She gets more food than the others, she steals it usually. She's just a little spitfire, though she is getting calmer.
when you turn your back she makes the other snakes cough up their food:p

[kibakiba]

She actually does. I gave Thumbelina a piece and turned around to grab some fish for Snap, turn around and Snap is eating the pinkie part I gave to Thumbelina.

[mustang]

She actually does. I gave Thumbelina a piece and turned around to grab some fish for Snap, turn around and Snap is eating the pinkie part I gave to Thumbelina.
haha
"give me your lunch money"

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy
1/6/11 Conception
1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 128g-8g(2-4g worms)= a 20g gain in a week.
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g

2/4/11 156g
She seems to be spending much of her time at the warm end of the enclosure. Cooking, I guess!
She's looking plump and feels round.
In two days it will be a month since conception.
Lately, many of my radixes have been delivering between 60-70 days.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/plump_daisy.jpg

[kibakiba]

That is one big girl!

[guidofatherof5]

I can't imagine what she's going to look like in a month. She's not a very long snake.
I'll probably have to roll her around:D

[kibakiba]

Snake balloon! :D

[guidofatherof5]

Snake balloon! :D



Like the one in Shrek:D

[kibakiba]

Yeah, my boyfriend and I watched Shrek 3 and 4 the other night. Her size reminded me of it. Haha.

[guidofatherof5]

mz0bxERz5hw

[Mommy2many]

Looks like you have a couple plump girls there, Steve!

[guidofatherof5]

Looks like you have a couple plump girls there, Steve!

The others are just loved and well fed.
They filled upon worms this afternoon.;)

[gregmonsta]

Daisy is looking good ;). Quite comparable to my Suzy at the moment.

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy is looking good ;). Quite comparable to my Suzy at the moment.

She's getting into a habit of begging for food every time I walk in the big snake room.
She's first to the screen. I've tried to get he a little food everyday and she seems to be filling out nicely.

[guidofatherof5]

I say "Hillshire" You say "Farm"
here's my little polska kielbasa, Daisy.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy3.jpg

[Mommy2many]

Nice...;)

[gregmonsta]

Chunky :D .... just the way we like it!

[guidofatherof5]

If she goes 60 days gestation that mean she's got 25 days left. I'll have to roll her around by that time.
She's still an eating machine. Looks like those babies are getting plenty of nourishment.;)

[guidofatherof5]

Here's another view, wide view that is:D

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy11.jpg

[PINJOHN]

Here's another view, wide view that is:D

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy11.jpg

move over on the freeway wide load coming through :)

[guidofatherof5]

When will the madness end.
I know when! When little scrubs are blessing the Ranch.
Conception was 1/6/11. I'm guessing she'll deliver betwwen 60-70 days from that day.
She'll probably prove me wrong as she's so big and has been spending a lot of time in the warm hide(extra cooking time):D
Hoping for a large healthy group of hets.

1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 120g
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g
2/4/11 156g
2/12/11 175g

[guidofatherof5]

1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 120g
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g
2/4/11 156g
2/12/11 175g

2/15/11 184g

Three days later she's added another 9 grams. She also seems to be having some labored breathing.
I shot some video and will be posting a Youtube link when it's done processing.

[ConcinusMan]

Jeez, that's a lot of weight gain. Big Bertha had 20 live, 10 stills and she only gained 50 grams.

[guidofatherof5]

She's a first time breeder for me as she came to me as a rescue last year. She's only 40 days from conception and has gained 84 grams.:eek:

Keeping a very close eye on her.
I'm hoping for a large group of hets. or a smaller group of larger babies.
I'll be happy with either and that Daisy stays safe.;)

[guidofatherof5]

Here's that video.
lOJLf6LU61g

[Mommy2many]

I remember feeling just like her about a year ago:D
I couldn't walk 5' without wanting to sit down and then I couldn't get up.
And I still had 10 weeks to go until the baby was born (4 weeks prematurely)

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy's been acting kind of strange this evening. Part of her midsection was hanging out of the warm hide and it looked like she couldn't get comfortable.
I watched her about 5 minutes and then lifted the hide to see what was going on. It looks like she having some contractions and pushing the babies down.
She did eat a couple smaller worms earlier so maybe it's digestion related.
I'm not sure she can get much bigger.
She's only 41 days into this so I don't think she could be ready to deliver.
Anyone out there had any short (40-50 day) gestation periods?

[ConcinusMan]

Any chance it could have actually been longer? She's awfully big to be only 40 days or so.

[guidofatherof5]

Any chance it could have actually been longer? She's awfully big to be only 40 days or so.

