Bad feeder fish??

[infernalis]

Yet another died last night.... sometime after feeding, found her dead this morning.

Goodbye Melanie.....

http://www.danceswithreptiles.com/eastern/mel.jpg


I halted feeding any more fish from the tank:mad:

chopped worms and pinky parts for now, until the mystery is solved.

[Aundrea]

awww gosh Wayne im so sorry!!! Wonder what is causing them to pass away? :( I hope no more passes away..

[Snake lover 3-25]

omg that really sucks..... so sorry:(

have any more eaten the fish lately???

[ssssnakeluvr]

real sorry Wayne!! have any others eaten the fish??? I am wondering if thats the problem???

[jitami]

Ugh... Wayne... I know this has to be taking a toll on you and I'm so very sorry. Any good herp vets near you who could perform an autopsy? With three babies now gone there has to be something going on. Hopefully it's something as easy to figure out as the fish... sigh... rip little Melanie....

[infernalis]

Here is a question that's burning at me.

I did observe that she swallowed her fish tail first.

Can the dorsal fin spines rupture the snake if swallowed tail first??

With the numbers of snakes we have, I had been setting up rows of feeding boxes, and dropping live fish in with each snake.

The Melanistic was a rabid feeder, and she would grab food right out of my hand, and it does look as if the fish was only 1/3 of the way down.

Maybe I should only tong feed dead fish??

If I remember correctly, Magma had just swallowed a live fish tail first when he died.

[Snake lover 3-25]

o no....... but i really hope that's what happened and not some kind of sickness....:(

[infernalis]

o no....... but i really hope that's what happened and not some kind of sickness....:(

With that in mind Shanley, they all did live in the same tank:(

There is only a baby red sided left. And I put him in there when Magma died.:eek:

The Radix babies, and snow eastern are seperate, and Masubius is alone.

he had chopped worm last night. no fish.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

Wayne.... that is heart breaking. I cannot even imagine how you feel right now losing babies like this. I keep my babies in threes too... I have had MANY garters swallow fish backwards and have never ever had one die from it.... maybe the fish are contaminated with something... I would have the dead snakes as well as some of the fish examined. I really hope for you that it is nothing contageous.... but maybe you should separate everyone for a while and do a mass stwrlization and quarantine for a while?

[infernalis]

Already done, and one foot out the door to go to petco for more glass....:eek:

[crzy_kevo]

man wayne that sucks hopefully it is the fish and the problem can be fixed

[Snake lover 3-25]

With that in mind Shanley, they all did live in the same tank:(

There is only a baby red sided left. And I put him in there when Magma died.:eek:

The Radix babies, and snow eastern are seperate, and Masubius is alone.

he had chopped worm last night. no fish.

that stinks........:( i really hope what ever it is doesn't happen to that poor little red sided:( but i agree with shannon.... just try and keep things as clean as possible:)

[GartersRock]

*speechless* Wow.... I am SOO sorry for your losses Wayne!! I would just be devastated.... Actually. I AM devastated... Wow.... I really hope things get better.... :(

[count dewclaw]

Wow, so sorry again, Wayne. Hope you can figure out what the problem is.

[Zephyr]

There has to be something else in common here. I notice a toad in the first pic. Did all the snakes that perished have a toad or other amphibian at one point?

[infernalis]

Kyle that is an old picture, the toads were all used up many weeks ago.

Further my whole collection and a bunch of snakes that were never talked about all ate from those toads.

A lot of snakes ate those same toadlets.....

And thus far, all excluding Magma, Melanie & inferno are still alive and well.

[Zephyr]

All of which were captive-bred Thamnophis, correct? The deceased, I mean.

[Lori P]

Wayne, I'm so so sorry... I really hope you can get to the bottom of this. Like Shannon, my garters frequently swallow fish backwards with no seeming ill effects. More hugs from here.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I doubt the toads have anything to do with it.... garters eat toads in the wild and they don't drop dead... my garters get an occasional toad... nothing wrong with em!

Wayne, you either have an illness of some sort, contaminated feeder fish.... or the worst. luck. ever.

:(:(:(:confused::confused::confused:

I had a customer not too long ago who lost half of her big cichlid fishes the night after feeding a batch of feeder fish. Half of what are still alive, are not looking like they are going to make it. Contaminated feeders does happen, I have seem it on three separate occasions now since I have worked at my store (not our fish, but people buying from other stores telling me about what happened)

We all know that not all snakes are going to make it, and that some just burn out before adulthood, but... this is just terrible, rotten, awful luck that such a good snake keeper does NOT deserve. They do say that deaths always comes in three's, and it really seems true sometimes... I lost my bullsnake, My baby Bp with the prolapse, and my female grayband back to back, and they were all PRIZE snakes in my collection.

Spoil the new baby milksnakes rotten.

