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Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 11:58 AM

Hello

I'm looking into purchasing a garter snake. I've googled them several times, but I've read a lot of conflicting information. So I thought maybe I could get some clear answers from some of you out there.

1.) Is a 40 gallon tank ok for 1 garter?
-will baby/juvenile garteres get overwhelmed by the size, or wil it be comfy for them?

2.) What should warm/cool side temperatures be?
-do they need Under tank heaters?
-can I just place a heat bulb on the screen above where the warm side is suppost to be?

3.) List easy to find feeders for garters please.

4.) Is handling an option?
-If so, how do you go about approaching the snake, and at what age?

5.) What should the humidity be in the tank for a proper shed?

adamanteus

11-09-2008, 12:22 PM

Hi Austin, and welcome to the forum.:)
You should find all the answers to your questions right here.... http://www.thamnophis.com/caresheets/index.php?title=Garter_Snake_Care_Sheet

But to answer these initial questions...

1. A 40 gallon will be fine for one Garter, a baby won't be concerned by it's size as long as sufficient hides are provided.

2. Temperature gradient from low seventies to high eighties is ideal, but these are very cold tolerant animals so don't worry too much.

3. Trout, salmon, earthworms, pinky mice.

4. There are (at least) two schools of thought on this. Personally I don't handle unnecessarily, others do. Most Garters will certainly tolerate handling with no ill effects.

5. I don't measure humidity, if the tank is provided with a drinking vessel large enough for the snake to get in, and the temperatures are right, then the humidity should take care of itself.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 12:42 PM

ok thanks, I'll look over the care sheet.

Does every single post need to be looked over by a moderator to be shown to others? Isn't that a lot of work for moderators...?

adamanteus

11-09-2008, 12:46 PM

Does every single post need to be looked over by a moderator to be shown to others?

Just the first few, then you're free to post!:)

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 12:48 PM

Welcome aboard, Austin. :)

Sid

11-09-2008, 12:52 PM

Welcome to the forum, Austin.

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 12:53 PM

Welcome, 'Duck! I'm one o'those "handle unnecessarily" kind'a folks James referred to.

However, I have learned my lesson (QUIT LAUGHING, YOU GUYS!) and now wait much longer before I handle and cuddle and snuggle. Like, instead of immediately pestering a new kid I'll wait - depending on mein of the kid - as long as days w/o handling. I'm more open to guaging the 'personalities' of the snakes and am better at subliminating my needs to theirs.

That said, I handle a lot. I don't handle until approx 24 +/- hours after eating. And I only handle until the kids go nutz - which is only minutes - and then I put them back. Snakes I've had awhile I may handle about two or so minutes two to three times a day. Newer snakes, once a day or once every other day. Depends upon the kids. I now let them guide me vs. me forcing them.

Other than that, I'm hand in glove with James.

Welcome! Nice you found us and you will LOVE your garter!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:19 PM

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 01:26 PM

Oh, lord!

Someone help this guy plugs his holes! I'm having heart palpatations!

Good to know that soon I'll be able to post whenever I want...;)

There are a few spots in the 40 gallon that have open holes, any ideas for closing them up?

What i mean is the top is 2 screens. One screen covers half the tank, the 2nd screen covers the other half. They don't exactly fit together perfectly, so there are a few small, gaps.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:29 PM

Yeh someone help me! ;)

mtolypetsupply

11-09-2008, 01:33 PM

Welcome! You've found a GREAT bunch of people here, not only *very* knowledgeable, but kind, patient, fun and a whole lot of other good qualities too!

I'm new to garters too, and I'm a "handle unnecessarily" person. I too, go by their reactions. Ernestine calms down rather quickly, and is perfectly content to cuddle in your hand. In fact, I get uncomfortable with having an unusable hand in a cramped position, before she's ready to leave me! I've had to "dump" (gently of course) her in the enclosure, rather than her slither off me! James, on the other hand, is a little more ADHD. :) He'll hang out, but would rather be in the enclosure. He'll slither off as soon as you lower your hand in the tank.

Feeders are easy... look on the classified section here. :)

Check out the "Enclosures" Section of the forum, if you want to see some examples of how people create display tanks.

I'm cheap- I use a work lamp from a home improvement store with a 40w incandescent bulb in it for a heat source. My basking side gets around 80-90, depending on how hot my house gets, with room temps on the cool side. They move about as they desire, and seem to be enjoying the environs I have created.

Humidity, I have a humidity gauge, and it stays around 40-50% in there with no misting or outside sources of humidity. Read the thread about winter preparations for info regarding indoor heating and humidity concerns.

Lastly, be careful!!! These little guys are totally addictive! Once you have one, you'll be searching for ways to get more! I'm on a waiting list for more Florida Blues now!!!!!

Can't wait to see pics of your new bundles of joy, when they arrive!!!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:35 PM

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 01:36 PM

Good to know that soon I'll be able to post whenever I want...;)

There are a few spots in the 40 gallon that have open holes, any ideas for closing them up?

