New garter

[poissonguppy]

Hey everyone. I am really inexperienced in this snake business; i just got into it because of my friend. Anyway, my friend gave me this garter snake that is about a foot, foot and a half. I have him/her in a ten gallon tank with paper on the bottom, a bowl of water, and some rocks and leaves to hide under. I got him yesterday. I've tried feeding my snake worms from the garden, but it won't eat. Or, at least I think. I put the worms in there but since they crawl around so much, I can't be sure if they are gone. I don't want to buy a pack of frozen pinkies (the store doesn't allow me to buy one or two) and waste the money. I am also afraid to buy any fish because of the talk about parasites.

Does anyone have any tips on how to make sure my snake is eating? Thanks.

[adamanteus]

I wouldn't panic just yet about him eating if you only got him yesterday..It will take him a couple of days to settle in, so he may not eat straight away. I don't see why you would be wasting your money buying the pinkies...you need not thaw them all at once. There is a list in the "Articles" section on this forum of which fish are safe to eat and which to avoid. I'm sure Cazador will give you a link to it! Anyway, welcome to the forum. You'll love it here!

[Cazador]

Hi Bibi,

Welcome to the forum. An 18" long snake in good condition can easily go for a month at room temperature without eating, so don't worry about too much for now. People with new snakes often have the same experience as you're having. Make sure the snake feels secure by giving it a good hiding spot.

Next time, try offering the worms in a small bowl with wet sides, so the worm can't escape too easily. Also, move the leaves away from the bowl. Then back off about 10 or 15' and see what happens. Some snakes get "stage fright" when they're just settling in, so it may not eat in front of you. If you're curious, you could remove the paper towels and leaves. They will also slow down their defecation rate when they're not eating, and there won't be a brown part (the actual feces).

Eventually, you'll want to move away from a worm-only diet, since they lack bones/much calcium. I know all the talk about parasites can be intimidating, but the fact is that this world is full of things that aren't good for us. There are even roundworms (nematodes) in earthworms (annelids). I'd just freeze any fish that you're planning to offer for at least three days. Then thaw them out under warm water, and feed away. Just make sure you're not feeding goldfish or other thiaminase-containing fish (http://www.thamnophis.com/caresheets/index.php?title=Thiamin,). Cheers,

Rick

[drache]

hi
welcome to the forum
congratulations on your new garter
give it some days to settle in
this is a great place to learn

[abcat1993]

And as usual Cazador (Rick) writes a novel on how to do something.

[Nova89]

dont worry, when i got my garter, it took him two weeks to start eating. after that, he ate non stop to this day;)

[poissonguppy]

Thanks everyone. It's really comforting; i was worried for a second.

[Cazador]

And as usual Cazador (Rick) writes a novel on how to do something.

:p

Short & sweet ;)

[zirliz]

It took my first one a month to start eating needed live first to encourage it to eat,

[poissonguppy]

Thanks everyone.

The snake is doing really funny things. He will curl in his water bowl with his head under water. It really frightens me. I timed him holding his breath at three minutes, then pulled him out because it really freaked me out. What could he be doing?

[Stefan-A]

I don't think it's necessary to "help" him breathe. :)

Two things come to mind, though; Mites/ticks and too high temperatures in the terrarium. Or maybe he just likes it there. :p

[Cazador]

Yep, that's a big warning sign for mites. If so, they're biting you snake to feed on its blood, and your snake's trying to drown them. They're tiny and black or reddish. Maybe you'll see dead ones floating in the water or around the rim where the water touches the bowl.

Here are a couple more things you can do to detect them (besides looking closely at the water/bowl:
- See if the scales surrounding its eyes are swollen.
- Look for mites crawling around on its head near its eyes/nostrils.
- Look for tiny, whitish "dust" on or near its head. This is mite feces.
- Remove the water bowl for 30 minutes to 1 hour, and then thoroughly wipe your snake down with a moist, white paper towel. See if there are mites crawling around on the paper towel. This usually works pretty well, but mites can also hide underneath the scales. Therefore, not seeing mites may not mean it doesn't have mites.

