Shedding, or bad news?

[Dyna]

So, I understand that shedding is a natural part of a snake's life. I'm looking forward to my sweetie's first shed in my care, but- I thought their eyes were supposed to turn grey or dull or milky or- or something. I thought that was the sign that they are Supposed To Shed.

For a while, my baby was really anxious in her cage, and spent a lot of time pushing her head against the lid of the cage, trying to escape. I put some more cover in there at my mom's suggestion, and that seemed to help, but I think she hurt herself! :( I'm really concerned that I've done something horribly wrong, because she's got, like, a pushed back, dented looking scale on her head!!

And, as far as I can tell, her eyes aren't rheumy- and the scales closer down on her tale? They're starting to slough off! O_O Aren't they supposed to shed at the head? Aren't the eyes supposed to turn grey? Is my snake okay, or did I stress her out?! Does she have some weird scale infection that she's shedding before she's supposed to? AM I DOING SOMETHING HORRIBLY WRONG?

Anyway, here's pictures of her head injury ( :() and I got a sorta blurry one of the tail shedding- my camera wouldn't focus well on it. In my estimation, the scales beneath the shed-y scales look normal and fine... and she does feel sorta- crackly- when I handle her. Like her scales are loose. But I don't have a ton of snake experience.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/rainatmidnight/Snake/DSCF1766.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/rainatmidnight/Snake/DSCF1760.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/rainatmidnight/Snake/DSCF1762.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/rainatmidnight/Snake/DSCF1764.jpg

Should I put some neosporin on her head?? I think it's just from her trying to lift the lid of the cage... I think... I know I haven't dropped anything on her, and when I could get her to hold still enough and looked at her in good lighting- it looked, like I said, like a scale had gotten scuffed back. I've just left her be, in hopes she'll stop trying to escape, and putting more cover in the cage really did seem to help, and I think whatever it is healing, but I feel really, really awful and I don't know if maybe this is something else entirely.

[guidofatherof5]

It looks like there has been some kind of injury to her head but it doesn't look too serious. Neosporin would be fine just keep it out of her eyes.
When you said she feels "crackly" that made me think she may have a retained shed.
Make yourself up a shed box and put her on for an hour. If it is a retained shed she'll be able to get if off. Here's a link to making a shed box: http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/husbandry/5014-cheap-shed-box.html (http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/husbandry/5014-cheap-shed-box.html)
What size enclosure do you have her in?
What and how many hides are you providing her?
Best of luck.

[kibakiba]

You can possibly prevent a snake being nervous by providing a lot of hides, as Steve said. When I got Snakey he was nervous until I put a lot of sticks, toilet paper rolls and little hollowed wood hides in his enclosure. Good luck with your little garter, I'm sure she'll be fine if you keep the wound clean.

[drache]

also
because of this healing head injury your snake will probably shed pretty soon - it's sort of their way to get the scab off
most snakes don't need it, but I like to give some of mine a permanent damp hide in their enclosure. it consists of a some kind of enclosed container with a small access hole for the snake that contains dampened peat or sphagnum moss
as long as any retained shed is not causing any immediate problem, such as being too tight around a snake, or some infection developing, I'd just leave it alone for now
the upcoming shed will take care of it better if you don't mess with it now

[Stefan-A]

Apply disinfectant (or perhaps something more potent) and move to as close to sterile conditions as possible. And try to find out if there are any sharp edges anywhere in the enclosure.

[flickerfriend]

Oh no! not your new snake dyna!

[Dyna]

Alright, I will try a warm, damp shed box and get my q-tips with neosporin ready!!

Also- the first week or two that I had her, we kept her in the bedroom, where it was quiet. But the light was causing problems for sleeping, so we moved her to the living room... I'm worried that that stressed her out, because it was after that that she started making her rather frantic attempts to escape- like, pushing herself against the lid with extreme vigor until she'd fail and eventually stop, only to try again just as hard moments later.

As far as hides go, I am using an old router box which has four different compartments; they are rather short compartments, but they are accessible by a thumbnail sized gap about 1.5 times her - and I can lift the lids to them if I need to retrieve her. She often hides out in there. Maybe the edges of the box are rough and that's what she scratched her head on? :(

She also has a big forked piece of wood, and a nice rock, plus her waterbowl. She likes to hang out between the rock and the waterbowl, too.

Once I added some fake foliage, she seemed to ease, and then stop, her attempts to escape- I think she just needed more cover to feel safe and protected.

