oopps........

[Snake lover 3-25]

um..... i think that sooty may be a female.......... a very pregnant female...........:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

well...... i did say that i wanted babies.........

[adamanteus]

Let's see some pics then, Shanley!

[Stefan-A]

Aw crap, everybody's having babies except me. :(

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay..... um... i haven't feed he/she/it in in about 2 weeks and... it's back end has gotten considerably larger....... why don't she and the baby boy just switch genders????? i wanted sooty to be a boy and baby to be a girl!!!!! also then why did she act that way (in a mating manor) twards my large female?????

i'll try to get pics ASAP:D

[jeanette]

congrats if she is pregnant :)

[Snake lover 3-25]

Now if you compare these to the pics before...... in the i found my 1st snake thread there is quite a diff......
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5075.JPG
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5074.JPG
and i just had to throw this in there..... doesn't she look like goldylocks with her shed rolled back???? maybe it was a sign???:D
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5042.JPG

[Snake lover 3-25]

here's more
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5079.JPG
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5062.JPG
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5054.JPG
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5055.JPG
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5065.JPG

[adamanteus]

I can't tell, Shanley...... it does look big towards the back end, but it might just be a monumental poo!
Fingers crossed.:)

[Snake lover 3-25]

lol.... but it deff wasn't that big after i fed it 2 weeks ago!!!!!! SIGH........ if it has babies what will i do!!!! i will be SOOOOOOO tempted to keep one as well as sooty...... i can't have 4........ 2 mothers and their children cannot possibly live together in a sane environment........ they will drive each other CRAZY!!!! lolol and my mom would never agree.... but if only it was a male and i could just breed the mom and what was supposed to be her baby GIRL a few times and release the babies to try and make my local pop. grow...... but THIS will NEVER work!!!! gosh i wish that they could just switch genders like humans (lol) and hienas!!!!!!!

[SpyrotheGartersnake]

ooooo! could i have one of the babies! i would like to have more than just two commons and a santa cruz

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah........ um....... but idk anything about selling them.... and i don't even know who the father is seeing as she was just caught a few weeks ago and.......... she was pregnant before i caught her... alos idk if i'ts even legal...............:confused: but once i have ALL of that figured out i'd be happy to sell you one once it starts to eat and whatnot......:D

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

does look like she has some weight to the back end, many WC females are gravid this time of year, depending on how gravid she is that might of been the shed they have about a week before they give birth, also how long is she? doesnt look that long

[Lori P]

Well, get prepared just in case... you know, towels, hot water, lamaze classes, and see what happens! You may get a crash course in raising babies!!

[Snake lover 3-25]

Well, get prepared just in case... you know, towels, hot water, lamaze classes, and see what happens! You may get a crash course in raising babies!!


yeah.... that's how i got my baby boy!!!!!!! LOL the same thing has happened before and it went well last time.... so.......:D i did wish that i had babies this year..... but i was NOT expecting THIS!!!!!! LOL:D


does look like she has some weight to the back end, many WC females are gravid this time of year, depending on how gravid she is that might of been the shed they have about a week before they give birth, also how long is she? doesnt look that long

yeah.... i forgot to weigh her and i just fed her.... so i'll have to wait a few days...... she is 20 in long....... actually it's really funny...... i fed them in one of those cages with the devider and my baby boy was trying to get over to her.... he has never been so excited before!!!! and what's really funny is that his mom was right next to him (as always) and he didn't even care about her (as always)!!!! LOL:D but i guess my baby boy is not such a baby anymore!!!!! :(

[Snake lover 3-25]

so does anyone have any info that would help me out??? last time i put 10 of the babies in a kritter keeper and the other 8 (my friends and siblings and my favorits) in 4 different tupperwear containers with holes drilled in them..... then we placed all 5 of the cages on top of the mothers cage under the lamp...... but i didn't know about temp gradient so they were all basically the same temp everywhere...... so you guys put your kritter keeper inside the mothers' cage????? but i only have a 20 gal....... any info to make things better than last time is helpful!!!:D

EDIT: o yeah i forgot.... what about the mom??? anything diff have to be done w/ her??? i've been feeding her 3 mice a week
(well i would be feeding them all 2x a week.... but you said that that was too much.....:()
but does her temp have to be raised or her humidity???? ANYTHING??????:D

