Question about heating pads and winter time

[IndigoBug1987]

I had to buy a heating pad with my snake. This time of year does he need it more or not at all?? It sticks to the bottom of his tank and his hidebox is over it. Should I make him believe its winter like it really is or should i just leave it be all year long?

At first all he did was stay in his box but now he hangs out anywhere in his tank and spends less time in his box. He's even started to root around and sleep under the straw bedding. Is his box to hot but his tank to cool?

I want him to be comfortable, but i really don't know whats ideal for him.

[infernalis]

There is a mixture of opinions on the forum, I have found everyday room temperatures to be fine with my garter snakes.

I use the logic that they thrive as far north as Alaska and as far south as Mexico, so they can handle a wide range of temperatures just fine.

We have so many snakes I lost count, and none of them have special heaters.

I can't imagine winters get very cold in Arkansas, so the heater may be too warm.

[guidofatherof5]

Nice to have you with us.
Your snake needs both hot and cool in the tank. It will know when and what it needs. Plenty of clean water is needed, changed everyday or as needed. Large enough for him/her to soak. Make sure he doesn't rest directly on the glass where the heater is. He could get a burn. If your snake is eating and continues to eat you don't need to worry too much about winter sleep(brumation). Check out the "Care Sheet" on the home page. Much more detail there.

[infernalis]

Nice reply Steve:D

[Stefan-A]

I use the logic that they thrive as far north as Alaska and as far south as Mexico, so they can handle a wide range of temperatures just fine.

And everywhere they thrive, they are able to thermoregulate.

[infernalis]

Very true Stefan.

Thermo-regulation implies that when they are too warm, they seek a cooler place to be, and when too cold they seek a warmer place to be.

To cover my arse, I included the line.... "There is a mixture of opinions on the forum":D

Most heat sources I have tried were rather ignored by the garters.

Our whole house is an average of 80F.

Prolly an exception to most.

[IndigoBug1987]

it gets to about 40 degrees nowadays in ark. we have days where it'll get down to 25. Our house is pretty cold. all we have is a space heater and it gets turned off at night.

[jitami]

it gets to about 40 degrees nowadays in ark. we have days where it'll get down to 25. Our house is pretty cold. all we have is a space heater and it gets turned off at night.

Good thing you got the heat pad, then :) Do you have a thermometer? If so, I would place it just above the heat pad for a few hours, just to make sure it's not too hot, and then I'd move it over to the other side of the tank to make sure that side stays somewhat cooler....anywhere from 65-75 should be fine for the cooler end. One thing that I keep in mind while I'm figuring out how much heat to add is that snakes can survive pretty cold temps short term, but will expire fairly quickly if things get too hot. What's too hot? Good question! I really don't know... I would guess anything over 100 for any length of time would be dangerously warm for a garter.

[reptile3]

well I am with Wayne, my house is not 80 though, it's about 70.
I do cover their home when night time approaches. They seem do do well!

If needed, I have some heating pads, but so far not needing them.

[Sid]

My situation is probably different than most as all my snakes are in the "reptile room". It has a seperate heat/air unit from the remainder of the house, so 75 to 80 day time the year round and 65 to 70 at night. I only use heat pads or lamps when I have a problem feeder. The extra heat seems to help in those situations.

[adamanteus]

I only use heat pads or lamps when I have a problem feeder. The extra heat seems to help in those situations.


I also have found that an increase in temperature (and humidity) can help to 'kick-start' problem feeders.

[reptile3]

I also have found that an increase in temperature (and humidity) can help to 'kick-start' problem feeders.

very interesting...

[drache]

as Stefan said - in the wild they are able to thermoregulate (pick how warm/cold they like it by choosing location)
my first thought upon reading your post was that the snake may want another hiding place that's not as warm
some of my snakes out on the sun porch for brumation are active and about at 50º (the parietalis and the pallidulus specifically), so I wouldn't worry about them freezing in any conditions where a human is still comfortable hanging out without puffy outerwear
my house is kept in the low to mid seventies and most tanks get a basking bulb with a branch underneath, so the snakes can pick how close to the heat they want to be

[dashnu]

I use only heating pads and fluorescent bulbs (lights are not really designed to heat). Toss a hide over the warm spot and a hide over the cool side and watch and learn. You will see a pattern or at least I have with all mine. No night lights for me A good heating pad is all you need, my fluorescent bulbs bring up the ambient air temp during the day a bit.

Long of the short, and in my experience garters can do just fine in a wide range of temps.

[infernalis]

My perception on thermo-regulation is as follows.