What i mean is the top is 2 screens. One screen covers half the tank, the 2nd screen covers the other half. They don't exactly fit together perfectly, so there are a few small, gaps.

Got pictures?

You can glue a strip of anything (e.g. plywood, plastic, aluminium or whatever you can get your hands on) underneath one of the pieces, so that it covers the gap.

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/photos/snakesies08/enclosures/eggsample.jpg

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:39 PM

Stefan, that helps a lot, thanks. Now that I think about it, I should've thought of that myself! =p.

That solves it, I should be able to do that and cover up the hole..

How often do baby/juveniles eat worms and/or pinkies?(or fish)

PS- The picture you drew looks exactly like my tank, thanks =)

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 01:40 PM

Stephiy, don't! (whine) Quit warning the the guy about addiction. (whine, whine)

Like, GIVE ME A BREAK! Let him get hooked - he DESERVIES IT. Don't warn him in advance (whine). He's no better than the rest o'us and deserves the excitement of wanting/getting more, more, MORE. Rearranging the house, going in debt, having more pinkes/mice in the freezer than ice cream, watching craigslist hourly for cheap tanks....

HUSH!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:41 PM

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 01:42 PM

How often do baby/juveniles eat worms and/or pinkies?(or fish)
I think most of us feed the young ones 2-3 times a week, adults 1-2 times.

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 01:42 PM

Aaaaahhhhh...

Welcome to the 12 X Bazillion Step Reptile Program.

THANK GODS YOU'RE NORMAL! LOL!!!

mtolypetsupply

11-09-2008, 01:43 PM

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 01:49 PM

Yeah, Stephie. He THINKS things were BAD with turtles and geckos ... HA! Silly boy!

He ain't seen nuttin' yet, HAS HE? Hehehehehehehe!

WOOT!

"Another one bites the dust. Another one bitest the dust. And another one gone... Another one gone. Another one bites the dust!"

(hysterically laughing evily...........)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 01:56 PM

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 02:07 PM

Your all crazy....

Anyways, do snakes stop eating once they're not hungry? About how many worms/fishies do you feed per feeding?

Also, if/when you feed pinkies, how long should you wait till the next feeding?

PS- Forgot to add that I like crazy...;)
Most of the time, they'll stop when they're full. Other times they'll eat 'till they puke. It depends on the snake and the mode it's in.

Personally, I try to go by bodyweight (mice 5-10% of the snake's weight per week, fish ~10-20%), but others feed them all they will eat.

reptile3

11-09-2008, 02:18 PM

Hello & Welcome Austin~

We are all crazy here..LOL Well at least I know I AM!!:rolleyes:

guidofatherof5

11-09-2008, 02:24 PM

Welcome, Nice to have you join us. Lots of caring people to help with questions and concerns.

Snake lover 3-25

11-09-2008, 02:26 PM

Welcome, 'Duck! I'm one o'those "handle unnecessarily" kind'a folks James referred to.

I'm a "handle unnecessarily" person.

me too.... my adult female meadow will come up to the top of the cage when i walk by and will try to force her way out of i don't take her out lol i have her around my neck pretty much the entire time i am at home.... multiple hours at a time..... like right now:D i'm with james on the others on all the rest

hello and welcome to the forum:D

o yeah and about addiction it really is true lol thankfully for me, my parents have forbid me from getting any more:eek: lol others aren't so lucky:p although i have gone from 2 to 4 in the few months since i have joined.......:rolleyes: good luck with that:p

reptile3

11-09-2008, 02:29 PM

o yeah and about addiction it really is true lol thankfully for me, my parents have forbid me from getting any more:eek: lol others aren't so lucky:p although i have gone from 2 to 4 in the few months since i have joined.......:rolleyes: good luck with that:p

Shanley, I have the same problem.. I have to hide my snakes coming in from hubby!! He thought I had only one garter. I have the one garter & 2 dekayi's, & 4 more snakes coming to me. LOL I am not addicted... well wait, maybe I am!!

Snake lover 3-25

11-09-2008, 02:40 PM

lol :D

infernalis

11-09-2008, 03:25 PM

Any ideas on how to block the holes?

Get clever, try anything BUT tape....

A piece of wood, plexiglas, anything that blocks escape will work.

Welcome aboard....

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 04:47 PM

I Think I'll try a ruler. There just the right width and just a bit short of the gap I need to cover. So I'll just use 2.

oh yes, are you supposed to dust garter snakes food with calcium? or is that not not necessary

adamanteus

11-09-2008, 04:55 PM

That would depend on the diet you're offering. If you can get them onto pinkies quite quickly, supplements are not really necessary... if however you're using fish strips without bone, guts etc. they're essential.

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 05:00 PM

I Think I'll try a ruler. There just the right width and just a bit short of the gap I need to cover. So I'll just use 2.
Just remember, if there's a hole big enough for them to squeeze through, they'll find it, reach it and use it. :) And they'll push lighter objects aside.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 05:31 PM

okay =).

Can you feed live guppies? like just plopping them in a bowl in the tank and let em flop around?

