Why am I such a mean, bad person?

[LyrisFlame]

Do you guys ever get comments like this?

I was telling a shop owner about Houdini, my WC baby radix. I was telling her all about how happy I was that he was chowing down on trout, and when she looked at me suspiciously and asked if trout was part of his natural diet I explained that garters did eat fish, worms, and occasionally rodents, etc. Then she asked me, "So why didn't you just let him be a happy snake out in the wild like he was meant to be?"

I felt a little bit insulted, to be honest. What makes her think I am incapable of keeping a snake "happy"? I mean, I'm not sure snakes actually feel "happiness" in the sense that humans or mammals do, but I know that it's probably safe to say that healthy = happy for a snake.

Why am I a bad person for catching one of, like, three dozen baby snakes and giving it a habitat with consistent temperatures, abundant and nutritious food, clean, fresh water, and a guarantee of never being eaten by a bird or cat or whatever?

Meanwhile his brothers and sisters will be scavenging for food that may at any time become scarce, same with the water supply, and the constant threat of some other animal eating them or a frightened person killing them... And they all probably won't live half as long as Houdini will now that he is in my care. If anything happens to Houdini, he gets to go to the vet and get fixed up whereas his siblings are just plain screwed.

It just kind of irked me that this lady suggested I was doing harm to Houdini by keeping him in captivity.

Bah.

Do you guys encounter this kind of attitude very often?

[Lumpy]

That's a strange comment coming from someone working in the pet trade business. I would have replied to her that the same question could be posed to her. Every pet she sells either came directly from the wild or was bred from the wild. A bit hypocritical in my opinion.

The other comment might have been "ya know, you're right. I'm going to set him free. Guess i don't need anything from this store. Thanks!"

Lump

[adamanteus]

Freya, it doesn't matter what she thinks. On here, we all keep Garters. Welcome home.:)

[Snake lover 3-25]

The other comment might have been "ya know, you're right. I'm going to set him free. Guess i don't need anything from this store. Thanks!"

lol that's what i would have said!!!!:D:D:p

[drache]

you're not
some days these comments get to us, other times we don't hear them
and then there's the realm of opinions

[jitami]

Sounds like PETA propaganda... sigh...

[Snake lover 3-25]

what's that????

[jitami]

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals... well funded, sometimes extreme, animal rights activists here in America, not sure of their international reach, but I have a feeling it's wide. They believe that animals should not be "used" for any purpose whatsoever by humans. That includes for food, clothing, medical testing, and for our simple enjoyment, entertainment, or service. They believe that there should be no pets and they're slowly but surely spreading that message. There are tons of websites devoted to the debate. Feel free to look at PETA's own website and then search for the truth behind PETA.

[Snake lover 3-25]

wow i just did!!!! so what if not well treated pets do they think we should do with them???!!!!!! i agree with the fact that they should not be mistreated but not that no one should have pets!!!!!:eek:

[Sid]

Freya, more often than not I get asked, "Why didn't you kill it"! You are not a mean, bad person. You are a caring one:D

[beaniesmommy]

No, it doesn't make you a bad person! Sometimes people just need to shut up. You should have asked if she was a vegetarian or looked if she was wearing leather shoes and said do you know what an aminal had to go through to make those shoes? Hypocrite working at a pet store....

Sorry, I just hate when people come and pour there negativity all over a kind thing.

[jitami]

They've been known to let show dogs out of crates at dog shows, sometimes outside near busy roadways. I'd say a good portion of them believe that all pets should be set free and certainly that NONE should be bred. I can see their view on some subjects, but they are way too radical on most for me to want to have anything to do with. Man has domesticated animals from the beginning of time and as long as they are being treated well I think it's a good thing to get to know, care for, and feel compassion for another species. Anyway...

[Snake lover 3-25]

Sounds like PETA propaganda... sigh...

PETA Kills Animals | PetaKillsAnimals.com (http://www.petakillsanimals.com/)

wow read this!!!!!!

[Snake lover 3-25]

um........ i think these people are insane!!!!!

Kentucky Fried Cruelty: The Movie - Torture Camp (http://www.kentuckyfriedcruelty.com/f-kfc_fried_videos.asp)

[Lori P]

My only personal involvment with Peta was when we got a call several years ago to rescue approx. 100 chinchillas that had been left behind in an abandoned fur factory. We raced over and got the poor things out of the unbelieveably tiny, filthy cages they'd lived in all their lives... many of them were literally cage crazy, bashing themselves over and over into the sides of the cage for stimulation, any stimulation. It was horrible.

Anyway, I called Peta hoping they could refer me to a sanctuary to take them in, and they told me to euthanise them... because no man-made sanctuary could ever truly meet all their needs and give them a completely natural lifestyle. I was floored-- after all that these little things had suffered in those horrid cages, and given that these were the ones lucky enough to be left behind when all the others were taken... we had a chance to give them a real life and Peta didn't even want us trying.