She's acting normal, alert, and eats fine... whatever happened to her head doesn't seem to be bothering her. I'll take a closer look at everything in her enclosure, including my lid, to see if I can identify what hurt her.

Someone also said to make sure her environment is sterile as possible; so that means I'll remove the stuff from her cage, make sure everything is as clean as it can be, change out the paper towels, all that good stuff- but I can put it back in, right? I think she'd be unhappy if I didn't.

I'll take pictures of her enclosure and hides when I get home, to get feedback; I though the router box was rather cunning, and she seems to enjoy it. Her cage- is on the large-ish size, but I don't know off the top of my head HOW large... it is kind of crowded with all the stuff I put in there. *worry* Maybe THAT is the problem?

Also, what about the shed thing? I watch her a lot, and I have not seen her eyes turn blue or grey or whatever... I'm not convinced she's supposed to be shedding right now. >_< That worries me more than her dented scale.

[kibakiba]

People who are newer with snakes make a lot of mistakes, whether they researched or not. It's a part of the learning process. The router could be a problem, but if there's anything sharp in there it could harm your snake. I had to take out one of runts decorations because he cut his side on it when I first got him. he healed up fast. As for the shedding, be patient. Snakes will go into the blue/opaque phase for anywhere from a day or even a few. Snakey takes 3 days usually and Mama takes one. Runt's taken as much as a week to get out of opaque phase. After that they look normal, again for 1-7 days in my experience. Snakes are like humans, their all different.

For cleaning things and sterilizing I personally take everything out and put it in a tub of 1 part bleach, 10 parts water and let them soak for 15 minutes. after that I put them in a separate tub with plain pure water and let them sit for 20 minutes and repeat. Some members use just mildly soapy water I believe. But It doesn't always work for me depending on what it is. I hope the best for you and your snake!

[mustang]

poor little dude..hope he gets better...i found some blue cement or concreat forgot which it is...i broke it into a bunch of fist size rocks and its like sandpaper and checker loves it and it helps him shed a lot(hasnt hurt himself so i got nothing against it)

[Dyna]

Oh, by router box I mean the box the router came in- it's just cardboard, not plastic!

The rock I put in there has some edges to it, too- I thought maybe it could help her shed, funny enough in this situation, and she seems to enjoy relaxing on it sometimes, but I think I'll take it out with this in mind. :(

Thanks for the bleach tip; I'm not sure how I'm going to clean the cardboard box, I'll probably just dump it and find something else for her to hide in, especially with the idea that maybe it had something to do with her hurting.

Edit: Forgot to add- should I be worried about her shedding lower down before she 'should' be ready to shed? I thought shedding started at the head.

[guidofatherof5]

Edit: Forgot to add- should I be worried about her shedding lower down before she 'should' be ready to shed? I thought shedding started at the head.


She won't shed unless she's ready. You really can't force a shed.

[kibakiba]

Yeah it's hard with cardboard but it'd be more sterile to keep it out. I've gotten rid of sticks because I couldn't clean them off well enough. :)

[Dyna]

Okay... so her lower abdomen shedding isn't a problem, and she'll finish whenever she damn well feels like it, which will eventually include 'blue stage'?

I'll still try the shed-box idea, in case it helps. It certainly can't hurt her, as far as I can tell.

[Dyna]

... okay, I just got a message from my boyfriend at home that she is gloriously shedded, the entire thing, head to tailtip; he didn't manage to pull it out in one piece, but she's fine.

I don't know HOW I missed the blue stage. ._. Am I really that unobservant??

Still, I will have to take a good look at her head when I get home. I will continue to fret. I am determined on that count. And I'm going to check the shed to make sure there's no retained eyecaps, because I read a thread on here that made me somewhat paranoid about that.

I guess tomorrow will come a flood of pictures, because they're brightest after they shed- and she really is a gorgeous shade of blue!!

[kibakiba]

Sometimes I miss the opaque phase, it's not always noticeable. With some snakes you cant see it at all. Runt's eyes only get slightly milky, while Snakey and Mama have very opaque eyes when in that phase.

[Flicker]

Yeah- sometimes I miss the opaque phase too - and am surprised - though usually there's a buildup of darkness to his color tone before shed - and he won't eat well.

The head thing (from the pictures you sent) looks like something hit her rather than scraping. I'm seriously doubting it came from the cardboard box. It might have come from the rock, *if* the rock was tipped or something and moved and squashed her?

Or maybe her head was in the way when you were taking the lid off and it smooshed her a bit? I dunno - but certainly seems worth investigating.

