have anyone of you poison snakes? [Archive]

Snaky

01-04-2007, 03:20 PM

At the moment it's to much of a hassle in Belgium. You need a permit to hold them and it's rather a challenge in the city where I live. And they are thinking to update the law, to make it even more difficult... So I don't think I'll ever have them.

I must admit, most of the time I'm not that interested in poisonous snakes, there are plenty of other one's:)

Stefan-A

01-04-2007, 03:38 PM

As far as I can tell, there no hassle here in Finland. There are a lot of really beautiful venomous snakes, especially vipers, but I can't really say I'd want one. But I'm not opposed to people owning them either.

Is this the wrong place to bring up the issue of garter snakes' alleged venomousness?

abcat1993

01-04-2007, 03:57 PM

I think we already talked about that. If not then I saw it on kingsnake.com (before I joined this site of course)

Elliot

01-04-2007, 04:38 PM

That would be kind of a neat discussion, when my ribbon bites it does get itchy and red, and he can almost draw blood lol

abcat1993

01-04-2007, 08:18 PM

I almost wish my snake would bite; it'd be more interesting than it constantly running away and musking the crap out of me.

Cazador

01-04-2007, 08:53 PM

I once owned a copperhead for about 30 minutes. I grew up in Missouri where they are fairly common. When I was about six or seven years old, I caught one and put it in a bucket. When I showed it to my mom and dad, my mom stripped me naked, right in front of my dad's friends (who I thought were really cool) in order to check me for snake bites. Since I always caught snakes by pinning their heads to the ground and holding them right behind the head, I hadn't been bitten, but my mom ended up cutting it to pieces anyway.

If you're considering getting a venomous snake, be sure to call the hospital first and see if they have copperhead antivenom in stock. I imagine that it's pretty rare in Germany. Cheers,
Rick

ssssnakeluvr

01-04-2007, 09:11 PM

I have owned a number of rattlesnakes over the years, until I moved to Utah...very strict here!!!!

Cazador

01-04-2007, 09:33 PM

What are your thoughts, Don (and others with experience keeping venomous snakes), about managing the risks of an accidental bite to yourself, your friends, or children vs. the rewards of owning one? Are they more exciting to watch?

ssssnakeluvr

01-04-2007, 10:15 PM

Well, now that I have kids I don't keep venomous. There are definitely some beautiful venomous snakes out there!!!! If I were to keep them (and lived in another state) I would definitely have padlocked cages! My oldest daughter loves to help out with the snakes. Garters are just as much fun and a whole lot less dangerous! I have worked with all sorts of reptiles over the years and have always had garters in my collection, now that's mainly what I work with. Accidental bites will happen, I don't care how careful youare, you can get bitten. I was bitten by a 2 month old eastern massassauga...it was entirely my fault. I was handling it doing a class (many years ago, andwith no venomous experience at that time) and turned the baby snake over. I received a dry bite on my right index finger, only one fang sank in me. I was lucky, it could have been worse. The hospital I went to didn't know what to do, other than nickname me snakecharmer and give me a prescription for antibitoics because I was bitten bya wild animal.

GarterGuy

01-04-2007, 11:09 PM

Nope, no venomous here. I think they're very beautiful species of venomous snakes out there and I have several friends who keep and breed them, but they're just not for me. I like to be very "hands on" with my animals and that's really not something you can do with venomous stuff with out some serious risks. I've seen what can happen from a venomous bite and it's really not something that I want to experiance.