Even we thermo-regulate in a way, even though mammals are warm blooded.

When we feel hot we seek shade, when we feel cold we seek warmth.

Same concept applies to the snakes, regulation of body temperature.

It is far more crucial to a cold blooded creature than a warm blooded one.

Now if we find a comfortable temperature, do we not stay put?

At night, the temperatures outside dip by a wide margin, so the snakes cool down. In the morning when the sun comes out, the snakes will bask in the AM sun to bring their own body temperatures up to reach the comfort zone they desire.

When the sun gets too hot, they will seek shade to cool back down.

Why not just keep it comfortable all the time?

My own personal collection of Thamnophis has been thriving and doing well without the use of gradients, as have several other members who are more experienced than I am.

If there is any data that proves conclusively that no gradients is detrimental to the animals health, please be so kind as to point the way so I can view it, and perhaps change my way of thinking.

[anji1971]

Mine have a small heat mat in one end of the tank, but I find they rarely use it. They seem to be most happy in the rest of the tank at normal room temp, which is 70F. I'm not so convinced that they care much about gradient either. However, that's probably more important for the species that live in naturally warmer areas. My Canadian snakes can handle pretty low temperatures. I find the wild ones out and about in 50F here, and they seem perfectly content.

[IndigoBug1987]

oK i was just looking at slithers and sometimes she lays in her water bowl. she's doing it now the thermometer says 75 and her 'humidity' thermometer says 60. is it too hot in there?

[jitami]

Nope, they just do that :D

[IndigoBug1987]

ok thanks!

[brain]

Very true Stefan.

Thermo-regulation implies that when they are too warm, they seek a cooler place to be, and when too cold they seek a warmer place to be.

To cover my arse, I included the line.... "There is a mixture of opinions on the forum":D

Most heat sources I have tried were rather ignored by the garters.

Our whole house is an average of 80F.

So then my room heating thoughts are not just of my own.

You also don’t pay particular attention to the heating of a habitat unless the snake comes from an arid region.

i.e.: my flame boas have a heat pad under the tank, water only as the dish dries out and natural light.

Then IYO would the same hold true for the habitats of garters? In regards to heating is there any science backing “this must have heat lamp” propaganda.

Some of my snakes do have heat pads but for the most part I adjust the entire room temp in the summer as well as the winter. I do keep checks on the individual temps of the snake via ReyTec and adjust accordingly.

Now the rats and mice don’t really appreciate the temp adjust …lol. I see them really slow down reproduction as we get into winter and maintain a room temp of 79 deg. The little buggers want to hibernate, but not on my watch.:cool:

[Stefan-A]

In regards to heating is there any science backing “this must have heat lamp” propaganda.
Well, the science in this context would be that they do seek out the best available temperature, depending on their needs, in the wild. But sure, the possibility of a good compromise isn't excluded. However, the lack of a heat gradient should also increase the risk of dehydration and heat stroke.

[brain]

However, the lack of a heat gradient should also increase the risk of dehydration and heat stroke.

Point taken. As with living things water is important. So I do keep that offer in all my habitats. TY:p

[brain]

My perception on thermo-regulation is as follows.

Even we thermo-regulate in a way, even though mammals are warm blooded.

When we feel hot we seek shade, when we feel cold we seek warmth.

Same concept applies to the snakes, regulation of body temperature.

It is far more crucial to a cold blooded creature than a warm blooded one.

Now if we find a comfortable temperature, do we not stay put?

At night, the temperatures outside dip by a wide margin, so the snakes cool down. In the morning when the sun comes out, the snakes will bask in the AM sun to bring their own body temperatures up to reach the comfort zone they desire.

When the sun gets too hot, they will seek shade to cool back down.

Why not just keep it comfortable all the time?

My own personal collection of Thamnophis has been thriving and doing well without the use of gradients, as have several other members who are more experienced than I am.

If there is any data that proves conclusively that no gradients is detrimental to the animals health, please be so kind as to point the way so I can view it, and perhaps change my way of thinking.

You read my mine Wayne
Hey we went to the same high school ... :o

[infernalis]

Yes, My tropical Cyclophiops Major (Limon) has "Ground heat" and requires misting of his cage.

When he feels the need, I have seen him go down low to the substrate, he spends a lot of time up high, and I ALWAYS make sure his water bowl has plenty of water in it.

Well, they all get a fresh water change daily.

The Python, Pueblan and Savannah monitor are all closest to the heat radiators (I despise forced air heat, and will never use it) the Garters, Dekayi snakes and eastern milks are located the furthest from the heat radiators.

Everyone has been fine.