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 05:36 PM

Can you feed live guppies? like just plopping them in a bowl in the tank and let em flop around?
Sure, why not. I prefer to use frozen/thawed fish, though. :)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 05:40 PM

mm okay =).

I found the middle bar that goes in the middle of the screens. But one of the screens is to big so it doesn't really work, I guess I'll have to go with the ruler anyways...

So at what length do you find your garters start to have interest in pinkies?

Lori P

11-09-2008, 05:44 PM

I haven't ordered any yet, and I won't be. I have LLLReptiles in 10minute drive. Also a LPS which also sells them. So I'll just buy one from one of those places. When I do buy some, I'll make sure to share =).

Any ideas on how to block the holes?

Hey, could you shoot over there tomorrow and see what the heck is taking so long with my supply order?? LOL!!!!!!

Welcome, hope you enjoy it here!:)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 05:49 PM

Lol okay I'll check up on that for you! ;).

Another question....do garter snakes fight if there are 2 males together?

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 05:53 PM

So at what length do you find your garters start to have interest in pinkies?
You can start them on pinkie parts right away.

Another question....do garter snakes fight if there are 2 males together?
In a word, no. :)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:05 PM

what about full pinkies...

and with pinkie parts...do you just take a serrated knife...and cut away?

Lori P

11-09-2008, 06:11 PM

I use scissors. Usually when they are still frozen.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:14 PM

Sounds gross, I'll stick with worms/fish until hes big enough to eat full pinkies...

Unless, of course, he won't eat, then I'll try the pinkie parts...Lol.

Could a 24inch garter eat a full pinkie?

reptile3

11-09-2008, 06:14 PM

what about full pinkies...

and with pinkie parts...do you just take a serrated knife...and cut away?

they say to cut in strips.. less mess if it's still somewhat frozen.

" I just learned a month & half ago "

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 06:15 PM

what about full pinkies...
No idea. When they're big enough. :D

and with pinkie parts...do you just take a serrated knife...and cut away?
I use scissors, others cut them with a knife while the pinkies are still frozen. You cut them lengthwise.

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/extra/halfapinkie.jpg

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:15 PM

ok thanks..

A bit more of a random question, is there anyway for me to change the text "I'm new here!"?

(Ex.- "Third shed, a success")

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 06:16 PM

ok thanks..

A bit more of a random question, is there anyway for me to change the text "I'm new here!"?

(Ex.- "Third shed, a success")
Yeah, make more posts. :) Once you reach 1000, you get to pick your own.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:23 PM

Oh my god...1,000? That'll take forever! lol!.

I'm just playing I really don't mind.

Do any of you know if guppies are easy to breed? Instead of going to the petstore every few weeks can I just fill up a 5 gallon with water and get a filter and feed guppies fish food? Then maybe they'll breed and I can just scoop them out of there with a net and feed them!?!? :)

drache

11-09-2008, 06:44 PM

hi Austin
welcome to the forum
if you cut the pinks while they're still frozen, it's not messy at all

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:47 PM

Good to know, If I have to do things that are messy I will, just rather avoid it.

Is care fresh (Is that right...can't remember) a good substrate? Is it sold at most petcos?

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 06:49 PM

Do any of you know if guppies are easy to breed? Instead of going to the petstore every few weeks can I just fill up a 5 gallon with water and get a filter and feed guppies fish food? Then maybe they'll breed and I can just scoop them out of there with a net and feed them!?!? :)
They are easy to breed, but it'll take about 4 weeks until they give birth and then a few months before the guppies are big enough. And you'll need a much bigger tank than a 5 gallon, or you won't be able to produce enough fish. The bigger the better. And you'll need more tanks for the babies because the adults will eat them. Unless you have a very large tank with a lot of vegetation. :)

You have to ask yourself whether it's worth the trouble. My conclusion was that it wasn't worth it.

Lori P

11-09-2008, 06:50 PM

I like the Carefresh. Petco does have it. :-)

As for breeding guppies, I tried it, and found they just grew too slow for me. I kept needing bigger feeder fish NOW. lol

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:54 PM

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 06:59 PM

I want one of these maybe, what kind is this? Eastern?

Google Image Result for http://64.246.185.20/images/garter_snake_c.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://64.246.185.20/images/garter_snake_c.jpg&imgrefurl=http://shantelleluvsya.buzznet.com/user/journal/&h=333&w=500&sz=27&hl=en&start=2&um=1&usg=__vCS4xZ5dUstk3iho6nA5Co-ivQE=&tbnid=C5UEPW6gD-Bv6M:&tbnh=87&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dgarter%2Bsnakes%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26 rlz%3D1G1GGLQ_ENUS301%26sa%3DN)

Stefan-A

11-09-2008, 07:00 PM

Just for reference, what size of tank did you put the guppies in? How many did you start off with?

Also, is there anything special you need to do to breed them? Or just keep them together and they'll do fine?
The last time I think it was a 90 litre tank. I don't remember how many I started out with.

There's not much that needs to be done. Keep the conditions right and at least 2 females per male.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 07:01 PM

EDIT- Screw it, just looked up breeding guppies, I'm not made for that stuff.

