Interesting scales, bad nose but beautiful snake

[Tyrel26]

Finally found another garter, and its another beauty (aren't they all lol) with a copper color underside, but it has a little problem with it nose. Somewhere along the way it seems to have lost a tiny piece of it. Another interesting thing about this guy is his subcaudal scales, instead of all divided scales it has four full scales after the vent. Maybe a few of the people here have seen this before but to me its a first.

Well I'll post some pics so please leave me some comments and feel free to sex this snake as well. I am currently leaning towards male but more opinions are welcome.


ALSO the green garter I posted pics of a while back is gaining weight like mad....I think she may be gravid :)


http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d15/cuzgoatsrkool/anothersnake001.jpg



A good look at those scales

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d15/cuzgoatsrkool/anothersnake020.jpg

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d15/cuzgoatsrkool/anothersnake022.jpg

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d15/cuzgoatsrkool/anothersnake023.jpg

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d15/cuzgoatsrkool/anothersnake026.jpg


thanks for viewing my post
Tyrel

[guidofatherof5]

I would say you have a male there.

[guidofatherof5]

If this snake is a keeper you need to watch and make sure the face sheds properly.
If he has trouble shedding that area you can use a warm, damp cloth to lightly rub the shed off after he's spent sometime in a shed box.
Best of luck, keep us informed.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

That's a nice male :D

[Odie]

That's a nice male :D
Try polysporn on that wound :o

[Tyrel26]

thanks for the replies, so far this little guy is doing great and he is a keeper for now so ill be keeping a close eye on him.

Even though no one commented on the odd scales I will again lol. From what ive read the abnormal scales are a sign of inbreeding, which is odd cause this is a wc snake, but it was caught in a park in a city so this would suggest that this population has been cut off for quite sometime. In any event Im sure this wont help future generations thrive so i will try to contact someone to get more info. If they value these snakes, and they should, it may be wise to consider catching garters from outside the city and introducing them into the park in an effort to spice up the gene pool

any other thoughts or info on this?

[ConcinusMan]

Way cool. I have seen male garters (T.s.concinus) with a few full scales after the vent. Never see it in females though, and even in males, it is uncommon. Interesting though, how yours first has divided, then so many full scales after that. Very odd. Maybe he's just "hung like a horse" and so needs those scales to compensate!:eek:

The "injury" could just be where multiple sheds failed to come off. I've seen it happen before with snakes that have a slight deformity, or "dimple" in their scale structure, especially between the eye and the nostril. Honestly, that's what it looks like to me. Failure to get old skin off of that indented area. If you're keeping him, he might need extra attention to that area after shedding.

His "copper" coloring reminds me of my Caramella.(she's an ordioides) She has that, and it's dang near orange on her throat, but her ventral looks just like that. For a plain brown snake, instead of seeing her as "ordinary" her color seems soothing and pleasant to me.

[ConcinusMan]

Unfortunately, when you bring snakes from one population to another, you could introduce parasites/diseases that the new snake is immune to, but the park population is NOT immune to. I'd say the scale issue is NOT any indication of inbreeding.

Also, when confined like that, usually a population is at it's peak, meaning the park cannot support more snakes that what is already there. Sometimes with good intentions one can do more harm than good. Just something to keep in mind.

If one was to do what you suggest, then I would suggest you bring snakes in from the nearest population and even then, ONE young female and one young male every few years is all that should be needed to contribute to genetic diversity.

[Tyrel26]

as for the unusual scales, i have read a study that was done on them and it said it was very common in snakes that were inbred in a lab for studies of that nature, which is why I came to my conclusion. With regards to the introducing new snakes I only mean doing that on a very small scale, like you said maybe just a new pair, and only taking snakes from a population close by. I would contact someone before doing this because if it is decided to be a real concern, then maybe the new snakes could be tested for sickness and parasites before being released to determine whether or not they have parasites that are currently not found in the parks population. If it eases your mind I would never do something to "help" a population without doing extensive studies first.

Mainly I just found this interesting and i figured you guys would feel the same :)

Thanks for the reply and for the info on my snakes injury

[ConcinusMan]

And you would be right to assume so.