Stefan-A

01-05-2007, 03:16 AM

I almost wish my snake would bite; it'd be more interesting than it constantly running away and musking the crap out of me.
You're lucky, my male doesn't even do that and my female just runs away. No musking and no biting. Damn these cb's. :D

Markus18

01-05-2007, 07:48 AM

when i buy 2 of them i know that i have to do safety measures like
1.where is the next hospital with the antidote or keep the antidote at home!
2.i have to closure the terrarium!
3.just handle the snake with a gripper!
4.a extra room just for the snake!
5.speak with the neighbours if they have no problems with the snake!

but before i get them i have to learn learn and learn by reading books and speak with people that have experience
markus

El Nino

01-05-2007, 10:34 PM

I've never been keen to having a venomous snake (don't know where the heck I'd get one, there are no venomous natives in W WA. I never even bothered to google the availability of such a reptile (Oh gawd, now I know what I'm gonna do after this post, F**k y'all for even giving me the idea)

I remember going to an open house (Real Estate/ house for sale) a few years back and the homeowner's son had quite the rattler ensemble in the basement of the house. Crotalus are quite lovely, but I have always admired Agkistrodon (not only copperheads, but also Cantils) . Also all those exotic asian green vipers.

suzoo

01-29-2007, 01:41 PM

I have 4 kids, so never kept poisonous snakes. I live in Missouri where Copperheads grow wild, and have removed them from my yard via shovel, across the road, to the woods. They are a beautiful snake! I actually have several friend's who have been bitten. The hospital didn't even carry anti-venom as Copperheads are not that poisonous unless you're allergic to them, like being allergic to Bee stings. They just put them on antibiotics for secondary infections. There is no record of a death in Missouri by Copperhead bite. But I still wouldn't want to be bitten! And I love handling my snakes quite often, so it's better for me not to have venomous ones. :)
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/scophead1.jpg

abcat1993

01-29-2007, 03:00 PM

That's interesting, I always thought they were occasionally deadly, like most rattlesnakes (all?)

GarterGuy

01-30-2007, 12:17 AM

That's interesting, I always thought they were occasionally deadly, like most rattlesnakes (all?)

Well they don't always actually envenomate every time they bite (why waste venom on us dumb humans), but if you are envenomated you might wish you were dead, and there's always the possibilities of complications (beyond infection) from a bite. I've seen guys who's arm swelled up so bad that they had to cut off his clothing to treat him, and yes, this was from a copperhead. You can get kidney damage from the tissue being broken down by the venom, tissue damage is almost a give if you do get a does of venom, then there's quite a bit of pain involved too....or so I'm told (never hope to experiance it!). Venom is tricky stuff and everyone reacts differently and every venom is a bit different. You may not die, you might just loose an arm or leg or foot or hand or finger or toe or maybe just have horrible pain and swelling or some of your tissue die off around the bite area or just be puking for a month or two (another friend who was bitten!).....guess my point is, NEVER underestimate ANY venomous snake whether they say it's deadly or not.

Valley Pets

01-30-2007, 06:11 AM

I have a pair of dwarf puff adders CB in South Africa..They are display snakes only. They are to fast and to small to handle safely!
Really neat to watch them hunt for the mouse!
Kind of a bad pic...
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p80/valleypets/adder3.jpg

Ryan-Valley Pets

adamanteus

02-18-2007, 04:56 PM

In the past I have kept many venomous snake species, from Rattlesnakes of various species and other Pit Vipers such as the Urutu (Bothrops alternatus) through "true" vipers such as the European Adder (Vipera berus), Gaboon Viper (Bitis gabonica) and Puff Adders (Bitis arietans), and some Elapids including Spitting Cobras (N. sputatrix) and the Oh so scary Cape Cobra (N.? can't remember the specific name without looking it up in a book!). My favourite group must be snakes of the Agkistrodon complex, including many species our American friends might be familiar with: Copperheads (Agkistrodon contortrix), and the Cottonmouth or Mocassin (Agkistrodon piscavorous) . Though I have had (and bred) other snakes from this group including the Malayan Pit Viper (Calloselasma rhodastoma). I have also had some of the "back fanged" snakes including the Cat Eyed Snake (Boiga cyanea) which bred whilst in my care.