No. Her weight gain only began after conception.

[guidofatherof5]

Looks like she going into a shed.

[guidofatherof5]

1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 120g
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g
2/4/11 156g
2/12/11 175g
2/15/11 184g

She's getting close to doubling her weight. Can't say I've ever had one do that.
Tonight.
2/20/11 191g

[guidofatherof5]

1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 120g
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g
2/4/11 156g
2/12/11 175g
2/15/11 184g
2/20/11 191g

2/26/11 198g
and she refused food for the first time since conception.
She's definitely on the delivery watch list even though she's only
52 days into it. She's been spending a lot of time under the warm hide.
She still gets around pretty good but to hold her she feels like she could pop.:eek:
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy31.jpg

[mustang]

lets play the name the baby radix game!!!

[guidofatherof5]

lets play the name the baby radix game!!!

From the looks of her it would be a lot of names.:D

[guidofatherof5]

1/6/11 100g
1/13/11 120g
1/23/11 131g
1/29/11 141g
2/4/11 156g
2/12/11 175g
2/15/11 184g
2/20/11 191g
2/26/11 198g

3/2/11 194g

She refused food again today and appears more restless.
She's also drop weight to 194 grams.
She's 56 days after conception.

[guidofatherof5]

Daisy's delivering right now.
So far, 12 alive 2 stillborn.

Make that 14 alive, 2 stillborn. Might be one or two more to come.

They've had their first bath and now are working on their first shed.
They'll spend the rest of the morning on wet paper towel to ad in shedding. All look healthy and strong.
14 nice little Iowa albino hets.
Life is good.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Daisy_babies.jpg

[gregmonsta]

Congrats on the baby radix goodness ;)

[guidofatherof5]

Here's another photo.
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/daisy_babies1.jpg

[kibakiba]

Yay! Lots of babies! They are soooo cute! :D

[ConcinusMan]

Wow, they look great Steve. Congrats!

[Mommy2many]

Congratulations!

[Stefan-A]

Congratulations again. ;)

[indigoman]

Good healthy looking group! congratulations.

[guidofatherof5]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Daisy_s_chart.jpg

[ConcinusMan]

I'm trying this tactic(daily feeding) to see if it will increase the amount of live born and help their overall their health.



Nice going there's that phantom weight again. I was reading something about vipers the other night where an average weight gain of 20g was accounted for by ovulation alone. Nice to get more stats on this intitial part of the cycle

Ah, but it's not the initial part of the cycle. In wild snakes, the cycle begins in the fall before brumation. The ovocytes have been growing and gaining mass for months. What we should really be doing here is weekly weigh-ins starting soon after she has her litter and track it until she has another litter.

I'm having a hard time trying to figure out how a significant weight gain can be attributed to ovulation alone. The ovocytes have been gaining mass and are fully mature and so, no longer gaining mass, before actual ovulation or fertilization occurs. Anyway, I started a thread for this: http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/breeding/8184-egg-production.html#post153884

[mustang]

Awww

[charles parenteau]

My mom feels sorry for Mama, but they wouldn't have locked if she would keep her "legs" closed. ;) I always feel sorry for Snakey.

hahaha true!!

[mustang]

Awww
LETME REPHRASE!!!
"MASCULINE AND MANLY"awww"

[guidofatherof5]

I've got eaters already. I offered a small amount of very small worm pieces to these babies.
I put the dish under their hide and about 80% of the worms have been eaten.
I'll offer food everyday for the next few weeks as not to miss and "eating opportunities" as I call them.

[ConcinusMan]

Awesome. All is well then. I wish that for concinnus I could just "put the dish under their hide"

They make that impossible without someone getting hurt. It's work raising these little boogers. Feeding time is a PITA with them.

[guidofatherof5]

The first couple times I try to feed them I can get away with this tactic, since most aren't eaters
Once most of them become eaters I can't do this. Then I must monitor the feed.

[kibakiba]

I wish I could dish feed... If I put a dish in there, Snap lays inside the dish and wont let anyone else in it. Chews on me when I try taking her out, too. She's really serious about her food intake... Haha. If I look away for a second, someone is munching on another ones head like a zombie.

[ConcinusMan]

The first couple times I try to feed them I can get away with this tactic, since most aren't eaters
Once most of them become eaters I can't do this. Then I must monitor the feed.

Oh, OK. yeah, it's the same way with concinnus babies. After getting some or all of them to eat by the third food offer, watch out! Once they are adults, personalities vary but for the most part, the fighting isn't as big a problem.