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

nothing needs to be changed, r u positive shes gravid?, might wana put her in a different cage with lots of hides so the babies can hide, also if you want a cheap baby cage get one of those plastic iris, sterilite, or rubbermaid tubs with a heat pad

so does anyone have any info that would help me out??? last time i put 10 of the babies in a kritter keeper and the other 8 (my friends and siblings and my favorits) in 4 different tupperwear containers with holes drilled in them..... then we placed all 5 of the cages on top of the mothers cage under the lamp...... but i didn't know about temp gradient so they were all basically the same temp everywhere...... so you guys put your kritter keeper inside the mothers' cage????? but i only have a 20 gal....... any info to make things better than last time is helpful!!!:D

EDIT: o yeah i forgot.... what about the mom??? anything diff have to be done w/ her??? i've been feeding her 3 mice a week
(well i would be feeding them all 2x a week.... but you said that that was too much.....:()
but does her temp have to be raised or her humidity???? ANYTHING??????:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

how big should the tubs be????

i'm pretty sure.... her back end seems to be getting bigger by the day!!!!!:D

[Sid]

Fingers are crossed for you, Shanley:D.

[Snake lover 3-25]

well....... now i need a NEW name....... sorry james.... sooty isn't really a girls name.......:D

and BTW does anyone have any names for my baby boy?????

he's on top:D
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/snake_006.jpg

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

depends on how many babies, since shes not that big and probaly wont ave a ton of babies, i would say a 27 quart sterilite tub or 30 qt iris tub, the iris ones last longer

how big should the tubs be????

i'm pretty sure.... her back end seems to be getting bigger by the day!!!!!:D

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

sooty is fine for a girl!!! dont change her name!! i am so ued to her being sooty!

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay thanks!!:D

shannon are you SURE that Sooty is a GIRLS name?????:D

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

sooty is FINE for a girl snake. honestly, if it was my snake I would hae still named it sooty if I had known it was a girl from the start!

[Snake lover 3-25]

lol okay i believe you...... but we still need a name for my baby boy!!!:D :)

[lestat]

How about Toni, its a boys and girls name or Brad has a ring to it.

[adamanteus]

but we still need a name for my baby boy!!!:D :)

:DSweep.:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

sweep?????? that sounds like a name for a broom!!!! :D:DJK:D:D LOLOLOL

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

Brooms sweep soot away!

[adamanteus]

Sooty & Sweep... famous childrens TV duo.

[Snake lover 3-25]

nice connection james:D..........

so it seems that sooty is literally GROWING EVERY DAY!!!!!!!! um...... idk if she should be......... here are some pics from today..... tell me what you think......... BTW how long are they preggers for???????

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Picture_202.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Picture_226.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Picture_227.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Picture_223.jpg
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/Picture_199.jpg

[Snake lover 3-25]

she is deff fatter than before.... and it is spread all the way through her back half..... anyone know how long it is from the time that they mate to the time that they have babies?????

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

gestation is 90-120 days (usually)

she is deff fatter than before.... and it is spread all the way through her back half..... anyone know how long it is from the time that they mate to the time that they have babies?????

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay..... so she'll give birth sometime b4 aug 17...... but then why is she SOOOOOOOOOO fat already??????

[Snake lover 3-25]

how long should it be b4 you are really suposed to be able to tell that she is gravid???????

[Snake lover 3-25]

anyone who's had babies lately know anything??????:D

[jeanette]

ive had babies just not baby garters. im kind of excited that sooty is pregnant, and want to follow this right to the end, i think all us newbies could really learn something.

[adamanteus]

It varies, sometimes you might not even know until the last minute, sometimes you're sure that they're gravid weeks in advance... then you're wrong. There are no hard and fast rules. If you haven't seen them mating you just don't know. Keep a close eye on her, and hopefully you'll be a 'breeder' soon!
The gestation period is normally between 90 - 120 days... but even this can vary as the females can store live sperm for use later.