Can you feed worms,minnows, and pinkys as a stable diet?

infernalis

11-09-2008, 07:31 PM

Once converted to pinky mice, I prefer to feed mostly that.

I have noticed that my pink eaters grow faster, seem stronger and are easier to maintain.

Some frozen fish fillet for a treat and an occasional night crawler...

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 07:32 PM

ooh okay =)

So at what size do you reccomend to start feeding pinkies to garters?(the snake, not the mouse).

infernalis

11-09-2008, 07:43 PM

Some of us who breed hold a few back and let them grow before sending them along.

We had a lady join the forum this summer looking for her first garter snake, she got 2 yearling garters, so all the strange baby behavior was over before she started.

One of my male garters is around 10 inches and he eats whole pinks without any problem.

A lot of the others (Juveniles) are eating pinky mice split in half before feeding.

So anywhere from a few months old on up is a better bet if you want to spare yourself many of the trials that come along with rearing babies.

8 inches or more is a good size to begin pinky mice. (10-12 even better)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 07:45 PM

Sounds good.

Theres a garter in the LPS near me. It's black with kind of a yellow stripe going down the side. What could this be? It looks really bright because it had a full shed. I looked in and there was a huge shed in there.

infernalis

11-09-2008, 07:48 PM

Your picture looks like an eastern, Locality would help since the picture is not really detailed.

I was back tracking your other questions, looks like a few there:)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 07:50 PM

My picture, you mean what I described?

It may have been a tanish/yellowish line going down the side,having trouble remembering.

Locality...?

infernalis

11-09-2008, 08:19 PM

My picture, you mean what I described?

Post number 51 just above this, you posted a link to a google image and asked if it was an eastern.

It may have been a tanish/yellowish line going down the side,having trouble remembering.

Locality...?

Where the original snake was caught

Many garters have very similar markings, where they originate from aids in species identification.:D

The term Garter snake was derived from the lateral stripes resembling a "Garter" (stocking straps)

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 08:42 PM

This me? If so, THANKS! Nice to be called a lady - though I'll be the first to admit I'm not very lady like... But nice o'you, Dekay, to label me as such!

And I, for one, am a certifiable Chief Head-Loony. Typing with my nose right now due to the straight jacket...

Dekay! You forgot to mention cutting the night crawlers up so they don't wiggle through the snake and come out the other end! YIKES!

And... Just to set the record straight... Peepers and Jeepers STILL act like little kids and are just as nutz and strange as I am! :)

We had a lady join the forum this summer looking for her first garter snake, she got 2 yearling garters, so all the strange baby behavior was over before she started.

anji1971

11-09-2008, 09:22 PM

Hello and welcome to the forum!
I think this is the busiest welcome thread I've ever seen........:D

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 09:28 PM

Thanks guys

I think the snake was bred by a breeder. This petstore gets most of its animals from local breeders.

Anji,I was thinking the same thing. I haven't been on this forum for long, but 7 pages in just a few hours lol.

I've been thinking,"wow, people respond very fast on this forum" =)

anji1971

11-09-2008, 09:31 PM

And you thought your first 1000 posts would take forever.
You may just set a record if you keep up this pace!;)

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 09:40 PM

Duck, this is about the only place we let off passion. I can't talk about my sniglettes with anyone by my fiends here. Nobuddy I know personally likes snakes.

Well, Hillbilly Jo and Dave, the Naturalist at the park, THEY do. But I only get to see them when I work at the park.

I LIVE for my weekends when I can cuddle and pester and bother my babies. And while I do that I sit here and jabber with everyone. What's cool is since we're from all over the world SUMBUDDY's up and awake no matter what time you get on!

Very very cool, yup.

And, Duck, you had a LOT of questions to be answered and answers have been tossed in with the howdy-doos.

I'm also here as soon as I get home from work. I'm single, an only child, no living 'rents, no family - near me or I want to deal with anyway... So my pets (cats and two Pugs as well as the snakes) are my life.

Yeah. I need a life. But, hay! I'm happier'un flies on snake poo!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 09:40 PM

And you thought your first 1000 posts would take forever.
You may just set a record if you keep up this pace!;)

Lol, I just might :p

A question if you will...Not sure if you'll be able to answer, just thought I'd try.

If I construct a pond in my garters tank, how do I get the cable out (from the filter) without creating gaps for a garter to escape?

To clarify.... The cable that runs the filter, and plugs into the outlit. I'd need to go from inside of the tank to the outlit. I'm not sure on how to get it out without creating a hole, which a snake could escape from, any ideas?

- If you still don't understand, just ask for some more clarification.

anji1971

11-09-2008, 09:46 PM

The only thing I can think of is using duct tape on the OUTSIDE of the tank around the hole. Silicone would seal it but then everytime you need to get in there you'd have to peel it apart and reseal. Duct tape's quicker!
Someone else may have better ideas though. I've never used a filtered water feature in my tank. Just a good old plastic tub.:)

Just make sure if you use duct tape you check that all sticky parts are well away from possible snake contact!

reptile3

11-09-2008, 09:46 PM

If I had no hubby or kids... I would have a house full of animals, reptiles & fish!!! LOL Apparently I need a life too! Hubby walks by & says... you are always looking at snakes, is that all you think about?, & I say....

