a very "special" checkered garter....

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I thought that you would all like to take a look at this little fellow. He was born late in the year in 2007, with only one other brother and a sister. That's right, a full grown checkered albino gives birth to just THREE. Why? I am pretty sure she was in bad hands before I brought her and her mate home in late august. She had a respiratory infection and I can tell by the shape of her nose that she had mouth rot at some time in her life.

Well we fought the sickness, that's behind us, she is now in brumation, but her babies are well.... weird. Obviously i was VERY surprised to see babies in the tank one day. Also a lot of infertile slugs, I suspect poor husbandry is to blame. One of the babies passed away early on. The other two are growing like WEEDS.

When you see the pictures below, don't freak out. He's not dead. Weetod, as I have come to call him, is very different from other garter snakes. See, he likes to spend half of his time Upside-down. From what I can tell, this is some kind of balance issue that he was born with. Half the time I will walk into the room and he will be laying there with his cagemates. snuggled up, except he's belly up! Is that unreal or what?!?! When he is right side up, as he crawls, he sometimes turns his head almost as if he is tempted to turn upside down once more... and i mean he does a lot of things upside down! drinks, eats, sleeps, and he slithers around his tank that way too! but like I said, he is only upside down half the time. His sister Upsy-Daisy shows signs of this too, only she never turns upside down, she just twitches a bit on occasion.

Has anyone else ever seen this kind of thing? My conclusion is that since mom was very ill whle carrying babies, she lost most of the clutch and the babies have a bit of a birth defect of some sort. I of course, will never breed or sell these two. But he has become a favorite of mine! here are some pics. He's 4 months old and growing FAST!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v447/xxAngelinblackxx/camera/P1010013.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v447/xxAngelinblackxx/camera/P1010031.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v447/xxAngelinblackxx/camera/P1010045.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v447/xxAngelinblackxx/camera/P1010049.jpg

[MoJo]

There is a hereditary disease in corn snakes that has the affected babies acting very weird but usually only when excited - around feeding time or when they fear a predator. These snakes are called "stargazers". It seems to be passed on as a simple recessive gene.

For more info check this out: The Stargazer Project... - The Source (http://www.cornsnakesource.com/forum/cccorns-cmg-tjsac/768-stargazer-project.html)

Discussion...Our Sunkissed Genes (Stargazer/Sfactor gene) - The Source (http://www.cornsnakesource.com/forum/cornsnake-discussions/2834-discussion-our-sunkissed-genes-stargazer-sfactor-gene.html)


It seems what your snake is doing is similar but more extreme. There may be other diseases that do this but I can not remember what they might be.

Joanna

[EdgyExoticReptiles]

aww its cute

[Stefan-A]

I'm probably wrong, but doesn't "stargazing" refer to one of the symptoms of the neurological disorder caused by thiamine deficiency? In garters, I mean.

[drache]

I think she's trying to be a hognose

[mycolorfulheart]

i have heard of a garter with thiamine deficiency stargazing; in that case it would lie upside down in its water bowl.

[Odie]

aww its cute I 'm with Reed :D
Heck, I would like one if it's life is not too effected :eek::cool:

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I will assure you that these guys are NOT deprived of thiamine! they have been this way since birth, and they are constantly pumped with vitamins and i specifically buy the one with the highest thiamine content. I do not feed gold fish or F/t fish, just rosy reds and pinky parts. As well as your occasional worm lol! Mom herself never did anything like this nor ever showed signs of a thiamine problem. Trust me, I have seen the havoc thiamine deficiency wreaks on a garter snake. I tried to save someone else's pet but it was too late...