[Snake lover 3-25]

hmmmmmm..... well it really just got warm like last week...... so unless she mated in like march i don't think that there is any way that she will be due in the next couple of weeks....... but i kind of remember similar results with meadow and she had hers in mid july........ but I REALLY REALLY REALLY WANT BABIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Snake lover 3-25]

oooooo i almost forgot!!!!!!! what would be the best idea for a cage..... when my older female had babies before i used my 20 gal but i only had her then so that was really my only op...
so here are my choices
A. keep her alone in the breading Kritter keeper until she has babies
B. keep her with my others (a young male and a female)
C. take out the others and keep tham in the kritter keeper
D take out the male and put him in the kritter keeper

my female has had babies b4 and was fine (didn't eat them)
i have also caught babies b4 and put them in the cage with both my female and male with no poor results
the kritter keeper is 3/4 the size of my 20 gal on the bottom and 1/3 as tall

[Snake lover 3-25]

anyone????? LOL i'm impatient!!!:D:D:D:DLOL

[jeanette]

sorry snake lover, this is all new stuff to me. i havent a clue

[Snake lover 3-25]

sigh well me too....... but i guess i have a few months to prepare anyway.......:(

[adamanteus]

Separate the female from the others, nearer the time, Shanley.

[Snake lover 3-25]

well they are right now.... but should i put her in the baby proof cage and put the others in the smaller one???

[adamanteus]

Yes, the mother to be in the baby-proof cage.... nearer the time.

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay thanks!!!!:D:D but the prob is that i have NO idea when that time is!!!!!!LOL:D

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

just put her in there now if its large enough

okay thanks!!!!:D:D but the prob is that i have NO idea when that time is!!!!!!LOL:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

with the others????? but yet another problem....... i haven't had her for the full 6 week seperation period.......

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

oh you already have her seperated? then just keep her in there untill she has her babies

with the others????? but yet another problem....... i haven't had her for the full 6 week seperation period.......

[Snake lover 3-25]

well i caught her and so aren't you suposed to do that???? also.... the cage that she is in is the non baby proof one........ but she does get along just fine with the others..... and also i was going to ask this anyway.... but can i just put her with them now????? at least until it gets closer to the time???? (some relatives are coming and i'm being kicked out of my room and it makes alot of clutter.......)

BTW thanks you are all very helpful!!!:D:D:D

[adamanteus]

To be honest Shanley, I would try to find a way to continue to keep her separate from the others..... but put her (alone) in the baby-proof tank.:)

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay...... it's just that then she would be alone in a tank 4x the size of the one where the other two would be........

[adamanteus]

I know it's awkward, but if she gave birth and her babies were cannibalised by the others, (or if they escaped) you'd never forgive yourself.

[Snake lover 3-25]

VERY TRUE............ :(:(:( but they want to be together.......... LOL okay it is prob the best thing to do............. now if i can find a nice glass cage for UNDER $20!!!!:D:D:D THAT would solve ALL my problems!!!!!!! lol not really though.......

[count dewclaw]

now if i can find a nice glass cage for UNDER $20.

You could try craiglist.org in your area and/or see if there is a freecycle list www.freecycle.org (http://www.freecycle.org) in your area. I have be able to get several aquaria from freecycle (for free) and then I bought lids to go with them.

[Odie]

hmmmmmm..... well it really just got warm like last week...... so unless she mated in like march i don't think that there is any way that she will be due in the next couple of weeks....... but i kind of remember similar results with meadow and she had hers in mid july........ but I REALLY REALLY REALLY WANT BABIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!
She may have been mated in the fall :eek:

[count dewclaw]

She may have been mated in the fall :eek:

So does this mean that they can be pregnant through brumation and give birth earlier in the spring?

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

i think they can be gravid during brumation but not usually

So does this mean that they can be pregnant through brumation and give birth earlier in the spring?

[adamanteus]

Female Garters can store viable sperm from a successful mating for long periods of time, then self fertilize when they're ready.

[count dewclaw]

Female Garters can store viable sperm from a successful mating for long periods of time, then self fertilize when they're ready.

Yes, I knew that, but can they be pregnant while they are brumating?

[Snake lover 3-25]

oh no!!!! now i'm REALLY woried........ :(:(:( i want them soon.... but i want to at least have SOME time to prepare....:(:(:D

would it be okay.... to cut out a rectangle in the top of a tupperware lid andput netting over it???? would this be an okay baby cage??????

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay..... new pics!!!!!!!:D but is she getting TOO big?????? she has literally doubled the size of her back end since i caught her.... maybe even trippled!!!!!!!:eek:

i have more so WAIT!!!:D

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5168.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5182.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5169.JPG

[Snake lover 3-25]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5179.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_51811.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5175.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/IMG_5166.JPG

okay i'm done!!!:D:D

[adamanteus]

Shanley, she's huge! You're going to have about a thousand babies!

