ID

[Tori]

Ok, help me out here. An Oregon red spotted garter has a single stripe down its back with no side stripes, right? Usually has a blue or black belly? I've been checking them out online because of a photo I received from someone in Oregon that said he had one for sale. But the photo that he sent me is wrong. Half the sites online don't even list it as a native snake for Oregon and some of the ones that do have the wrong photo with it like this one: wildherps.com - Common Gartersnake (Thamnophis sirtalis) (http://www.wildherps.com/species/T.sirtalis.html#7/28/2001) Here is the photo the guy sent me. I know it isn't a red spotted, but it doesn't look like any eastern I've run across either. Keep in mind that the web sites don't even agree on what is native there. They don't list the puget either. Only the eastern, terrestial, North Western, and Santa Cruz, but there are also the california redsided, Mountain garter, and Valley garter present in Oregon. So, I'm not sure what kind this is for sure. I'm leaning towards California red sided (not all of them have the blue) or the Valley. Opinions?

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t201/DragonDreams_album/Snakes/GarterSnake.jpg

[adamanteus]

My first thought was parietalis, but Oregon is outside their range. So I would have to say it's a fitchi, but that decision is only made by a process of elimination. I bet Don or Roy will be able to help you out with this one.

[Stefan-A]

Did he say it was wildcaught in Oregon? Looks like a parietalis to me.

[Tori]

Yes, it is supposed to be wild caught/long time captive

[Stefan-A]

If that's the case, I too lean towards fitchi.

[GarterGuy]

Yeh, I'd have to agree with Stephan.....T.fitchi. It does kind of look like it could be a infernalis, but even though they don't always have blue, they do pretty much always have red on the top of the head, which this guy seems to be lacking. It's definitely not one of the elegans complex, it's got seven instead of eight upper labials and numbers 6 and 7 aren't enlarged. Yeh, I'm definitely thinking fitchi.

[drache]

this is just an odd question
not that I know anything, but . . .
who's to say that a snake you find in the wild absolutely has to be one naturally occurring in that area
how can we be sure that it's not a released snake or the offspring of one?

[Stefan-A]

That's a valid point, Rhea. However, it is in my opinion less probable, that this snake would be one of them, instead of just another native garter that just happens to be difficult to identify.

[Thamnophis]

Compare your snake with these on this page:

Thamnophis - Foto's (http://www.kousebandslangen.nl/sirtalis-foto%27s_fitchi.htm)

[ssssnakeluvr]

looks like a parietalis....I don't think it was caught up there....it may have been wild caught elsewhere and they got it and are now selling it.

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

that probaly isnt a real pic of the snake, ive seen that picture around before on common garter caresheets for a while (like a year-ish)

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

and the first pic from that link looks a lot like a puget/red spot integrade because the orange does not seem red enough for a fitchi and it has a blue tint on its head

[Stefan-A]

that probaly isnt a real pic of the snake, ive seen that picture around before on common garter caresheets for a while (like a year-ish)
Common Garter Snake (Thamnophis sirtalis) (http://webspinners.com/coloherp/geo/species/spethsi.php)

Northwestern Ontario Reptile & Amphibian Species - Eastern Garter Snake (http://www.borealforest.org/reptiles/garter_snake.htm)

:rolleyes:

[Snake lover 3-25]

http://www.kousebandslangen.nl/sirtalisfoto%27s/Thamnophis_sirtalis_fitchii_Chad_Lane_02.jpg

is that not the biggest snake head you've ever seen?

[Tori]

I'm hoping that he is wrong about what it looks like. You know, just found that photo and figured that one was close enough to what he had. Either way, it doesn't look good.

[zooplan]

Tori,

you should ask for an original photo of the snake he likes to sell!
A photo taken from the web may allways fool you about species and the qualities of the offered specimen.

BTW: I agree that the photo shows a red sided garter snake.

[Charlet_2007]

http://www.kousebandslangen.nl/sirtalisfoto%27s/Thamnophis_sirtalis_fitchii_Chad_Lane_02.jpg

is that not the biggest snake head you've ever seen?

retic have bigger lol im kidding but yes for a garter its huge!!!!!!!!

[ssssnakeluvr]

if you look closely you can see brown in the background color, normal in red siders, but not found in valley garters.