I would not recommend the keeping of venomous snakes for "pleasure". You can never underestimate the ability of these animals to kill you if provoked. Many venomous species are quite placcid by nature and it's easy to become complacent when dealing with them. That's when accidents happen. In many ways they are less interesting to keep...by their very nature they are less active (generally speaking) as they simply lie in ambush for their prey. And the risks are just too high. You can always see them in the Zoo! Don't be tempted...it's both dangerous and disappointing.

infernalis

12-28-2008, 09:56 PM

I would not recommend the keeping of venomous snakes for "pleasure". You can never underestimate the ability of these animals to kill you if provoked. Many venomous species are quite placid by nature and it's easy to become complacent when dealing with them. That's when accidents happen. In many ways they are less interesting to keep...by their very nature they are less active (generally speaking) as they simply lie in ambush for their prey. And the risks are just too high. You can always see them in the Zoo! Don't be tempted...it's both dangerous and disappointing.

Here is another ancient thread worth having a look.

I agree wholeheartedly with James on the statement above, I also admire many handsome Venomous species, But I'd rather just admire the pictures, and see them at a zoo, Even if I were the most experienced keeper on the planet, I'd rather not have a "Pet" that can one day kill me with a nanosecond of bad judgment.

aSnakeLovinBabe

12-28-2008, 10:10 PM

infernalis

12-28-2008, 10:20 PM

Loren

12-29-2008, 07:04 AM

Some enjoy jumping headfirst out of airplanes, some enjoy diving off cliffs into rivers, some enjoy rollercoasters, driving things off ramps or strapping sticks to your legs and coasting down a snowy mountain.... and then others enjoy keeping venomous animals. It's all in what gives you that excitement... that rush. While I hate heights and therefore do not enjoy any of the first things in the least... I will probably own a venomous snake or two some day.
I agree with Shannon- many people have potentially deadly hobbies. A harmelss trip down the slope, or lap around the dirtbike track... any of these things could be the last thing we do. Many hobbies have risks. A couple of my buddies badly injured themselves simply enjoying a wakeboard ride. Its all about what you like to do, and what you feel capable of- and being careful of coarse. I do feel strongly though, that people who keep hots should have them locked away securely in a room separate from people, and antivenom should be available for the species you keep.

Stefan-A

12-29-2008, 07:25 AM

Some enjoy jumping headfirst out of airplanes, some enjoy diving off cliffs into rivers, some enjoy rollercoasters, driving things off ramps or strapping sticks to your legs and coasting down a snowy mountain.... and then others enjoy keeping venomous animals. It's all in what gives you that excitement... that rush.
Maybe I'm just reading you wrong (probably), but to me that seems like pretty much the worst possible reason to keep a potentially dangerous animal. It's one thing if the dangerous element just spices up the hobby a bit, and a whole other if danger is practically the only reason you're doing it.

Now don't get me wrong, I have a hobby that's pretty much in the same category (i.e. contains a dangerous element, check the profile, guess which one it is ;) ), but if there's one thing I've learned over the years, it's that people who are just looking for a rush are often very irresponsible, sometimes right out dangerous to be around.

reptile3

12-29-2008, 08:08 AM

Correct!! On my ball python group, some man who had kept venomous snakes for over 20+ years, one of his bit parity on his hand. And he was only 12 min from the hospital. He showed in clear pics what happened. THAT would make anyone not one to own one.

If you want the link, let me know... *if I can post it *

Here is another ancient thread worth having a look.

I agree wholeheartedly with James on the statement above, I also admire many handsome Venomous species, But I'd rather just admire the pictures, and see them at a zoo, Even if I were the most experienced keeper on the planet, I'd rather not have a "Pet" that can one day kill me with a nanosecond of bad judgment.

infernalis

12-29-2008, 08:59 AM

Maybe I'm just reading you wrong (probably), but to me that seems like pretty much the worst possible reason to keep a potentially dangerous animal. It's one thing if the dangerous element just spices up the hobby a bit, and a whole other if danger is practically the only reason you're doing it.