[Snake lover 3-25]

oh thanks THAT helps NOT!!!!!!!!! but she's getting SOOOOOO fat!!!!!!!! what do i do?????????????!!!!!!!!! :confused::confused::eek::eek::eek:

[adamanteus]

Prepare... she'll do the rest.

[Snake lover 3-25]

........SIGH........................

but i want babies NOW................:mad::mad:

but i just need to know WHEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad:

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

the pics didnt show up for me.?

[Snake lover 3-25]

none of them did????????

[adamanteus]

They were there, now they aren't... that can happen when you're working in your gallery.... just re-post the relevant ones, Shanley... it's the easiest and quickest way.

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay....:(:(:(:(

[Snake lover 3-25]

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5177.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5178.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5168.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5181.JPG

[adamanteus]

Nicely done, Shanley! Quick too.

[Snake lover 3-25]

okay now compare those to these!!!!! these are from 5wks ago!!!!

and keep in mind that in the first pic she had just eaten a bunch of fish and worms!!!!!!:eek:

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data/500/medium/Florida_trip_600.jpg

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data/500/medium/Florida_trip_602.jpg

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data/500/medium/Florida_trip_601.jpg
__________________

[Snake lover 3-25]

um...... she seems to be digesting her food much faster than b4...... now instead of being able to tell she had eaten 3/4 days later you can hardly tell 2 days later...... and she is under the lamp almost 24/7....... should i feed her more often..... she also seems to search for food 4 or so days after feedings........??????? :D:D:D:D:D:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

Anyone!!!!!!!!!!!:d:d:d:d:d:d

[todaelaguadelmar]

Nice pics, and good luck, hope she´s carrying some babies.
You should take her to the Vet, just to make sure.
Congratulations.

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

you could but an x-ray would cost $100 or more

Nice pics, and good luck, hope she´s carrying some babies.
You should take her to the Vet, just to make sure.
Congratulations.

[Lori P]

Oh but what a fun x ray to see-- all those teeny tiny babies in there!! :-)

[Snake lover 3-25]

lol yeah it sure would....but..... anyone know the answers to any of my Q's??????


um...... she seems to be digesting her food much faster than b4...... now instead of being able to tell she had eaten 3/4 days later you can hardly tell 2 days later...... and she is under the lamp almost 24/7....... should i feed her more often..... she also seems to search for food 4 or so days after feedings........??????? :D:D:D:D:D:D


would it be okay.... to cut out a rectangle in the top of a tupperware lid andput netting over it???? would this be an okay baby cage??????

[adamanteus]

She is digesting the food more quickly because she is spending more time under the heat lamp... the higher temperature speeds up the digestive process.
It couldn't hurt to allow her a little extra food, but don't go over the top.
Tupperware with a well vented lid would be ideal for the babies, but make sure the mesh is well sealed all around the edges, or the babies will simply push their way through.

[Snake lover 3-25]

Finally!!!!:D:D:D JK thanks!!!!!!:D:D:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

!!!!!!!!!!:D:D!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! she is refusing to eat!!!!!!! she goes for it puts it in her mouth then spits it out!!!!!!!!!!! and her skin is getting duller!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!! :D YAY!!!!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!! not eating and shedding are good signs right!!!!!!?????????? how long after she shedds should the babies come??????!!!!!!!!:D:D:D

[Zephyr]

!!!!!!!!!!:D:D!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! she is refusing to eat!!!!!!! she goes for it puts it in her mouth then spits it out!!!!!!!!!!! and her skin is getting duller!!!!!!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!! :D YAY!!!!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!! not eating and shedding are good signs right!!!!!!?????????? how long after she shedds should the babies come??????!!!!!!!!:D:D:DFrom my one birthing experience, within 2-10 days of the shed itself.

