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View Full Version : Jellybeans.. female only tank?


CrazyHedgehog
02-10-2008, 07:56 AM
OK, found these in the tank this morning, they were fed last night cut up trout and pinkies, and at first I thought it was the trout that I had found regurgetated...but they are jellybeans..
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/jellybeans.jpg
Notice the one in the middle has a darker area, a few did so I decided to take a closer look.... now bear in mind that this is probably about 5mm so really hard to get a good pic.... but one tiny snake
http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/tinyjellysnake.jpg
Now for the really odd thing, this is a tank of females, they havent had a male in with them for over a year!!
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 07:59 AM
Damn, what a shame, Inge. What species are they?
Lori P
02-10-2008, 07:59 AM
OMG!!! That poor little baby... so why did mom pass these at this point??
Stefan-A
02-10-2008, 08:14 AM
Now for the really odd thing, this is a tank of females, they havent had a male in with them for over a year!!
Well, they can retain sperm for more than four years. :)

I'm not sure though that they even need a male to be able to pop out jelly beans.
CrazyHedgehog
02-10-2008, 08:18 AM
These were the red sided garters, they all seemed to produce last year (millions of them), so I thought I would give them a rest this year..(that and I still have a few of the babies from last year)
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 08:19 AM
I'm not sure though that they even need a male to be able to pop out jelly beans.

I think a male would be needed to produce a well developed embryo, as featured in the picture though. Then again, if enough study was done we might find evidence of parthenogenesis. It certainly occurs in some other reptile species.
Lori P
02-10-2008, 08:21 AM
Really?? In snakes??
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 09:33 AM
I know it happens in the Typhlopidae. Maybe others too.
A paper presented in 'Heredity' (2002 or 2003) by Groot and Bruins, puts forward some compelling evidence for parthenogenesis in Python molurus bivittatus.
There was also a study suggesting parthenogenesis in Wandering Garter Snakes from the mid '90s by a guy named 'Schuett', or something similar.
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 09:54 AM
I 'Googled' it (in the absence of Stefan:rolleyes:) and found this link.....Self-cloning snake (http://cmbi.bjmu.edu.cn/news/0302/89.htm)
aSnakeLovinBabe
02-10-2008, 10:14 AM
i read that article... really good stuff!!!
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 10:21 AM
Maybe we should conduct an experiment? Anyone with neonate Wandering Garters fancy trying it out?
Stefan-A
02-10-2008, 11:04 AM
Maybe we should conduct an experiment? Anyone with neonate Wandering Garters fancy trying it out?
Huh, what? :D
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 11:33 AM
Someone could keep an all female group in a rich environment, providing an abundance of everything, except mates.... and see if they reproduce.:)
ssssnakeluvr
02-10-2008, 05:48 PM
hmmmmm...I have wandering garters all over out here....I might give it a try. I have a western terretrial female that threw a slug 2 summers ago and hasn't been with a male for 3 years before that....
adamanteus
02-10-2008, 05:57 PM
I guess you're just the man for the job, Don! Could you keep a female (or two) from birth and raise them in isolation... and see what happens?
I think the key might be to offer an environment that could sustain a higher population, but deprive them of an opportunity to mate.
If parthenogenesis is possible in Garter Snakes, it would be nice if Thamnophis.com proved it!:)
ssssnakeluvr
02-10-2008, 08:03 PM
just keep reminding me.....I can get a gravid female or 2 from out here somewhere, have an awesome 20 gal long tank to raise them in, and can post info on them. gonna be fun!!!!
mycolorfulheart
02-10-2008, 08:03 PM
I wouldn't be surprised at all if parthenogenesis was possible. I'm not planning on breeding Raven, (and the last day of her brumation she had like 10 jelly beans) so we'll see what happens! I keep hearing more and more reports of parthenogenesis happening in more and more reptile species; i expect that the more captive-bred reptiles the world is keeping, more and more species will be shown to have this trait. Cool stuff!
anji1971
02-10-2008, 08:56 PM
Okay, here's a question.......
How come some snakes throw so many jellybeans, and some hardly any?? When I had Dojo she only threw one in the whole two years, and Deejay never has. Mind you, Deejay's been alone since birth.
But some of you have snakes popping out jellybeans right and left, it seems. Is there a reason for the difference??