Now don't get me wrong, I have a hobby that's pretty much in the same category (i.e. contains a dangerous element, check the profile, guess which one it is ;) ), but if there's one thing I've learned over the years, it's that people who are just looking for a rush are often very irresponsible, sometimes right out dangerous to be around.

Hunting.

I don't know about Finland, but anytime one enters the woods during game season in the USA, there is the genuine risk of some untrained fool with a loaded weapon "accidentally" shooting you.

I have to agree with Loren's statement as well, I myself have some scars, and have seen the helicopter pick up badly wounded people from my track, but there is a sharp contrast here, our trauma centers have expertise in treating broken bones, however they are clueless what to do for a mamba bite.

NetBSD

12-29-2008, 09:05 AM

Hunting.

I don't know about Finland, but anytime one enters the woods during game season in the USA, there is the genuine risk of some untrained fool with a loaded weapon "accidentally" shooting you.

AMEN. around my parts we got some real morons out with loaded rifels, this is one reason i keep my arse home and outof the mountain during hunting.

oh and to stay on topic. i catch and release copperheads all the time, mostly down at the local fishing spot when i see a gang of kids trying to kill the poor thing, but i would never keep anything that is venomous mainly because i have a 1 year old daughter that i am not willing to risk getting bit even if i kept the snake in fort knox

reptile3

12-29-2008, 09:12 AM

AMEN. around my parts we got some real morons out with loaded rifels, this is one reason i keep my arse home and outof the mountain during hunting.

oh and to stay on topic. i catch and release copperheads all the time, mostly down at the local fishing spot when i see a gang of kids trying to kill the poor thing, but i would never keep anything that is venomous mainly because i have a 1 year old daughter that i am not willing to risk getting bit even if i kept the snake in fort knox

We have them around here alot, but I never seen one.... just dead ones ran over or the shed.

infernalis

12-29-2008, 09:12 AM

I would never keep anything that is venomous mainly because i have a 1 year old daughter that i am not willing to risk getting bit even if i kept the snake in fort knox

Ditto, I have kids 9, 12, 15, 26 and a grand daughter to think about.

Stefan-A

12-29-2008, 09:16 AM

Hunting.
Target shooting.

I don't know about Finland, but anytime one enters the woods during game season in the USA, there is the genuine risk of some untrained fool with a loaded weapon "accidentally" shooting you.Not the case here. We average about one or two accidental deaths and about as many wounded per year. Usually because of a negligent discharge.

But I've heard it can get pretty wild elsewhere in the world during hunting season.

infernalis

12-29-2008, 09:19 AM

Target shooting..

Why? are you the target? do you wear a shirt with a red circle in the centre?

adamanteus

12-29-2008, 09:24 AM

I agree with Shannon and Loren, many people do have dangerous hobbies.... but that danger is normally only to ones self. When you keep venomous snakes, you put others in danger too.
I have very mixed feelings on the matter..... I kept them for many years, so I can't really judge others, but as Stefan points out, a lot depends on the individual and their motives for wanting to keep venomous snakes.
If there were no children in the house, I might well be tempted again.

gregmonsta

12-29-2008, 09:25 AM

I will never have venemous pets ... I'm too unlucky ... mild anaphelapsis and a terrible allergy to horses puts the vast majority of antivenin out of my reach ... Personal choice, me thinks ... climbing K2 has an almost 50% death rate ... people still do it :D ... I would love to see a venemous collection but would keep my hands off ... as much as I would love to.

reptile3

12-29-2008, 09:26 AM

Why? are you the target? do you wear a shirt with a red circle in the centre?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/reptile3/reptile3-3/1213985835043-511159693.gif

Stefan-A

12-29-2008, 09:30 AM

Why? are you the target? do you wear a shirt with a red circle in the centre?
I'm not the one people usually hunt, either. :D No, the reason it's not hunting is because nobody would take a guy like that hunting in the first place. You'd get ostracized in a heartbeat.

infernalis

12-29-2008, 09:34 AM

Getting serious for a moment (Imagine that) we frequently target shoot with assault rifles that fire supersonic rounds to 800 yards before they fall subsonic.