[GartersRock]

I had a week of 3 deaths.... :(
Wayne you don't deserve this. Hopefully it is over.... :(

[reptile3]

Oh No Wayne, I am so sorry! I hope you can figure out what it causing the deaths.

[drache]

Wayne
just got to this thread - I'm so sorry for your losses
I sure hope you can figure out what's doing it
the point Kyle is making, is also worth looking at - that perhaps it's something that cb snakes have less resistance to

[Jack Neary]

Wayne,
I am soo terribly sorry to hear about your loss, in addition to poor little Magma...
To Shannon's point, there is no one who cares for their snakes any better than you do on this forum!
Maybe the only possible good that may come from this terrible incident will be that it helped reveal the source of the toxins or virous from your feeder tank and may save other tragic deaths of your other snakes that you love so much?
I'm hoping there's a silver lining to this dark cloud for you.
Again, I'm so sorry... You don't deserve this...
Regards,
Jack

[infernalis]

I just want to take a moment to say that since I started this thread, I have read some comments that really moved me. Thanks for the kind words everyone. I really appreciate it.

As of this morning, the little parietalis baby is still fine. However I am keeping him alone for a while for observation (no need to risk it)

I cannot be real sure about the CB theory, It does seem odd that my "investment" stock has been eating the same exact diet as our "pets" and the only unexplained deaths are the expensive purchased animals??

Some of the baby snakes I acquired this season are of unknown origins, and they are all doing fine, or so I assume at the moment.

Heck I had some pencil lead thin starving to death "I won't eat for no one!" snakes sent to me this year, and they are all FAT, active, healthy looking snakes. On the same exact diet.

The one thing that will give me peace of mind, A local pet store is ordering a 200 lot colony of guppies that I can start a breeder tank with. That will give me tighter control over food quality.

I have found that if I put several writhing fish in a bowl with a pinky and some cut worm, the pinky always gets ate, and I do plan on more litters, so a long term feeder fish supply is mandatory.

[Garter_Gertie]

My Dearest Dekay... I wish there was something I could do for you. Just know I care - I'd call but can't afford it (no one wanted to buy your phone number off me; seems they all had it or could find it...).

Know I love you, Dorothy, "Jabba," and all the snakies. Peepers (the rotten little b@&t@rd!) and Jeepers send their love, hugs, kisses and bites (Peepers enkneeweigh).

Let me know if there's ANYTHING I can do to help. You know how to reach me.

Keep your pecker up.

[crzy_kevo]

wayne once again so sorry about your losses this past month and fingers crossed that the parietalis doesn't see the same fate as the others:o

[anji1971]

Just getting back online after a few days, and this is not the news I like to hear.:(
Wayne, I don't know what to say...........so very, very sad for you. What a hell of a time you've had lately. Hugs.

[infernalis]

Got almost all of them switched over to Tilapia fillet.

It may lack the calcium, but it is far safer to feed. AND so far the ones that will take it, have eaten more than what I am used to feeding them:D

Just supplement with calcium and vitamins and were good to go.

[GartersRock]

Good news!!!

[infernalis]

What is still a mystery to me Amanda, I buy my feeder fish 200 at a time, and they all ate from that tank of fish repeatedly??

No sudden death lately, and the little red sided baby that is still living in the same tank that once contained the now deceased snakes, he is doing just fine! Little piggy ate 6 pieces of tilapia tonight:eek:

A whole fillet was only a dollar at the bargain store, that's a lot of garter food for a buck!

[GartersRock]

It's really honestly been driving me crazy wondering what caused all their deaths.....

[jitami]

Yeah, me too...

Glad they're taking to tilapia Wayne. My adults will have nothing to do with it, but the babies chow down everything placed in front of them :D

[infernalis]

Yeah, me too...

Glad they're taking to tilapia Wayne. My adults will have nothing to do with it, but the babies chow down everything placed in front of them :D

Last night several of my adults just ate cut up Tilapia from a dish placed in the cage.

A couple of the babies, well I get them to start on a hunk of worm, then tease them with Tilapia on tongs to get them to take it.

The little coastal ribbons from Kyle, they suck it down like mad.

[count dewclaw]

The little coastal ribbons from Kyle, they suck it down like mad.

I have found that Carrot prefers pinky parts. I put a dish of pinky parts and tilapia pieces (appropriate sizes) in his cage and the pinky parts disappear first, then one or two of the tilapia. Go figure. :rolleyes:

[GartersRock]

Yeah, me too...

Glad they're taking to tilapia Wayne. My adults will have nothing to do with it, but the babies chow down everything placed in front of them :D

Really? I tend to have "sort of" the opposite problem. lol!

[infernalis]

Another possibility is that petco may have treated the fish with chemicals just prior to my purchase.

However, it does seem that if that was the case, I would have had additional mortalities.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I certainly hope they did not!!!

I work at a pet store... and even i know that feeder fish are never, ever, ever to be treated with any chemicals, or you are in BIG trouble!!!!