Is it worth it????

[GarterGuy]

Ok everyone, I need some advice or words of wisdom on something that's been bugging me for about a week now. I'm looking for a REALLY nice garter to be the "paramount" of my collection. I checked out Felzer's list of what is expected for 2008 and found that he was possibly going to have babies of the red hypo T.radix. I had seen the one example of this snake on his page for a while and wondered why he never just decided to breed it normally (he's crossing it with an albino to make a "hybino") to produce nice red T.radix. It's an outstanding looking snake and I'd love to work with radix and it being a red radix is really cool. I'm not really into the freaky crosses and hybrids that are out there....but I've seen pics of other red T.radix, so I assume this is a natural (yet rare) colour variety. Now though, here's the big BUT.....BUT he's asking $255 per snake! I figured maybe around $100 or so for them (same as the flame sirtalis), but was not ready for $255 ea., which comes out to over $500 a pair (I gotta get a pair if I'm getting any!). So this is what I'm beating myself up over....is it worth $500 to have a rare and beautiful garter???? I could get almost 4 flame sirtalis for that much cash.

[GarterGuy]

Oh yes, and here's a pic of the hypo red T.radix, just so you know what I'm talking about.:D

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//517/hyporedT_radix.jpg

[drache]

hmm
is it worth it?
if you got it just to have a beautiful garter, it could be
if you're spending double to get a pair, you must be interested in breeding them, with the idea of profits in the future
in that case I must say that there probably isn't a huge market for 250 buck garters
I mean - you're into them and you're balking, right?

[GarterGuy]

hmm
is it worth it?
if you got it just to have a beautiful garter, it could be
if you're spending double to get a pair, you must be interested in breeding them, with the idea of profits in the future
in that case I must say that there probably isn't a huge market for 250 buck garters
I mean - you're into them and you're balking, right?

LOL....good point Rhea!:D I am interested in breeding them, but not for the interest in making some huge profit off of them. If I were to get them and breed them I'd probably only sell the offspring for less then $100 (that might upset some, but I'm not expecting to get rich off my snakes...I just like them). I don't breed for profit, I just don't like having a snake sitting around in a cage waiting to die. All life has this undeniable drive to pass on it's genes, so I like to allow my critters to be able to do the same....if only once in a while. It also gives me the satisfaction in being able to give a little bit to the hobby that I love and to be able to provide someone with good, healthy, captive bred snakes...which aren't always easy to find with garters.

[ssssnakeluvr]

hmm
is it worth it?
if you got it just to have a beautiful garter, it could be
if you're spending double to get a pair, you must be interested in breeding them, with the idea of profits in the future
in that case I must say that there probably isn't a huge market for 250 buck garters
I mean - you're into them and you're balking, right?

the market is bigger than you think...he sells out every year!! the reason it costs more is they are more rare than the flame easterns, which are common. these crosses will carry the red genes and the albino genes. the babies could all be normal looking and just carrying the genes for red, albino, and the red hybino. Like my xmas x nebraska cross. the babies are normal, but when they get to breeding size and i can breed them, they will produce a variety, nebraska albinos, ohio albinos, xmas albinos, and hopefully xmas nebraska albinos.
I have pics of red plains garters, they aren't common. the one in The Garter Snakes: Evolution and Ecology, (the big book by Rossman), is a deep red, looks like a red siders almost. would love to have one like that!!!

[ssssnakeluvr]

oh, and there was one on the old thamnophis.com....was as red as the new erythristic eastern Scott just got, the one that was found and shown on the field herp forum. I asked Scott about it and it was found in Kansas and released...not sure where in Kansas...but I sure hope it shows up next time I am out there!!!! :D

[adamanteus]

The question is, Roy, 'Is it worth it to you?' If they are what you want, and you can afford them, then of course they are worth it. I say 'go for it' and enjoy yourself!:)

[reptileparadise]

I'm with James...Its all up to you!
If you like the snake and want it...you'll pay the price. If you're not sure what to do, you're probably not really wanting it.
Make the descission with your heart, not you mind! (the mind always says no!)

[Josh]

To be honest i dont really believe it would be worth it. unless yuo plan on breeding AND finding someone else to pay that much money, i doubt it will be worth it!. when i get my breeding started this year im gonna lower the prices so even a begginer can afford a nice looking garter if he/she so chooses!

[Lori P]

If it's important to you, then do what feels right. If you're hesitating, decide if it's because you're worried others will think that you spent to much (who cares what others think!!!!) or if it's because it would be a financial hardship (that's valid). Then do what makes you happiest!!!

[drache]

cool
I think one can really want something and still balk at the price
but if you're still considering it, it sounds like the financial part more a stretch than a hardship
for purely selfish reasons of course, I'd like to encourage you
it is an amazing looking snake
and I imagine that Scott will give you a break of some sort when you take a pair
and after rereading your post I realize that at the end you ask "...is it worth $500 to have a rare and beautiful garter????"
maybe not one - but two? sure, why not

[Zephyr]

Ya know, maybe you could get one and arrange some sort of a breeding loan. :P
Especially if you get a female.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

Scott is a great guy. Scott is first in line to recieve hypo babies when they finally arrive from the F2 of a crossing of son to mom. i cant wait to see them! the first ever!!!

[GarterGuy]

Thanks everybody for the advice. Yeh, still thinking. The money isn't really a problem, I've got it.....it's just that I've NEVER spent that kind of money on any critter before. My most expensive animals was a Nosy Be Panther chameleon at $175. I haven't spent more then $50 on a snake before. Don't know, guess it just makes me nervous. One thing I do need to check is how the genetics work with these guys. If it's a codominant situation like flames and erythristic easterns..so that if I breed red radix to red radix, I'll get red radix, then it's worth it. But if it's a more complex thing where I have to worry about crosses and such, it's really not for me. I really like "natural" garters.....as pretty as all the crosses and such are, I really prefer what comes out of nature. I also don't like the idea that I won't be able to get an unrelated pair and will basically be getting brother and sister. Part of me is really thinking of waiting and seeing what else will come along. I think I'm a bit impatient and worried that I might be missing out on something really cool. Don't want to just get it, 'cause I'm afraid of missing out. Hmmm...think I need to sleep on this one.;)

[GarterGuy]

Well I've come to the decision that I think I'm going to save my cash and just wait. I'm probably going to get a melanistic T.e.vagrans from Scott, but I think I'll hold off on the hypo red T.radix. Figure it's early in the year yet, and who knows what I might find come spring time.:)