YES!!! he he:D

Duck, this is about the only place we let off passion. I can't talk about my sniglettes with anyone by my fiends here. Nobuddy I know personally likes snakes.

Well, Hillbilly Jo and Dave, the Naturalist at the park, THEY do. But I only get to see them when I work at the park.

I LIVE for my weekends when I can cuddle and pester and bother my babies. And while I do that I sit here and jabber with everyone. What's cool is since we're from all over the world SUMBUDDY's up and awake no matter what time you get on!

Very very cool, yup.

And, Duck, you had a LOT of questions to be answered and answers have been tossed in with the howdy-doos.

I'm also here as soon as I get home from work. I'm single, an only child, no living 'rents, no family - near me or I want to deal with anyway... So my pets (cats and two Pugs as well as the snakes) are my life.

Yeah. I need a life. But, hay! I'm happier'un flies on snake poo!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 09:48 PM

Anji, I'm not quite clear on what your talking about.

Cut a whole in the duct tape? Then run the wire through there?

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 09:49 PM

Hello and welcome to the forum!
I think this is the busiest welcome thread I've ever seen........:D

We'll, it'll certaintly provide alot of answers (hopefully...) for other new comers :)

anji1971

11-09-2008, 09:51 PM

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 09:51 PM

Stefie... You may never have any MORE kids if you don't get outta this forum and away from the 'puter!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ROFLOLPMP!!!

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 09:54 PM

Well, if you have to cut a hole in somewhere in the tank or lid and run the cable out through it, then you tape up around the cable where it comes out the hole. Like I said, I'm just winging it here. Not really sure how to describe it better........:o

I understand now. That seems like it'd work, but, it also seems like it'd leave a bit of space for a snake to get stuck on the tape.

I wonder how I could get rid of that problem.

anji1971

11-09-2008, 09:58 PM

Use more tape on the inside facing the sticky part. Back to back kinda thing. Or stick some paper on the sticky parts.

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 10:00 PM

Then it wouldn't stick to where I wanted it to stick though. Because the sticky parts would be gone.

infernalis

11-09-2008, 10:03 PM

anji1971

11-09-2008, 10:04 PM

Well, then.
Ummmm.................I guess I dunno.:confused:
Unless I can see exactly what it is you're doing, that is. I'm much better at MacGyvering things with a visual!:D

mtolypetsupply

11-09-2008, 10:24 PM

... my fiends here.

Fiends? Freudian slip a little???:D

Garter_Gertie

11-09-2008, 10:28 PM

Not at all! LOL!!! Just my way of not being as guishy and huggy-lovey [as I really am] and being less serious. :)

Sitting_duck

11-09-2008, 10:40 PM

Fashion a hinge from the tape, Connect the two halves, use duct tape on both sides facing into itself.

Then trim with scissors to make sure no sticky stuff is showing, now just rock the left side over to the right to gain access...

Or is this not the cover anymore??

I'm confused, this is not the cover from the snake escaping out of the screens. but thanks if that's what you were explaining.

We're now on the subject of a filter. If I use a filtered pond in my tank, how can i get the wiring out without leaving a hole open that a snake could escape through?

infernalis

11-10-2008, 04:13 AM

Thats easy, If you make the cover hinge just as explained, cut a small slit in the duct tape, and pass the cord through the small slit, then a strip over that to seal it up.

Snakes just love power cords, they wrap around them like a cork screw and climb right up.

http://www.reformedsniper.net/sn/casper1.jpg

anji1971

11-10-2008, 08:06 AM

Well now.
Wayne just managed to explain that in a couple short sentences. Now even I know what I was trying to say!:D

adamanteus

11-10-2008, 09:13 AM

Can't you just drill a hole the exact diameter of the wire, then pass it through?

Stefan-A

11-10-2008, 09:20 AM

Can't you just drill a hole the exact diameter of the wire, then pass it through?
What about the plug?

adamanteus

11-10-2008, 09:22 AM

Cut it off, re-wire it.

infernalis

11-10-2008, 09:40 AM

Cut it off, re-wire it.

That's better left to qualified electricians or handy folks who will ensure correct polarity on the rewire.

Drilling glass can be a challenge in itself as well.:eek:

But that's just my humble opinion...

adamanteus

11-10-2008, 09:46 AM

I meant to drill through the timber of the top, not the glass.
Are there really people who can't fit a plug?:eek:

infernalis

11-10-2008, 09:51 AM

I recall a post in July from a guy who spoke of his snake getting electrocuted by touching the base of it's own basking lamp.

Since US wiring code requires that only the centre pin of the lamp base be connected to the hot side and the outer base is to be connected to earth ground, the snakes demise was undoubtedly caused by incorrect wiring.