A ricochet would be instantly fatal with the wrong back drop.

adamanteus

12-29-2008, 09:55 AM

My biggest regret is that I never really got serious about photographing my venomous snakes, I guess I always thought there would be other opportunities. Plus, it was before the days of digital photography, so it was a pain in the butt.
Most of the decent photos I did have were given away or lost over the years, but here are the few I could find...

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//541/medium/Cape_2.jpg

Naja nivea

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//541/medium/Cape_1.jpg

Naja nivea

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//541/medium/McGregor.jpg

Crotalus adamanteus

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//535/medium/Untitled-1.jpg

Crotalus (durissus) vegrandis

adamanteus

12-29-2008, 09:55 AM

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//535/medium/Naja_sputatrix.jpg

Naja sputatrix

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//535/medium/Trimeresurus_albolabris.jpg

Trimeresurus albolabris

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//535/medium/Bitis_arietans.jpg

Bitis arietans

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//535/medium/Agkistrodon_contortrix_mokasen.jpg

Agkistrodon contortrix

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//538/medium/Agkistrodon_piscivorus_conanti.jpg

Agkistrodon piscivorus conanti

reptile3

12-29-2008, 10:03 AM

Amazing James... you had all those?

adamanteus

12-29-2008, 10:05 AM

Amazing James... you had all those?

I did, Stephanie. And many, many more.:)

infernalis

12-29-2008, 10:32 AM

And hair too.....

Aundrea

12-29-2008, 10:40 AM

OMG Wayne hahahahaha your too funny!!!!!

Do you still have anymore of them snakes James?

reptile3

12-29-2008, 10:40 AM

And hair too.....

with hair, without... either way!!:)

Loren

12-29-2008, 07:31 PM

AWESOME James.

As for the rest of the posts, I agree fully that a persons living situation (kids around, how well they can be locked and sealed away from other people, etc. ) makes a big difference on whether or not a person should keep hots. Its also the keepers responsibilty to research whether or not the local hospital has the abilty to treat a bite from the species you intend to keep.
And although I did compare this hobby to other thrill seaking hobbies- I was not intending to indicate that keeping hots should be done for the rush. It should be done because of a sincere facination of the animals. In fact, those who feel the need to seek adrenaline rushes with hots should probably not keep them.
Bottom line- keeping hots is most definitely not for almost all reptile keepers, but for the few who can do it properly, I am happy to see it. It is not without risk, even for the best keeper, and those people must understand the chance they take, and be ultra commited to making sure they never endanger the public.

snakeman

12-29-2008, 08:15 PM

Good luck finding a hospital that knows how to treat a snakebite.Keep venomous if you want.I have had them for years.Be prepared for the consequences.$1000's in medical bills,disfigurement,confiscation of all your herps, and or death.

Hornets23

12-29-2008, 09:33 PM

James..love the copperhead. That is probably the only venomous snake that I would even be tempted to keep. We had one in my herpetology classroom along with a cottonmouth. She was positively gorgeous but honestly, even though copperheads dont have venom that is as stong as a lot of the others, I dont think I could justify the risk.

aSnakeLovinBabe

12-29-2008, 09:56 PM

Maybe I'm just reading you wrong (probably), but to me that seems like pretty much the worst possible reason to keep a potentially dangerous animal. It's one thing if the dangerous element just spices up the hobby a bit, and a whole other if danger is practically the only reason you're doing it.

