Scenting still not working

[RedSidedSPR]

My Red sided garter snake ever since I found him will only eat minows. (which apparently are bad for him)
I've tried scenting frozen silversides and other fish and worms(earthworms and nightcrawlers) every time I feed him minnows. I put them in the same dish and I've cut up the worms to fish-size(and some other tactics). How can I get him to eat something else?(no pinkies)

My parents only let me keep a garter (instead of corn snake etc.) because they didnt have to eat mice. Plus I dont have any localy owned pet stores near me and petsmarts pinkies are to expensive anyway.

[guidofatherof5]

Here's an idea that can be hard for most of us to do.
Let him get hungry. Don't feed him for a couple cycles.
Many times a picky eater will take almost anything when they are hungry. Just an idea.;)

[gregmonsta]

;) give it a go.

[kibakiba]

I have to agree, sometimes the best thing you can do is just let him go without food for a while then offer something.

[drache]

when he's good and hungry, put some other food items in a small dish with just one or two minnows - chances are he'll grab something

[RedSidedSPR]

Thanks, I was planning on doing that! Except... I'm not sure think it will work. I've kinda tried it before. But I will try.

[drache]

it's really hard to photograph specific detail on snakes

[mustang]

suggestions that have worked for me.
a)put in heat lamp
then!!!!
a) dangle his preefered food over him and he'll eat it
repeat for a week to amonth
the pinch a pinky and the other food source together and when he strikes he might grab the pinky(if you just dangle a pinky alone it still might work because he's used to food being dangled above him.)
DONT LET KIDS,GUEST,FAMILY,OR YOURSELF DANGLE YOUR FINGER ABOVE HIM!!

B) or just put him in a smaller enclosure and keep reheating food or putting fresh food out and when he eats (may take a few days...be sure to put him somewhere dark) then immediatly put hhim back in his original cage

i hope for the best

[RedSidedSPR]

HE ATE A WORM!!!!! I cut a fish size piece off as usual and scented with a fish, but this time I waited a week longer before feeding him and it worked! Now can you tell how many worms to feed at a time? Like if I feed him 3 or 4 fish how many worms? Or 2 or 3 worms how many fish?

[guidofatherof5]

Feed him until he has a nice bulge in his belly. Within 24 hours it should look normal again.
Glad to hear he's eating.
Congrats.

[RedSidedSPR]

AAARRRRGH!! NOW HE'S NOT EATING ANY MORE!! He ate that one but wont eat any more! scented or unscented. I even waited a week again before feeding hiim.

[guidofatherof5]

He ate back on the 8th, so it hasn't been a terribly long time.
You may just nave a fussy eater.
Most of the time they know what's best.
Their schedule not ours, sometimes ;)

[RedSidedSPR]

It was a day or two before the 8th but whatever. It's not just that he wont eat worms it's cause he wont eat anything else but Rosy red minnows which you say are bad for him. I dont have any local bait stores or pet stores that carry any other kind of fish.
I ahve tried fancy guppies but he wont even eat them. And they're 3.30 a pop!

[guidofatherof5]

He will eat the others but you need to fool him. Buy a couple rosies and guppies.
Put the rosies, guppies and some cut-up worms in a small(preferably round) container.
Add is some fish water, then add the snake. The feeding response will happen and chances are good he'll eat some worms and guppies also.
Just an idea but one that has worked most of the time for my troubled eaters.
The only difference is I've never had a snake that was a specific Rosy eater.

[RedSidedSPR]

I dont doubt that I could get him to eat guppies, but I cant find feeders. I cant keep buying 1.30-3.30 fancy guppies from petsmart who are the only ones with any guppies.

[guidofatherof5]

I dont doubt that I could get him to eat guppies, but I cant find feeders. I cant keep buying 1.30-3.30 fancy guppies from petsmart who are the only ones with any guppies.

Then overload the container with worm chunks and couple rosies.
After a few meals of worms and the taste will be acquired. Or so we hope.;)

[ConcinusMan]

Yeah, fish eaters are usually the easiest to "convert" over to eating other foods since the smell of fish transfers easily. After tricking them into eating other things by mixing with fish, most snakes start getting used to the smell and texture of other foods and eventually will eat them without scenting.

[RedSidedSPR]

I'll keep trying the scenting. I've cut worms before but dicing worms like that sounds plain nasty. But I'll do it.
Also do any of know where I could look for feeder guppies? Where do you buy them?

And is this normal? He only eats, like, 2-4 minnows a week! Always has. I've offered him more with no luck

[ConcinusMan]

Not near as nasty as dicing up frozen pinkies or peeling the fur off of frozen adult mice, but I do it. Gotta do whatcha gotta do.

[guidofatherof5]

I'll keep trying the scenting. I've cut worms before but dicing worms like that sounds plain nasty. But I'll do it.
Also do any of know where I could look for feeder guppies? Where do you buy them?

And is this normal? He only eats, like, 2-4 minnows a week! Always has. I've offered him more with no luck

How much and how often depends on how big the snake is. Worms seem to pass the fastest, then fish and last is pinkies.

As far as where to get guppies, you'll just have to let your fingers do the walking.
You might put something on Craigslist and see if a breeder might be willing to sell some.
Most people that have guppies have way more than they want.

[RedSidedSPR]

I'm cool with dicing worms, I was just joking. But when would need to peel fur of mice?!?
I didnt think of craigslist. (I never think of craigslist for those kinds of things)

[kibakiba]

To feed the babies. Mine love chopped up fuzzies, but they can only really eat the skin and legs of them. The larger ones can eat other pieces too.