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 05:10 PM

DekayBrown, I'm having trouble understanding the hinge your talking about, care to elaborate?

infernalis

11-10-2008, 05:44 PM

Snake lover 3-25

11-10-2008, 05:47 PM

oooooo lol even i didn't get it lol can you draw a pic???

jitami

11-10-2008, 06:47 PM

At the onset of the conversation there was discussion of how to bridge a gap between two screen covers that fell just a couple inches short of fully covering the top.

I described a way to simultaneously bridge the gap and pass a cord through it at effectively killing two birds with one stone.

Oh my goodness... WELCOME!!!

And Yeah, I finally, 7 pages later, got what Wayne was talking about here! Wow...

Let's see if I can explain it... ok, so the gap, where you were going to use the ruler, instead of the ruler, use duct tape sticking the edge to each half of the screen on the bottom and then do the same on the top, basically making a bridge/hinge out of duct tape with the sticky sides facing each other... then cut a slit just long enough to fit the plug through, push the plug through, and then close the slit with a bit more duct tape... right Wayne?

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 07:37 PM

Jitami, thanks for the explanation. I understand it a bit better now. I don't understand how I would slide the screens if I did his idea...

jitami

11-10-2008, 07:40 PM

Do the screens slide into a grove, from like front to back? Or does one screen slide on top of the other? Yeah, that wouldn't work... I think Wayne was thinking you could use the tape as a hinge and just lift one side up to access the tank.

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 07:41 PM

The screens slide into grooves.. So you can't just lift them up, you have to slide them out.

jitami

11-10-2008, 07:44 PM

Gotcha... could both pieces be slid out together? Both of my sliding screens slide toward the long side of the tank and Wayne's idea would still work ok there... they wouldn't hinge, but should be able to slide. Just put the cord at the "back" side where it doesn't have to come all the way out of the grooves to give you full access to the tank.

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 07:50 PM

Both screens can slide. They slide away from the tank. Not onto one another, just to clear things up.

edit- is anyone in favor of some pictures?

Snake lover 3-25

11-10-2008, 07:52 PM

i sure am lol :confused:

anji1971

11-10-2008, 07:52 PM

Pictures would help immensely.;)

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 07:57 PM

Here they come :)

the 2 screens, while covering the top of the tank...
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/40gallon001.jpg

one screen halfway off(they can go all the way off)-this is to show which way they slide
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/40gallon002.jpg

both screens
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/40gallon003.jpg
the gap which I had the idea to fill with a ruler.
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/40gallon004.jpg

Snake lover 3-25

11-10-2008, 08:01 PM

ok thanks:D that sure makes things easier lol now if wayne would just post pics of what he was talking about we'd be all set lol:D

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 08:05 PM

Ha yes =-)

Do you see how they set into the grooves?

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 08:06 PM

http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/Leopardgecko004.jpg

oh-this is a gartersnake forum? my bad...;)

Ps- Thats my leopard gecko =)

anji1971

11-10-2008, 08:09 PM

Oh, I like the leopard gecko!:cool:
As for the screen, I know in my head what I'd do with it, but I'm not sure I can explain it without writing a full page essay and confusing the daylights out of myself and everyone else. :o
I'll wait and see what Wayne has to say!

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 08:11 PM

Wayne...WAKE UP SLEEPY HEAD.

I have to go to BasketBall tryouts in an hour...so respond already =)

PS-I have no idea who wayne is, just thinks he might be sleeping.

infernalis

11-10-2008, 09:15 PM

OK the sliding thing does change perspective a bit.

A pine board secured along the middle would work. A ruler would be too flimsy to cut notches into it.

I had to get a cord into Limons cage, I cut a small groove in the edge of the wood, just enough for the cord to SLIDE into the notch.

reptile3

11-10-2008, 11:20 PM

awwwwww sooo cute!!!

http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp98/vivarium_pictures/Leopardgecko004.jpg

oh-this is a gartersnake forum? my bad...;)

Ps- Thats my leopard gecko =)

reptile3

11-10-2008, 11:21 PM

Wayne...WAKE UP SLEEPY HEAD.

I have to go to BasketBall tryouts in an hour...so respond already =)

PS-I have no idea who wayne is, just thinks he might be sleeping.

Wayne, is a very busy man!! Lots of snakies to look after, reptiles, kids etc.

reptile3

11-10-2008, 11:22 PM

Sorry, but for me... I would just forget about the screens

go buy a new tank & lid... oohh wait that is the lazy, spend money way!! ha ha

Sitting_duck

11-10-2008, 11:28 PM

Sorry, but for me... I would just forget about the screens

go buy a new tank & lid... oohh wait that is the lazy, spend money way!! ha ha

Well, I"m not going to buy a new tank. I could just buy a new lid. Or I could use the 10 gallon i have. but that seems a little small.

mtolypetsupply

11-11-2008, 07:57 AM

Hey there duck!

I have a solution for your consideration on your screen issue. So long as the screens will be held together by pressure, why not use something softer and flexible like weather stripping (plastic or felt) or a gasketing material between the two??? Then you could add enough to make a tight enough seal so your babies don't get out, and when you squish (love my technical terms, right?) the screens together, it would have enough give not to pinch the cords of the filter.

