Lookie who is gonna be mine!

[GartersRock]

I am so happy. Look what I am getting. :D:D:D:D
So. I think it's either a TX or an eastern. I am hoping, hoping it's a TX. But do they range as far as east Louisiana?? Is there a scale count I could do?
http://gallery.kingsnake.com/data/67249garter_2-med.JPG

[Aundrea]

WOW Thats a very pretty garter :D

[adamanteus]

The scale counts would be the same, as both snakes are sub-species of sirtalis.
T. s. annectans (the Texas) ranges across East Central Texas, West Central Oklahoma and South Western Kansas.

[Stefan-A]

Could be either, but it's definitely no plains garter. ;)

[Sid]

whether it's eastern or Texas...very nice speciman. Congratulations.:)

[GartersRock]

Oh yeah. Duh. Same species. :p
Well, could I assume this is a TX? Has anyone seen any easterns that look like this with that top stripe?
Thanks! She's a gorgeous one!

[adamanteus]

Amanda, it looks like annectans to me...... but I've only ever seen them in photographs, I'm afraid.:(

[GartersRock]

Well I think I will call her that. ;)
Me too. :( And I even live in their range. I am making it a point to go out next season and FIND those blacknecks and TX garters. Need to take advantage of my location. lol

[crzy_kevo]

congrats amanda that guy is beautiful

[Stefan-A]

Amanda, it looks like annectans to me...... but I've only ever seen them in photographs, I'm afraid.:(
"annectens", James. ;)

[GartersRock]

Ooooooooooooo................ :p

[adamanteus]

"annectens", James. ;)

I knew that!:D

[Stefan-A]

Sure, you were just testing. ;)

[Garter_Gertie]

BEAUTIFUL, 'Rockster! Those three colors make a nice snake.

[reptile3]

oohhhh very nice garter....:)

[Zephyr]

Wow, what an interesting specimen. XD

...
Have we considered the possibility of a hybrid?

[adamanteus]

Have we considered the possibility of a hybrid?

A hybrid of what, Kyle? What are you thinking?

[Stefan-A]

Intergade would be possible.

[Zephyr]

A hybrid of what, Kyle? What are you thinking?
The tail and lower half of the body says radix/ sirtalis sirtalis "Florida blue" to me; the head says radix, and the overall coloration says sirtalis sirtalis.
I may just be seeing things though; I've only seen 3 pictures of annectens, but they all seemed to have that sirtalis look with the only difference being the dorsal stripe.

[adamanteus]

I can't see the radix in there, Kyle. Of course it's possible, but because of the locale the chances are it's annectens... it certainly looks like one to me.

[Stefan-A]

Hate to disagree with you there, Kyle, but that's pretty much how annectens looks.

[Zephyr]

I can't see the radix in there, Kyle. Of course it's possible, but because of the locale the chances are it's annectens... it certainly looks like one to me.East Lousiana... My Peterson field guide only shows annectens into Texas, with approximately 200 miles between them and easterns in Louisiana. However, I'm not seeing any plains ranging down into that area either.
If I had to give an ID I'd say a it's an oddly colored Florida blue or a mix between a standard eastern and a florida blue. (Both sirtalis sirtalis, so not an intergrade, more of a variety mix.)

[Zephyr]

Also, James, the only reason I though radix was because of the stripe. Then I remembered sirtalis sirtalis Florida blues seem to have that predominant stripe as well.

[Stefan-A]

http://www.springcreekforest.org/images/Texas-Garter-Snake.jpg

http://www.proctormuseum.us/Reptiles/Modern%20Reptiles/Modern%20Snakes/TexasGarterSnake-P0785-72dpi-26Apr%2705.jpg

There are better pictures in Strumpfbandnattern, but sadly I don't have it with me.

[adamanteus]

Me too. Where are you seeing 'Florida Blue'? My Florida Blues don't even have the same body form.... they're a pretty 'heavy bodied' sirtalis form.

[Zephyr]

http://s190.photobucket.com/albums/z257/americanwildlife/Reptile/Thamnophis_sirtalis_annect.jpg

[Zephyr]

Me too. Where are you seeing 'Florida Blue'? My Florida Blues don't even have the same body form.... they're a pretty 'heavy bodied' sirtalis form.The tail tapering coloration and the stripe.

If it was collected in Louisiana, especially the east, I highly, highly doubt it's annectens.

**EDIT- Also, I've never seen an annectens with brown coloration.

[adamanteus]

I'll be honest.... I can't really argue this much further.... I'm on the wrong side of the ocean, and I've never seen annectens 'in the flesh', but to me it looks like one. Plus, I kind of hope it is!:rolleyes:

[Zephyr]

Also... Apparently the lateral stripes envelope only scale row 3 with a bit of the stripe extending to 2 and a bit more predominantly onto 4. I see the brown coloration on row 1 in eastern garters all the time as well.

[Zephyr]

I'll be honest.... I can't really argue this much further.... I'm on the wrong side of the ocean, and I've never seen annectens 'in the flesh', but to me it looks like one. Plus, I kind of hope it is!:rolleyes:
Don't we all James. lol
I saw this one particularly striking specimen somebody found in his garage on Kingsnake once. It was like some one stuck a strip of glowing neon in the snake's spine.

[snakeman]

It looks like sirtilis sirtilis with a orange stripe.It happens all the time.

[GartersRock]

Florida blue?? I don't see any florida blue shape or anything. It's body type looks like annectens from local pics I have seen. And I have seen an annectens with the brown/rust colors.

Annectens have proven to be extremely uncommon and most people who see one wouldn't know the difference. So who is to say there isn't a small population in LA? Honestly, I still think it's annectens.

[adamanteus]

I also think this is annectens. Population distribution is poorly researched in many sub-species. I fail to understand why there is any doubt!

[Garter_Gertie]

I just trying to figure out WHY FL Blues would even WANT to go to TX? Ish. How could they be comfy with the total different bio? I don't know.

I don't know snakes by look(s) like the rest o'you guys... Isn't this a WC snake?

[Stefan-A]

I just trying to figure out WHY FL Blues would even WANT to go to TX?
Indeed, Texas is a red state. ;) :p

[Garter_Gertie]

"Outta The Mouths O'Idiots."

Who'da thunk?

[Sid]

I have had the pleasure of seeing a couple of T. s annectens first had. Both of them had high red dorsal strips and a "dark brown" ground color with very little checkering visable. Great looking specimens.

[GartersRock]

That too. Florida blue eastern in LA?

I am gonna stick w/sirtalis annectens. I can't WAIT till she gets here!!! :D:D

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

Sirtali Sirtalis do not normally come with an orange stripe. Not even most flames have an orange stripe. That snake definitely does not have a sirtalis sirtalis look to it. It's shape is the same... but I have come across 769365839062 and that does not resemble an eastern. The way the color fades to lighter as you go towards the tail and the bring orange stripe is saying t.s. annectens to me! If you study the way the light colors between the scales line up... well it's probably something only a detail artist can see but I don't see an eastern garter snake when I look at that photo. Maybe, possibly... an intergrade between the two? but I don't see a sirtalis.

it's definitely not a radix :D

[GartersRock]

I am a detail artist. :D:D I totally see what you are talking about.

[drache]

it's a lovely snake either way