[Snake lover 3-25]

:D YAY!!!!!:D:D as you can prob see i'm SOOOOOOO excited!!!!!!!! i havn't had babies 4 2 yrs!!!!!!:D and THIS time i'm really prepared!!!!!!!! this forum is SOOOOO helpful 4 people fairly new to babies!!!!:D:D

[Zephyr]

:D YAY!!!!!:D:D as you can prob see i'm SOOOOOOO excited!!!!!!!! i havn't had babies 4 2 yrs!!!!!!:D and THIS time i'm really prepared!!!!!!!! this forum is SOOOOO helpful 4 people fairly new to babies!!!!:D:DLet's hope for a ton. XD

[Snake lover 3-25]

I know!!!!!!! i'm hoping to break the record!!!!!!XD

okay so i'm guessing that she'll give birth between the 7th and the 20th of june........:D:D that is a WAY better timeline than april-agust!!!!!!!!:D:D even though it's just an educated guess!!!!:D:D

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

congrats shanley!! I have concluded that my gigantic eastern from earlier this year is gravid... and she's so massive I am expecting a massive amount of little un's!!

[jitami]

Ok, keeping fingers crossed for both Shannon & Shanley!!!

[Snake lover 3-25]

congrats shannon!!!!! don't you love these "little surprises" that they tend to spring on us??????:D:p

[Zephyr]

congrats shannon!!!!! don't you love these "little surprises" that they tend to spring on us??????:D:pI call'em squiggles.

[Snake lover 3-25]

but you gotta love them!!!! aren't they CUTE!!!!!!!!:D i wish i could keep them all......... hmmmmmmmm............:rolleyes::rolleyes: maybe i can!!!!!!!!:p:D:D

[Zephyr]

but you gotta love them!!!! aren't they CUTE!!!!!!!! i wish i could keep them all......... hmmmmmmmm............:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes : maybe i can!!!!!!!!:p:D:DHooray for tilapia. :P

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah........ but food isn't the prob!!!!!! space is!!!!!!!!!:(:(:(:p

[Zephyr]

yeah........ but food isn't the prob!!!!!! space is!!!!!!!!!:(:(:(:pI'm sure one day you'll get to build a garter pen. XD

[Snake lover 3-25]

or a bigger room!!!!!!!!!:p:p

[todaelaguadelmar]

Fingers crossed... hope u get your babies soon.

[Loren]

From my one birthing experience, within 2-10 days of the shed itself.

Do they generally only shed once while gravid, or a couple times?
In other words, if they shed while gravid, is that a sure indicator that birth is very soon after?
Just curious, I have never bred garters.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I am not sure about previous sheds, but I can say that my huge gravid eastern shed once right after I caught her, has since started showing that she is gravid, well she hasn't shed again, but I do know that garters should shed once when they are really fat and about to have babies, and after that shed the babies will usually arrive within the week.

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah..... she shead once b4 but it was bc she had scale rot........ and there is really no reason for her to shed again unless she is gravid......... but it may just be my excitement playing w/ my eyes........ but we'll know for sure thet she's going into a shed when she hits the blue stage...... :D:D i just CAN NOT WAIT!!!!!!!:D:D:D

[Snake lover 3-25]

um............................. what is up with her tail????? is it time?????? :confused::confused:

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5587.JPG

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//602/medium/IMG_5582.JPG

sorry bad pics.......

[Zephyr]

Possibly.
Now you may witness the miracle of life.
Like in my health class last year...
*Shudder.* UGH...

[Loren]

So did you have those babies yet?
Whats taking so long?
:)
I want babies now!

[Snake lover 3-25]

ME TOO!!!!!!!:eek: gosh Sooty what's taking so long!!!!!!!!!:mad::mad: i really really want them now!!!!........ but it would prob be better timing if she had them after finals........ well my last test is on the 23rd so lets hope for then!!!!!!! :D:rolleyes: i want 10!!!!!!:D

[Loren]

Shanley, you make me nervous for you, since you are soooooo excited. I am worried about what will happen if things dont turn out well at birthing time, which can happen.
But, hopefully everything goes just fine, and it probably will.:)

[Snake lover 3-25]

:(:(:( i would die!!!!!!!!! is it unusual to have all live young?????? that's what happened last time........:confused:

[enigma200316]

I don't think so, but it all depends on health of mother and what not, I mean even the healthiest snake can produce dead, and slugs, you'll just have to wait and see..........:)

[adamanteus]

Shanley, don't worry. You'll get a million beautiful healthy babies.:D

[infernalis]

Great !! Hope you have a big litter of little neonates.

I can relate to the horrors of failure at birth, We keep a big tank with 3 adult dekay browns and 2 smaller male garters.