Now, on exactly WHAT product to use, I cannot offer guidance. James and Ernestine are my first two garters, so I have not experienced the full wrath of what these little escape artists can do. :) I'm sure that people on this forum might be able to poke around their local home centers, next trip in, and make some suggestions on what would be firm enough.

I saw a thumbscrew on the top of one of the screens, if they don't hold together with pressure, you can always come up with a latch or something to hold them. We'll burn that bridge when we get there!

Snake lover 3-25

11-11-2008, 10:24 AM

Snake lover 3-25

11-11-2008, 10:26 AM

that's a pretty good idea stephi!!!:D i'd use it:D;)

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 11:33 AM

LOL snake how would I know...I have no idea who wayne is =p

The screw is to make it so nothing can push it out sideways, unless I just lift it up. It's hard for me to understand a lot of this, I'm more of a visual guy.

Of course, I could just screw the pond and just get a water dish. Then I wouldn't have to deal with the cord,just the gap between the screens, which is fixable.

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 06:39 PM

Everyone uses carefresh or snake "aspen" or something...

How come no one uses dirt? I'm sure wild snakes are on dirt all the time, and their population isn't downhilling because of impaction.

jitami

11-11-2008, 06:46 PM

I think some here use dirt/potting soil... for me the carefresh is just easier to take care of. Before that I used paper towels. I say whatever works for you and your snake(s) :)

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 07:13 PM

ok.

I'm giving up on the filtered pond idea. Going to take a bit more simple for my first garter. Do garters like to submerge themselves completely in water and swim? Or do they always have their heads out?

I got a big bag of aspen snake bedding. Going to start decorating, I still need to buy some decorations and something to tell me the humidity & temps...Right now all I have is those dial ones(left over from a different tank) and they're inaccurate. So I'll have to buy some digital kind.

anji1971

11-11-2008, 07:36 PM

Garters will both soak in the water with their head out, and swim around underneath. Just give yours a big enough water container to accomodate both. My girls have a 6x9 inch tub with a couple inches of water. All of them like to play around in it.

Snake lover 3-25

11-11-2008, 07:38 PM

i have one that loves to swim under water.... it's kind of strange bc he doesn't come up for long periods of time........ the other 2 don't even go in it.....????

go to micheals or a dollar store and get some fake plants:D they look great in the tanks:D

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 09:26 PM

No dollar stores around here, well, around 30minutes away, yes.

Will do about the fake plants though.

It's funny, a vine from michaels, 1-3$. A "reptile vine" from pet store, $9-11...

infernalis

11-11-2008, 09:38 PM

Out here EVERYTHING is a minimum of 30 minutes away.

anji1971

11-11-2008, 09:40 PM

And you have no idea how envious I am of that.;)

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 09:42 PM

I have 4 pet/reptile stores in 25 minutes of me where I live. 2 of which are in biking distance.

-The stores are...Petco, Petsmart, LLLreptiles, and a local pet store.

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 10:34 PM

Can I feed a garter snake meal worms? I don't know where to get earth worms, there are no bait stores near me. Do petstores sell earthworms? I could find some in my yard but it wouldn't be enough to feed a garter, I would only find 1-2 a week.

ssssnakeluvr

11-11-2008, 10:39 PM

nope...mealworms are insects...they don't eat insects. places like walmart sell worms in the sporting goods depts...make sure that you feed a variety with worms...not overly nutritious, need vitamin supplements if not....also, worms pass thru quickly!! leave big messes!! I use them a lot to get snakes onto pinkies....if they scarf worms real well, roll pinkies and parts in the worms and they will chow down!

Sitting_duck

11-11-2008, 11:00 PM

ok thanks =)

Once I get a garter, I"m planning to feed mostly minnows/guppies, and pinkies/pinkie parts.

Garter_Gertie

11-12-2008, 12:19 PM

Watch your "minnows." Make sure they're safe.

Sitting_duck

11-12-2008, 06:37 PM

Why would they not be?

mtolypetsupply

11-12-2008, 06:52 PM

Read this caresheet:

http://www.thamnophis.com/caresheets/index.php?title=Thiamin,

Sitting_duck

11-12-2008, 07:48 PM

Read this caresheet:

http://www.thamnophis.com/caresheets/index.php?title=Thiamin,

It says there is no text on that page, but, I've read through several sheets on thiamin over the past few days. I just didn't know minnows contained it, all it ever talks about is gold fish.

reptile3

11-12-2008, 08:22 PM

Out here EVERYTHING is a minimum of 30 minutes away.

well our pet stores are 30 min away, our 2 grocery stores are 2 min away, & wal mart.

reptile3

11-12-2008, 08:26 PM

It says there is no text on that page, but, I've read through several sheets on thiamin over the past few days. I just didn't know minnows contained it, all it ever talks about is gold fish.