Well, you are entirely right.... and the sad thing is, that when I ask some people why they keep venomous snakes... a lot of them answer something along these lines. Usually, these are younger single guys between 20 and 30. The people that say that, I say to myself.... never take snake keeping lessons from that guy!!! And continue on my way. I want to keep them purely to observe and to photograph. I am not at all keen on jumping out of a perfectly good airplane and I am not particularly fond of rollercoasters... and I have target shot many guns but I don't like doing it. The same goes for venomous snakes, I am not going to get into keeping them because it's dangerous.... if I DO get into keeping any.... it will be for the observe and photograph the beautiful snake aspect.:)

gregmonsta

12-30-2008, 08:27 AM

Good stuff James :D glad you found some of those photos ;)

charles parenteau

01-23-2009, 10:20 PM

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s152/parenteau/Photo0041.jpgThis is my regret, I sold this boiga cyanea to my friend Martin..2 years ago.She give me two cluch of eggs that turn to be unfertile...At the same time my male died,unable to breed them...
I already order one male and 2 female To my friend Phil.
Today I went to my friend home to take a look at her shes around 5 foot long.Very Docile :) ..

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s152/parenteau/Photo0040.jpg

guidofatherof5

01-24-2009, 07:50 AM

Beautiful snake!

infernalis

01-24-2009, 08:11 AM

Here is some interesting snakes, A friend has these.......

http://www.dekayi.info/vipers/green.jpg

http://www.dekayi.info/vipers/yellow.jpg

http://www.dekayi.info/vipers/marble.jpg

http://www.dekayi.info/vipers/greenblack.jpg

adamanteus

01-24-2009, 08:52 AM

Charles, I also kept a pair of Boiga cyanea for many years! It is my regret also, that I ever got rid of them.

infernalis

01-24-2009, 09:34 AM

James did you start off with babies or adults?

Charles, I also kept a pair of Boiga cyanea for many years! It is my regret also, that I ever got rid of them.

reptile3

01-24-2009, 01:06 PM

Charles, what a very nice looking snake!!

Wayne, OMG! those are gorgeous!!! LOVE the 3rd one.. those are vipers right?

Stefan-A

01-24-2009, 01:10 PM

those are vipers right?
Yes, indeed they are.

guidofatherof5

01-24-2009, 01:34 PM

Wow, great looking group.
Thanks Wayne for sharing the photos.

charles parenteau

01-24-2009, 01:52 PM

I got them a few days after birth...it was my male now he's dead ..He died because my female almost eat him completely .2 days after this event he died...
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s152/parenteau/serpent2005009.jpghttp://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s152/parenteau/serpent2005010.jpg
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s152/parenteau/maleboigacyanea.jpg

infernalis

01-24-2009, 01:54 PM

Charles, did you have to force feed them?

I still wonder about James' (former) Boiga cyanea

One could say, I am really fond of the green snakes..

Loren

01-24-2009, 02:10 PM

Those are all very pretty snakes. Wish the arboral vipers werent illegal here. I think we can have Boiga's though. I know Mangroves are legal here.

charles parenteau

01-24-2009, 03:03 PM

What you want is the boiga to take a feeding mode rather than defensive posture...if you try to feed them like other snake with tweezers the boiga will try to escape or will bite as defense ,this way the boiga dont keep the pinky in is mouth long enough..
keep the boiga tight in your hand 1 inche behind the head it allow the snake to bite freely ..then irritate the boiga with the smallest pinky by pushing on his head with it...
The snake will bite furiously or will chew the pinky ,the boiga will taste it.for the first two meal you should put snake shed on pinky head like helmet or kill a lezard or whatever ...i sacrifice a babie garter with anomalies..keep the boiga in your hand until he eat it completely or partialy..a few meal like that and you boiga will eat without problem..
its not force fed .the snake eatit by himself...
Be patient ,you should keep only the one who eat the first ...or its hell .

ssssnakeluvr

01-24-2009, 05:08 PM

those are some sweet looking snakes!!!!! Love the mangroves, but are rear fanged and we can't have them here...:(

Loren

01-24-2009, 05:13 PM