Without my knowledge Casper (the male DK) had mated with Athena, I never even noticed she was gravid, one day while I was not home, Athena had given birth. (That "collapsed" look fat>starved looking in one day was my clue) but not one single baby snake?? well 2 days later the garters had calcium deposits in their poop,. Not much calcium in an earthworm!!

So the Garters have been moved, and Casper is getting released before any more mating occurs. (2 successful and one failed litters of dekay browns was enough for me)

Wal mart sells clear totes that are really tall for about $5-$8 that would be baby proof. a neonate garter cannot scale an 18 inch slick wall.

If you were to keep any number of babies, you will NEED to separate them within the year, or by 18-24 months you will have siblings doing the nasty with each other.

Neonate (baby) Garters are almost exclusively started out feeding tiny little guppies. Baby earthworms and baby night crawlers work but are very difficult to get unless you live very rural. (We have tons)

You also need to feed them in an enclosure with NO substrate, or cage carpet or newspaper. I have watched a baby snake choke to death on coconut hair, and found a dead red belly one morning with it's mouth packed full of the same stuff. My BP had bark in his poop from swallowing a chunk with his mouse.(previous owner did that, he's a rescue)

Thanks for sharing your excitement, I enjoyed reading this whole thread.

Regards,
Wayne A. Harvey

[Zephyr]

If you were to keep any number of babies, you will NEED to separate them within the year, or by 18-24 months you will have siblings doing the nasty with each other.

Inbreeding is very common in wild snakes for one. For two, it's safe, genetically speaking, for up to seven generations.



Neonate (baby) Garters are almost exclusively started out feeding tiny little guppies. Baby earthworms and baby night crawlers work but are very difficult to get unless you live very rural. (We have tons)Night crawlers can be found at bait stores and are excellent, chopped, for baby easterns A few shakes of reptomin on the 3rd feeding after they've been born works as a stable for babies until they're a month or two old and are more willing to take other food sources.

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

I wouldn't say it is very common in the wild but it does happen once in a while
[quote=Zephyr;58222]Inbreeding is very common in wild snakes for one. For two, it's safe, genetically speaking, for up to seven generations.

[Zephyr]

I wouldn't say it is very common in the wild but it does happen once in a while
I've seen populations in which apparent genetic bottlenecks have occurred, especially on one part of the three river peninsulas I herp.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

Omg Shanley.... o M G Where Are Sooty's Babies Shanley??? Hurry Up Or Shes Gonna Have Her Babies Ahhhhh!!! Hurryyyyy!!! The Babies Are Coming Shanley And They Will Be All Over The Place Begging For Food What Will You Do When You Have 20 Little Sooty's!!!!

[Snake lover 3-25]

:(:(:( well..... right now i have to take care of her hopefuly B4 her babies come......:(:(:(

[Snake lover 3-25]

i just don't understand..... why wouldn't she eat when she is gravid???? she hasn't eaten anything in 2 wks...... how does she feed the babies???? their still growing.....:confused:

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

they dont eat i think because it is uncomfortable for them for the babies stretch the area around where the food has to go through making it hard to get past

i just don't understand..... why wouldn't she eat when she is gravid???? she hasn't eaten anything in 2 wks...... how does she feed the babies???? their still growing.....:confused:

[Snake lover 3-25]

o but how do the babies grow with no nutrition???

[Zephyr]

o but how do the babies grow with no nutrition???
There may just be the "final preparations" going on inside; the bebies are already fully developed. One theory I heard about the pre-birth shed is that it clears the vent area of debris, allowing for the babies to pass out more easily.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

the babies grow off of what mama snake has stored in fat from eating so much in her early pregnancy stages... thats why it's always good to feed them extra during gravidity and after they have their babies.. ever notice how thin a mama snake is after she gives birth??! she puts everything shes got into the little ones :)

[Snake lover 3-25]

yeah.... but do they usually stop eating about a month after giving birth???? that's what my other one did and she didn't start eating again till march..... aug- march...... is that way to long????? i tried to feed her and i ended up puting her into brumation which kick started her feeding.....:confused:

[drache]

my Sammy is still eating, but I can tell that pooping is a major effort

[Snake lover 3-25]

i'm just worried bc she was deathly thin when caught and she has eaten less than 6 times since.........

[infernalis]

Even though Garters bear live young, they still produce an egg with all the developing infants need, but instead of a "shell" the embryos are encased in a membrane.