Well, Jamie and I built them a shed attached to a 20 x 20 foot outdoor pen. We set their cages inside the shed and slowly started opening the doors. After a week or so, they started to venture out... and in no time they were scampering everywhere, hiding in the rock piles we'd made them, burrowing into the dirt, racing around and playing, grazing on grass and sunning themselves... they were the most free that they'd ever been, they never had to be isolated in 10 inch by 10 inch cages again, they had soft bedding and fresh air and good food and the freedom to interact and play. They were still confined to a pen tho... so should we have denied them even that bit of freedom and euth'd them at the beginning?? I sure as hell think not... our little pen and shed may not have been perfect, but for them it was heaven after what they'd come from.

They didn't live very long... they seemed to be carrying some kind of upper respitory thing that wiped them out in under a year. But I'd never take back that time they had to feel at least some peace and freedom!!

[jitami]

:) See now there's a true animal lover :) Good for you Lori. Thank you for giving them the best life they'd ever had. You guys truly did a wonderful thing and I really appreciate it.

[beaniesmommy]

Oh Lori,

That is a beautiful story. You did a wonderful thing! PETA is just extreme. Go ahead and euthinize them but don't make them into a coat? I don't believe in wearing fur really but... If your telling some one to kill them, it is the same as turning it into a jacket. It is the same thing to me. They are hypocrites too.

:)

[LyrisFlame]

Thanks for your support, everyone. It just irks me sometimes, the stupid things people say.

She doesn't actually run a pet shop - it's a tiny little... oh... let's call it a new age, neopagan shop with books, neat rock, incense, that kind of thing. My boyfriend and I stopped by for some incense (our place smells like fish now lol) and this lady is used to asking me how my life is going and keeps tabs on me. It's actually kind of... weird. She grilled me, my boyfriend, and his step-dad about whether or not he's been treating me well because she knows at one time I was in a bad relationship. She's a bit nosy.

And PETA? Worthless lunatics who are hurting more than helping. I've always thought, if you want to help animals and you are concerned about how they are treated before they die, why are you throwing a bucket of pigs blood (?!Where'd they get THAT from I wonder? Could it be GASP! a DEAD PIG?!?!???)) on little kids at KFC instead of getting jobs in the meat industry and changing things from the inside? I mean, how completely unproductive can you be, throwing blood at people? 0_o

[Snake lover 3-25]

i think their all insane!!!!!! i mean you'd rather kill thousands of cats and dogs why???? because we're not good enough???? they'd rather be shot than live a happy loved life???? um..... okay........

[beaniesmommy]

Oh, I thought that was red paint and the Carrie (Steven King) was pigs blood... Well that is really terrible then!

[Snake lover 3-25]

who are these people?????

PETA TV:Chew On This (http://www.petatv.com/tvpopup/video.asp?video=chew_on_this&Player=wm)

99.99% of this is PURE CRAP!!!!!!!

[jitami]

99.99% of this is PURE CRAP!!!!!!!

I'm glad you can see that Shanley. A lot of young Americans buy into it. Do I condone how those animals were treated before their deaths? Absolutely not, and there are changes that need to take place in the meat industry, but Peta's tactics take it a step too far in the other direction for me.

I didn't mean to start this debate here. I thought long and hard about just what to say about Peta, if anything at all, but their beliefs are clearly affecting many in this country and I can only hope that people stop and think for themselves rather than follow blindly.

[ssssnakeluvr]

those PETA people go overboard! they have some good ideas, making sure animals are cared for, but for the most part, I don't care for them!!!! My stepdad cracked a joke a while back, said he belonged to PETA, People Eating Tasty Animals.... :eek:

[anji1971]

My stepdad cracked a joke a while back, said he belonged to PETA, People Eating Tasty Animals.... :eek:

That's funny, Don!:)
PETA is like any other organization gone too far. They start out with good beliefs, and get all fanatical and end up doing more harm than good. It's like the anti-abortionists who bomb the clinics or shoot the staff members working in them..............they just get so twisted in their belief that they totally lose judgement and any sense of right and wrong, and basically all that's left is hypocrisy. Sad really, when you think that someone most likely began these things with their heart in the right place.

[infernalis]

No your not a bad person.

and PETA has personnel with leather chairs, how humane is that?

Pesonally, I view leather as a by product of the beef industry...

[Stefan-A]

Then she asked me, "So why didn't you just let him be a happy snake out in the wild like he was meant to be?"

I felt a little bit insulted, to be honest. What makes her think I am incapable of keeping a snake "happy"? I mean, I'm not sure snakes actually feel "happiness" in the sense that humans or mammals do, but I know that it's probably safe to say that healthy = happy for a snake.
Well, my first reaction is to ask what makes the other person think it was "happy" in the wild? Maybe give the person a "short" list of reasons why it should not be "happy" in the wild and how captivity is so much better for it.

Not that the argument I'd be making would be valid in my own opinion, but it would follow the same logic that the other person is using. Neither of us know whether or not the snake feels oppressed in captivity, or if it can appreciate a reliable food source and complete absence of predators. Most humans certainly can't.