[ConcinusMan]

Well Chantel, If they are frozen really hard, and you dice them up small and fast before they thaw, little one's can eat almost every part of a fuzzy. Bones and all. At least mine do, even 10 inch little snakes.

They do have trouble with the mushy parts such as the guts though. It's hard to get their teeth into that, and it obstructs breathing if it's too soft and mushy since they breathe through a little hole in the bottom of their mouth while eating.

After thawing diced up frozen pinkies and fuzzies, I add chopped night crawlers to the soft parts and fluids left over. Sort of like bread to soak up the gravy. yum!

I peel the fur off of adult mice and hoppers only because my snakes that eat them, don't like the fur, and will drop the mouse if it's too hairy. It's one of those things where you get to know your snakes, and allow them to train you.:rolleyes:

That's why I often say, I cannot give specific advice sometimes. Sometimes it's up to you as their human, to get to know the snake and adapt your care to the specific individual snake. Getting good at it takes time and experience with your snake and snakes in general.

[kibakiba]

I cut fuzzies in half and give most of it to Mama since she's pretty voracious, the other half and most of the limbs go to Tiny and Squirt. I have Snap and Ember eating whole pinks now. Runt sometimes eats whole pinkies, but prefers worms. :)

[ConcinusMan]

Another reason for peeling is to prevent undigested hair from building up and possibly causing an impaction or constipation. Garters aren't quite as good at passing hair wads as other snakes are.

[Stefan-A]

Garters aren't quite as good at passing hair wads as other snakes are.
I doubt that claim.

[ConcinusMan]

I knew you would ;)

I can only speak for the few species that I have kept. They tend to get "plugged up" fairly easily if you don't include a lot of high water content foods in their diet.

The pueblan milk snake I had ate adult mice almost exclusively. Without fail, about a week later, the feces would come out (much drier than garter feces) along with a huge wad of hair. They are adapted to conserve water and pass such things while garters eat a much more varied diet, and it just seems like they are more prone to that stuff being part of an impaction.

I can feed some of my garters a hairy mouse, then feed them soft watery foods for several meals. Then all the sudden, like a month later, start passing the hair while straining to poop. The fact is, the hair doesn't digest well and it can build up in the lower intestine.

[kibakiba]

I haven't had a problem with "hairy" foods yet. I've fed Mama a hopper (cut in pieces) and she didn't have any problem. Of course, being a smaller garter snake, I cant feed her larger foods.

[ConcinusMan]

I'm just saying that unlike corns, kings, milks, that can eat hairy mice exclusively with no problems, it can cause problems in garters by making them more prone to impaction or constipation. Of course, this may not apply to all garters, especially those that tend to make rodents the main part of their diet in the wild.

[Stefan-A]

I'm just saying that unlike corns, kings, milks, that can eat hairy mice exclusively with no problems, it can cause problems in garters by making them more prone to impaction or constipation.
Do you know that for a fact?

[zooplan]

Degestion (duration and success)depends on temperature.
Snakes with full stomac try to use the best avaliable heat source.
Their might be small differences in species or populations but there are big differences in thermoregulation!

[ConcinusMan]

Do you know that for a fact?

Fact is that impactions are often made up mainly of undigested hair.

[Stefan-A]

Fact is that impactions are often made up mainly of undigested hair.
Correlation doesn't imply causation.

[ConcinusMan]

... making them more prone to impaction or constipation.

For example, if a garter were to swallow a small piece of bark or other hard object, the presence of a significant amount of hair in the intestine really complicates matters.

[Stefan-A]

For example, if a garter were to swallow a small piece of bark or other hard object, the presence of a significant amount of hair in the intestine really complicates matters.
So does the presence of any fecal matter. Quite frankly, too low humidity, too low or too high ambient temperatures and the absence of a heat gradient are probably far more likely to cause impactions.

[ConcinusMan]

Regardless of the causes, I'd rather not load them up with a lot of hair. Besides that, most of them won't let me. They just feel that hair and drop it. I found that an adult or hopper mouse will peel quite easily when it's frozen solid but you can't be the squeamish type as it requires that you do it with your bare hands.

[RedSidedSPR]

He ate 2 more today!! Without scenting! The first one he thought it was a fish. I tossed it in his water bowl and he dove for it in midair and relized only to late it wasnt a fish. The second he ate out of my hand.

[guidofatherof5]

That is great news.
I can picture the action and the happy snake.;)

[gregmonsta]

Well done ;) the conversion is in full swing.

[ConcinusMan]

He ate 2 more today!! Without scenting! The first one he thought it was a fish. I tossed it in his water bowl and he dove for it in midair and relized only to late it wasnt a fish. The second he ate out of my hand.


That's good news! That's exactly the kind of breakthrough we should be expecting of a snake that will do well in captivity.:)


So does the presence of any fecal matter. Quite frankly, too low humidity, too low or too high ambient temperatures and the absence of a heat gradient are probably far more likely to cause impactions.


I agree Stefan.;) It's just that we all know that we can't always provide perfect conditions. We love garters and call them "easy" to care for because they tolerate less than perfect conditions. I'm just saying that avoiding "binding" food items can help when conditions are less than ideal for them.

[RedSidedSPR]

He's got it now, folks! He eats a couple every time! Without hesitation and without scenting.

[Stefan-A]

Good news.