The great thing about cardboard hides *is* that you can throw them away periodically and get fresh ones. Just dispose of it when it no longer seems fresh.

^_^

[guidofatherof5]

... okay, I just got a message from my boyfriend at home that she is gloriously shedded, the entire thing, head to tailtip; he didn't manage to pull it out in one piece, but she's fine.

I don't know HOW I missed the blue stage. ._. Am I really that unobservant??

Still, I will have to take a good look at her head when I get home. I will continue to fret. I am determined on that count. And I'm going to check the shed to make sure there's no retained eyecaps, because I read a thread on here that made me somewhat paranoid about that.

I guess tomorrow will come a flood of pictures, because they're brightest after they shed- and she really is a gorgeous shade of blue!!

Glad to hear about her shedding. I bet she feels better and so do you.;)

[ConcinusMan]

OK, now somehow i missed this entire thread until now. That snake looks extremely familiar to me... should it? Looks like one of my anery's.

I will say this, usually if a snake is constantly trying to get out, and rubs it's nose or some other part of the head raw, it's because they are not comfortable with their housing/environment conditions and they are stressed out because of it.

It's really not that difficult to make a concinnus very comfortable so that they settle right down and seem happy with only the occasional need to look for a way out. If your snake is doing that, even when it's not shed time, then let me know. Maybe I can give some tips to make him feel at home.

The injury to the nose doesn't look too bad but you really have to re-examine the enclosure you are using. No matter how much a snake tries to get out, it shouldn't cause an injury like that.

Don't beat yourself up over it, just learn from it and fix whatever is wrong.

I often miss the opaque phase especially in young garters. Sometimes it can only last one day and not be very obvious. I might also point out that the opaque phase is just the new skin forming under the old. The eyes will once again go clear for a day or more before the shed actually happens. It's important to provide a soaking dish and/or misting/high humidity during the day or two right after the opaque eyes go clear again.

Don't worry too much about the snake, it doesn't look too seriously injured. they're pretty tough.

[Snakers]

OK, now somehow i missed this entire thread until now. That snake looks extremely familiar to me... should it? Looks like one of my anery's.

I will say this, usually if a snake is constantly trying to get out, and rubs it's nose or some other part of the head raw, it's because they are not comfortable with their housing/environment conditions and they are stressed out because of it.

It's really not that difficult to make a concinnus very comfortable so that they settle right down and seem happy with only the occasional need to look for a way out. If your snake is doing that, even when it's not shed time, then let me know. Maybe I can give some tips to make him feel at home.

The injury to the nose doesn't look too bad but you really have to re-examine the enclosure you are using. No matter how much a snake tries to get out, it shouldn't cause an injury like that.

Don't beat yourself up over it, just learn from it and fix whatever is wrong.

I often miss the opaque phase especially in young garters. Sometimes it can only last one day and not be very obvious. I might also point out that the opaque phase is just the new skin forming under the old. The eyes will once again go clear for a day or more before the shed actually happens. It's important to provide a soaking dish and/or misting/high humidity during the day or two right after the opaque eyes go clear again.

Don't worry too much about the snake, it doesn't look too seriously injured. they're pretty tough.
Your right it does look anery, are you missing one?;):D

[ConcinusMan]

No, I'm not missing one but I did part with a few very young one's this year. That looks like one of them.

[Flicker]

Guess you forgot already that dyna is my daughter... and she got the older blue of the two you sold me.

I worked with her to improve environment, and Bluebell, is no longer doing that. Problem is resolved. :) nose looks better in rl than it does in that photo.

[ConcinusMan]

Sorry about that, I have a lot of people to keep track of. I thought that was your daughter but I wasn't sure. She's the one that came over with you right?

The injury may leave a scar so the nose won't be as perfect as it was. Also, it sounds like from the description ("crinkly" skin) that the snake was having a retained shed. Be sure that the humidity isn't too low. Especially when using heat lamps, things dry out fast. Misting heavily with a spray bottle twice a day is a good idea as long as the substrate dries fast. I do mist all my tanks twice a day because it is very dry with the heat lamps.

I nearly lost my tiny albino to a retained shed a few days ago. It was close, but he's fine now.

Watch closely for signs of the next shed time and keep that humidity up especially during that time.

[mustang]

geez yall mark your snakes or something?

[ConcinusMan]

I just really know my snakes and even they aren't mine, I can recognize snakes that genetically, are from this general area of their range.

Show me a typical or anery concinnus that is not many generations removed from the wild and I can tell you the general area they came from usually.