Decomposition- An alternate heat source?

[Zephyr]

Okay, last summer while at the garden plots, I was told that little dekay's snakes, and many other reptiles, liked to bask ontop of the pine, cedar, and other mulch piles near the plots. My friend from the interpretive center said that the compost piles generate MASSIVE amounts of heat, so one night I climbed onto one and dug down a foot. I couldn't dig any deeper than this, because the heat almost burned my hands. I was amazed by the amount of heat produced! The pile was about 5-6 feet high, and I'd only dug down what seemed to be a foot, so imagine the core temperature!
So, my question is, if there would be some way a system could be developed for heating garter, or reptile tanks in general, using compost heat.

[adamanteus]

That could work, Kyle.... if you want a great, steaming pile of rotting organic matter in your room!:D

[Lori P]

In my run-in sheds for the horses and goats, starting early winter, I stop cleaning them out and start to pile new straw on top of the old straw to form what they call a manure mat. The stuff at the bottom starts composting, and heat starts rising. In the dead of winter, when there are by then a couple months worth of layered straw, you can walk in, crouch down and feel the heat rising. The goats looooooooove it.

The first few weeks, there is an ammonia odor and so I use PDZ powder to control the odors. After it really gets composting tho, there is no odor unless you dig far down.

Now, as for doing this in a small space like a reptile tank... I would think the ammonia would be overwhelming. Outside in the run-ins, there is plenty of ventilation. I can't think right now how you would get around the ammonia build up in an enclosed tank.

[Zephyr]

Well, what I'm wondering is if you can use a smaller amount of pine/cedar and get the same effect.

[Zephyr]

Also, it wouldn't be IN the tank, but under it, like a heat pad.
If it were in the tank, the tank would have to be well-ventilated.

[adamanteus]

In order to work it needs volume... small quantities don't work.

[anji1971]

Kyle, I wonder if there's a way to make it work for your outdoor pen.........for cool nights, and to be able to use it over a longer season?

[Zephyr]

In order to work it needs volume... small quantities don't work.Actually, I'm thinking it's just the surface area that's a concern. Like bacteria orbs in a fish tank filter, it could be very effective, given there's enough microsurface. If one were to use finely diced cedar or pine, it would probably work but decompose too rapidly... There has to be an equilibrium somewhere...

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

the reason there is so much heat under there is because of the massive amounts of compost that are packed together, preventing the heat from espacing right away. Since the heat cant get out right away, it gradually adds up and gets warmer and warmer. that's why the surface isn't as warm as the middle, because the heat is always slowly seeping out. if you take that pile of mulch and spread it out in a thin layer on the ground, it will not feel warm because the heat can escape too quickly. You would need a very deep pile of compost in order to produce enough heat to be effective. It's a nice idea, but trust me, if it worked efficiently, people everywhere would have their reptile tanks on compost.

[Zephyr]

But didn't society also just realize that using carbon tetrafluoride can give you cancer?
What I'm say is, there has to be some possibility to change what we're currently using to make things better for the snakes and more convenient for us.
I'm going to experiment with container thickness, etc... There has to be some way to harvest this energy...
Maybe tightly packed cedar/pine shards would work, with some sort of lettuce or other weed to start the decaying reaction.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

But didn't society also just realize that using carbon tetrafluoride can give you cancer?

Everything gives us cancer. cancer cells are produced in your body every day, it's all in how efficient your body is at disposing of them. A cancer cell is just a messed up cell that decides it would like to make more of it's kind as fast as possible. it's just that we are exposed to so many un natural things today that our bodies are much more prone to slipping up in defenses and allowing cancerous cells to multiply.

Much of society also had no idea until recently that they were being unknowingly mass medicated with fluoride.

I mean, go for it, I don't completely doubt your efforts, but i don't think that it will be an efficient way to heat our reptiles. If you do manage to roduce enough heat in such a small space, how will you control it?

[Stefan-A]

There is a way to use a compost to heat a terrarium. You create anaerobic conditions, which leads to a rotting process instead of decomposition and you could collect the methane and burn it to heat up your tank. ;)

Or, you could draw a water pipe through the center of the compost (with a few coils in there to add surface area and exposure time) to transfer the heat from the compost to the water and then lead it back indoors to the terrarium.

I don't think it's worth the trouble.


Other stuff about composts:

The heat is a problem, a compost can reach temperatures of about 70 degrees Celsius at best, but most organisms that break down organic matter are dead by about 45. Likewise, their activity slows down as it gets cooler. The heat energy escapes into the environment, that's why the surface is colder than the core of a compost. And I'm afraid it does need volume to work. Otherwise it will be too cold to decompose efficiently.

One thing that would be interesting, though, would be a worm compost, but it would be more of a feeding than a heating solution. That one doesn't need volume, you can have one in a 10 liter bucket if you want to. Unfortunately, the worms usually used indoors, are Eisenia. The toxic kind, if you remember.

[drache]

I dumped some nightcrawlers in my compost and contrary to what I'd heard, they did not make off in search for better compost - apparently they like our diet and are sticking around to work on the refuse

I think that providing an appropriate temp gradient in a small space is hard enough
even if you get a small process going which might be hard, but perhaps not impossible, it's gonna be a long time to get it to stable heat

I think it's a very interesting long-term project
I guess you'd need some insulating medium to make up for piles of plant matter

btw
there is an article in the current "Reason" magazine by Brian Doherty, titled "Power from the People", that might interest you
I was looking, but it's not on their web-site yet
it's about making machines that essentially run on certain kinds on garbage and are carbon neutral