I encounter that attitude all the time. Or to be precise, I intentionally draw that attitude from fanatical animal rights advocates, because their attitude and general lack of reason annoys me.

[Stefan-A]

PETA is one of those groups that I refuse to deal with. Much like the Animal Liberation Front, there can be no dialogue with them. I don't mean there shouldn't be, I mean they aren't open to the exchange of ideas.

To me, that means that their message should be ignored and that you should fight them on any issue they bring up. But not if a reasonable organization wants to bring attention to how animals are treated. That's because PETA is motivated by ideology whether or not any actual suffering is involved, while moderate organizations are driven by concrete problems. PETA says that they are opposed to the use of animals, but in their propaganda, they use examples of abuse, as if the two have to be connected. That's why they're so successful; they know how to convince sentimental morons that use = abuse.

I'm not saying things couldn't be made better for animals in our society, but PETA sure as hell isn't interested in actually doing something about it.


Oh and they aren't active in this country as far as I know, but the internet is international. ;)

[drache]

it's never occurred to me to view the keeping of pets as being comparable to what the meat industry does, but I have to say that there are animals that come into the rescue some times that clearly show that some pet owners think of animals as objects they bought and can do whatever they want with
while I'm not fond of fanatic nut jobs, I can see how they got that way - so now what?
should we shoot them, or give them a caring home and lock them up until they stop biting? (like that even exists for humans)

[Stefan-A]

while I'm not fond of fanatic nut jobs, I can see how they got that way - so now what?
should we shoot them, or give them a caring home and lock them up until they stop biting? (like that even exists for humans)
Siberia will teach them. ;)

[drache]

Siberia will teach them. ;)
sure - that sounds good
lots of freedom there - just like in real life

I think the guy that solicits for unwanted animals on KS, telling people he'll give them a good home, and then setting them free in city parks, is peta
he's a local nut job

[Snake lover 3-25]

said he belonged to PETA, People Eating Tasty Animals.... http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/../images/smilies/eek.gif

ROFL!!!!! when i looked up peta that is one of the first things that came up!!!!!!!:D:D

but i totally agree those people are NUT JOBS!!!!!!!!! we should dump them all on an abandoned island and see how they survive without the use of any kind of animal!!!:eek:

[infernalis]

only if you promise NOT to let that guy from "survivor" host the show:D:eek:

And the island simply must be populated with carnivorous ambush predators, BIG ones:rolleyes:

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah!!!!!! and lets take away all the edible plants!!!!!!!! they'll either sat dirt, starve or kill!!!!:eek:

[crzy_kevo]

'ROFLCOPTER' that would be an awesome show

[jeanette]

you are not a nasty person, do not listen to people who say that sort of thing!!!



ive had dealings with PETA grrrrrrr.......i once believed that they actually did care about animals, i came across a nasty video once this is a tamer version of what goes on (dont watch if your faint hearted) http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/stopfurtradeinchina i e-mailed PETA and asked that they intervene, i was told that i should just contact the chinese GOT and request that they make it against the law.
The worse version of the video involves Animals being skinned completely alive without even a bang on the head to temporarily sedate them.

That is a nasty person NOT YOU!!!

[Stefan-A]

you are not a nasty person, do not listen to people who say that sort of thing!!!



ive had dealings with PETA grrrrrrr.......i once believed that they actually did care about animals, i came across a nasty video once this is a tamer version of what goes on (dont watch if your faint hearted) http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/stopfurtradeinchina i e-mailed PETA and asked that they intervene, i was told that i should just contact the chinese GOT and request that they make it against the law.
The worse version of the video involves Animals being skinned completely alive without even a bang on the head to temporarily sedate them.

That is a nasty person NOT YOU!!!
I've seen the complete version, if it's the one I think it is. According to the Chinese government, what is done in the video is by no means common practice. In fact, it seems that the video was made for the purpose of propaganda. It doesn't make much sense economically to use those methods either, since it ruins the product.

But who should we believe, the Chinese government, or PETA? :rolleyes:

[GartersRock]

I HATE PETA... Their goal in life is to eliminate all animal ownership. Dogs, cats, livestock, reptiles. Everything. And their way of doing it is to kill animals themselves and help pass mandatory spay neuter laws and brainwash people. Thats their hidden agenda.
Don't get me wrong. I believe most people should spay/neuter. But if EVERYONE does. Including good breeders. We won't have anymore animals will we then?
PETA you suck...

[Snake lover 3-25]

lol we breed my dog and i just can't imagine not..... the puppies are WELL worth every second of the work and time!!!:D:D:D

[Justinviper]

peta people are crackpots. I have seen similar videos before, they are a terrible. I used to kind of feel bad about people taking snakes out of the wild but videos like this just shows you that taking a animal out of the wild to have shelter, safety, food, and water is not near as bad as a lot of animals have it.