here is the info

go to articles, then
Garter Snake Articles

Thiamin,

THIAMIN, THIAMINASE, & GOLDFISH

Thiamin (AKA. Thiamine, both spellings are correct) is simply a newer name for Vitamin B1. It is a member of the B-complex vitamins (see below), and it, like all B-complex vitamins, is water soluble. This means they dissolve in water, aren't stored in the body long-term, and are eliminated via urates and feces. Therefore, they must be constantly replaced via the diet (or by symbiotic bacteria in the GI tract). In humans, thiamin stores can become depleted within 14 days if additional thiamin isn't consumed. Since snakes have much lower metabolic rates and they've evolved to conserve water, they excrete less often than humans, so their passage rate for thiamin is much slower. This suggests they may eliminate thaimin much slower, but actual values are elusive.
Thiamin's roles (The biology): Thiamin works at multiple places within energy conversion pathways (Glycolysis and the Citric Acid cycle), and it's a critical component of neural/muscular function. Without thiamin, pyruvate cannot be converted to Acetyl-CoA, so glycolytic pathways may be shut down or severely impaired (remember that the amount of thiaminase present controls how much or how little thiamin remains, see below). It has other roles in energy production that I'll gloss over. The key point, however, is that thiamin has critical roles in converting potential energy (in the form of food) into an energy source that the body can use to perform work (i.e. ATP). What might this mean if an organisms lacks sufficient thiamin supplies? See the "symptoms" section below.
Enzyme overview (The biology): Enzymes do work, but in order to do work, they require energy. The primary source of energy in animals is a molecule with a huge name that is commonly referred to as ATP. ATP is made by a very complex series of events that take place in a highly organized fashion. These processes convert the chemical energy stored in food into an energy source that the body can use (ATP). ATP is the primary cellular currency! Its importance to living organisms cannot be overstated. Anything that interferes with the ability to produce ATP is a major threat to living systems.
Thiaminase is the name for a family of enzymes that all cut a portion of the thiamin molecule away, leaving a non-functional vitamin behind. Since each thiaminase enzyme can destroy perhaps tens of thousands (or more) thiamin molecules during it's lifetime, very little thiaminase is required to have devastating impacts. Once destroyed, the body cannot restore thiamin. One study showed that a diet with as little as 10% thiaminase (metabolizable energy) required thiamin supplementation to keep the animal healthy. Therefore, a diet with less than 10% thiaminase-containing food sources might be considered safe, but the exact ratio is unknown. To be safe, it is best to completely avoid feeding foods, including goldfish, that contain the thiaminase enzyme, but offering a goldfish (on rare occasion) isn't harmful. Many of the effects of thiaminase deficiency aren't noticeable until they reach dangerous levels because they occur internally. Furthermore, snakes are known for their ability to hide ailments, so diagnosing a problem in its early stages is even more difficult.

Sources: Thiaminase enzymes can be found in a variety of plants, fish, and shellfish. The National Academy of Science conducted a literature review and compiled a list of fish that either contain or lack thiaminase enzymes (link below). It should be reviewed before establishing a diet for your snakes composed entirely of fish. Of note, goldfish are one of the most common food items recommended by pet stores for garters, yet they CONTAIN the thiaminase enzyme. A diet primarily composed of goldfish results in severe thiamin deficiency in 6-9 months. Without B1 supplements, a varied diet, or removal of additional thiaminase from the diet, death preceded by convulsions, will occur.
Wide-spectrum antibiotics can also destroy gastrointestinal bacteria that produce B-vitamins, so supplementing the diet may be useful.

SYMPTOMS OF THIAMIN DEFICIENCY

Edema (swelling; can include swelling of the brain)
Enlarged heart
Abnormal heart arythmias (abnormal heartbeat pattern)
Heart failure
Weight loss and anorexia, despite hearty appetite and continued feeding
Weakness
Aching muscles / difficulty moving
Lethargy
Failure to respond to disturbance (walking by or opening the cage)
"Star gazing" head becomes pulled back, giving the appearance of looking at stars
Failure to reproduce
Paralysis
Convulsions / seizures
Death

TREATMENT

Garter snakes typically make a full recovery if the source of the thiaminase enzyme is removed from their diet, and the garters are placed on a proper diet (see general snake care caresheet).
Vitamin B1 supplementation is effective in all but the most advanced stages of the condition because organisms use both active absorption (requiring ATP production, which is being impaired by the presence of thiaminase) and passive absorption (not sufficient to overcome digestive absorption problems).
Advanced cases of thiamin deficiency require a veterinarian to inject thiamin directly into the snake. With treatment, snakes usually make a full recovery as long as the source of thiaminase is removed from their diet.

Sitting_duck

11-12-2008, 09:28 PM

Thank you.

Sitting_duck

11-13-2008, 08:48 PM

do do do do do do

infernalis

11-13-2008, 08:52 PM

Try this

Use

then the URL followed by

then your image will display on your signature.:D:D:D

like this......

http://incubators.dragcave.net/incubator_sitting_duck.png

Sitting_duck

11-13-2008, 09:08 PM

ahh, can't find out how.

I'll just leave it. I found this dragon thing out from another forum, just thought I'd check it out =p