If your snake does have mites, you'll have to treat the snake and bleach the enclosure and all of its furnishings at least twice at 10-14 day intervals. Also, have a look at this thread (http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/341-mites.html) for treatment options.

[poissonguppy]

Well, I emptied the water out yesterday and saw kind of large dots floating around. They might have been dirt or bark... I didn't really pay attention to it... If I am unsure if he does have mites, is it okay to treat him with Sevin dust anyway? I have the product, but is the dust safe? It is meant for plants/dogs. I'm always paranoid about using medicines....

Thanks again!

[poissonguppy]

Oh yeah, I asked the previous owner where she bought the snake and it turns out that it is a wild-caught snake. Are wild snakes okay to keep?

[Cazador]

The best advise is to never treat a snake for any condition that it doesn't have. However, your snake is showing signs of a fairly specific problem. The first thing I'd do would be to replace your substrate with white paper towels and temporarily replace your water bowl with a white bowl to help you spot the mites. Even a white soup bowl would work.

Sevin dust is an acetylcholinase inhibitor. That means it kills organisms, like mites, by interfering with their nervous system's ability to shut off a nervous signal. If you leave any snake in Sevin dust for too long, it will kill the snake. If you leave it in the dust for about 45 minutes, that should be fine, but keep an eye on it for the last 15 minutes or so. If the snake starts to show unusual movement patterns, stop the treatment, and rinse of the snake (including the head) in tepid water. Also, try to minimize how much Sevin dust you inhale! It's very effective, but it requires two treatments about 10 days apart to coincide with the reproductive cycle of the mites.

Most of the time, wild garters are legal to keep, but laws vary by state. It's best to check with your local Fish and Game office or Department or Natural Resource office if you're worried.

[poissonguppy]

Yeah. Garter snakes are okay to keep where I live. I guess what I'm asking is whether or not they will adjust properly.

Thanks guys for all the info!

[Cazador]

Wild garters usually adjust very well to captivity, but it's very likely that they'll be carrying parasites (internal and/or external), particularily if they were captured as adults.

Rick

[zirliz]

A product called Frontline is very good for killing mites it's also used on cats and dogs for fleas people use what they can get here and In uk breeders recommend it I found it much better than T-rex actual reptiles wierd!
Hope that helps,
yeah have samples taken to check for parasites It may not have mites if it's wildcaught so long as it's not been left in a tank with others of course it would depend on last shed as wild snakes can just leave the skin and mites and move on in the wild.
I had to write a 6,000 word report on diseases and parasites of snakes for 3rs year Zoology. Phew that was tiring and presentation thanks to that I know more than I should :) had to all the main families of snakes also.

[poissonguppy]

Thanks again! I put his bowl out tonight and will check it tomorrow morning.

Just out of curiosity, how low of temperature can snakes survive at? I read that they are more suceptible to heat than cold, but the source didn't give me a temp. range.

[Cazador]

Bibi,

For some reason, I feel compelled to answer your question by saying snakes have survived temperatures as -40F (-40C). They're able to freeze solid, thaw out in the spring, and are none the worse for wear, but I know that's not what you're asking.

Being ectotherms, they can survive in a wide range of temperatures, but their metabolism, and more specifically, their immune system slows down as temperatures drop. Different sources vary, but most seem to suggest that a low temp of around 72F (22C) through a high temperature of around 88F (31C) are suitable. I normally recommend an enclosure from the mid-70s F (~24C) to the mid-80s F (~30C). You're also right that the "Upper Critical Temperature" (the temp at which 50% of snakes die) is closer to their optimal range than their "Lower Critical Temperature." Please ask if you want any more details or if this doesn't answer your question satisfactorily.

Rick

P.S. Before you ask ;), the UCT and LCT vary according to species and according to whether or not they've been acclimated to summer or winter temperatures.

[poissonguppy]

Thanks everyone! I really appreciate how much you guys write and care.

My garter avoided the water the last day and a half. I'll keep an eye on him, though. Thanks again!