Mom is simply providing an incubation chamber for the eggs to reach maturity. There is no umbilical cords connecting the babies to mom.

Hopefully you will be lucky enough to be home when the birthing occurs, I saved a baby from certain doom last year, it could not escape the membrane, so I used a toothpick to peel away at it. As soon as that little baby got some air, it raised it's tiny little head and started flicking it's tongue!

What a rush that was!! in nature that little runt would never taken its first breath.Regards,
Wayne A. Harvey

[jitami]

yeah.... but do they usually stop eating about a month after giving birth???? that's what my other one did and she didn't start eating again till march..... aug- march...... is that way to long????? i tried to feed her and i ended up puting her into brumation which kick started her feeding.....:confused:

Shanley, my WC guy doesn't eat much, if any at all, during the winter months and I don't officially put him into brumation either. Our winter is shorter here(N. California) but there have been several years where he didn't eat from Oct until March-ish. I keep the water clean and watch for him to start hunting for food. His appetite is voracious all spring/summer, and he's still alive and well, so I don't stress too much about it. He hides pretty much all winter, even though our indoor temps are at least in the 60's. I've tried years with the UTH on and years with it off. It doesn't seem to make any difference. I am faaaaaaar from an expert, though. I was told that a lot of WC's go off of food for the winter and not to worry about it. Seems true in our case, but your mileage may vary, of course!

[adamanteus]

Good post, Tami, and very good point... A lot of mine do this. I try to brumate all I can, even the young ones, if they're all healthy.

[jitami]

p.s. Can't wait to see Sooty's babies! Come on Sooty :)

[jitami]

Thanks James. Since this particular snake seems to do ok without brumating I'll leave him as is, but sometime in the future I plan on a couple of additions and will have to learn all the ins and outs of brumation at some point....

I have a while as I have to wait until our overall pet population dwindles a bit. Hubby instated a moratorium on pets and I really don't blame him. We've had a rough run with dogs lately. Our female great dane has decided that she should rid the planet of various other living creatures including the cat she grew up with, the neutered male dog she grew up with, and last summer went after a person. It's all I can do to keep her occupied without allowing her to be a danger to anyone/thing! She's our youngest pet, so someday when she's lived her life out here, I'll add more snakeys and another Dane.

[Snake lover 3-25]

awww that sucks... she killed your dog and your cat????

yeah... i wouldn't be worried if she was a good eater in the spring / summer..... but she isn't... she has ALWAYS been quite difficult to feed... except when she was gravid....:(:(:( but her boy is the best eater i've ever encountered.... i don't think he's ever missed a meal...... but he may be too good of an eater.... you have to remember that i've had them for 2 yrs b4 i joined... and back b4 i knew any better i fed him 4 mice 2x a week....... but now it's down to 3 mice once a week.... but he may be slightly overweight.... i wish his mom was like that!!!!!!!!:(:(:(

[jitami]

So far she's only been successful in killing the neighbor's elderly chihuahua who snuck under a fence board into our yard :( That was when she was still a puppy and I thought maybe she was playing too rough and it was accidental. Unfortunately she proved that theory wrong. We had to place our other dog with my parents and the cat lives upstairs with baby gates on the stairs to keep them separated. To say it's been a pain is a huge understatement. The second time she went after our other dog my husband literally picked her up, all four feet off the floor, and she still kept the other dog in her mouth. I really think there's some wiring gone wrong with this dog, but it's either put her to sleep or try to keep her as happy as possible while keeping everyone safe... yeah, major pain...

[Snake lover 3-25]

ooo that's too sad.... i would personally put HER with another family who has no other pets.... just to keep YOUR OTHER pets safe... but yes i've heard of lots of dogs that have been fine all their life and just suddenly snap and can't seem to get over it......:(:(:(

[jitami]

That was a definite consideration until she went after a person last year. I don't trust her enough to place her with anyone else. She's totally sweet and loving to all in our family, but it's not worth the risk to give her to someone else. I couldn't do that. She will either be put to sleep or stay here until her natural death. I hate saying that, but we're talking a 120 pound dog who gives no warning and just attacks. We can handler her here, but I wouldn't pass that burden on to anyone.

Ok, on to happier things.... Sooooooooottttttyyyy.... it's the weekend, we're all ready for babies....

[Snake lover 3-25]

i know me too!!!!!! she has hit 74 Grams!!!!!! :eek::eek::D:D:D