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

he's living a perfectly normal baby garter life, loves to be handled, he's just doin' it with a different style. Kinda reminds me of Happy feet! lol!

whatever the cause, I love my little Weetod anyways :D

[GarterGuy]

Well I'm glad to see that such a snake is being cared for by such a responsible and loving owner. I always worry when I hear of stuff like this, "What kind of quality of life is the snake having?...Are they going to try and breed it?...Will the animal just become a 'side show' of sorts?"...but in this case, I don't think I have anything to worry about. It's a shame that your female does carry the recesive gene, not surprised since she is albino (often other recesives can go along with albinism). If anything, I'd worry about her possibly produce more snakes with this disorder, might be best to not breed her or breed her to another male, to try and avoid producing more snakes with the disorder. In any case, it's good to see "he's" being well cared for and loved...I hope that little Weetod is able to live a long and healthy life.:)

[Stefan-A]

I will assure you that these guys are NOT deprived of thiamine! they have been this way since birth, and they are constantly pumped with vitamins and i specifically buy the one with the highest thiamine content. I do not feed gold fish or F/t fish, just rosy reds and pinky parts. As well as your occasional worm lol! Mom herself never did anything like this nor ever showed signs of a thiamine problem. Trust me, I have seen the havoc thiamine deficiency wreaks on a garter snake. I tried to save someone else's pet but it was too late...
I don't doubt you, I just meant that stargazing might have another meaning when talking about garters, compared to corns. :)

[MoJo]

Stargazing does in fact refer to the symptoms - ie the way the snakes seem to look upwards. I posted a link to this on the corn snake site and a breeder there that knows the most about stargazing in corn snakes and is also a vet brought up an excellent point. The mother of these babies was ill while she was gravid so it is very likey that the babies were infected by a virus and there was some neurological damage.

The only way to know would be to do a necropsy. You could breed the male to his Mom and you would expect half the babies to be like him.

Joanna

[adamanteus]

In my experience thiamin deficiency causes rather more extreme symptoms, such as convulsing and a more 'cork-screw' type of locomotion. In advanced cases I have seen Garters coil themselves so tightly that they actually prolapse. If the snake were new to you, I would suspect early deficiency, but in view of the time you've had them and your familiarity with correct diet, I would guess this is a simple birth defect brought about through selective in-breeding. As Roy suggested, a recessive gene.

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

lol sorry but I'm not going to breed him to anything! and im not sending him off to no lab!!! because even if i were to do that it would just mean more snakes that have to live with a disorder of some sort. I am quite content just keeping him here and giving him the best possible life, upside down.

Like I said, Mom was very ill and I believe that the illness was what caused this malfunction. Like I said she had a LOT of infertile slugs come out too. Almost 15!

Mom and dad were for sale right next to their last litter when i picked them up! all 30 something of them looked fine! i do not beleive this is a genetic defect as this pair is 4 years old and previous offspring appeared normal. Normal breeding is scheduled to commence in about 3 weeks when I bring them out of brumation. I do not expect this year's litter to have any problems.

[adamanteus]

a LOT of infertile slugs come out too. Almost 15!


So that would be.... what? About 14?:rolleyes::D

[MoJo]

lol sorry but I'm not going to breed him to anything! and im not sending him off to no lab!!! because even if i were to do that it would just mean more snakes that have to live with a disorder of some sort. I am quite content just keeping him here and giving him the best possible life, upside down.

Like I said, Mom was very ill and I believe that the illness was what caused this malfunction. Like I said she had a LOT of infertile slugs come out too. Almost 15!

Mom and dad were for sale right next to their last litter when i picked them up! all 30 something of them looked fine! i do not beleive this is a genetic defect as this pair is 4 years old and previous offspring appeared normal. Normal breeding is scheduled to commence in about 3 weeks when I bring them out of brumation. I do not expect this year's litter to have any problems.

I certainly agree that it sounds like this happened because she was ill. I was not suggesting that you do anything to prove if this was genetic but discussing the ways in which you could do it.

Good luck with this years litter.

[Sid]

The little guy is definately unique. The important thing is he's healthy and looks great:). Never seen the behavior in a Garter.

[Serpentine99]

cool little garter you got there, best to luck with him in the future, also how does he eat?

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

he eats like a pig. He eats every three days, he gets rosies and pinky chunks. He will gorge until he looks like a little sometimes-upside-down sausage.

[Serpentine99]

what i mean is does he eat upside down as well?

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

sometimes yes sometimes no lol! the next time I feed him I'll try and get pics of him doing it upside down. It seems it all depends on his mood lol

[tikichick]

That's wild! What an odd little guy, lol.