Eastern Blackneck Garters now protected?

[sschind]

I was told by someone at a local swap that the Eastern Blackneck Garter (Thamnophis cyrtopsis ocellatus) was recently put on the protected list. He did not say which list, and he did not specify who had given him the information.

Has anyone heard any information of the sort.

Thanks

Steve

[zooplan]

Eastern Blackneck Garters only have a small range of habitat so you should look for the protection list of the state where they are native.

[MoJo]

I have not heard about this and did a quick search on the web, at the Texas Wildlife site and the US site and found no info pertaining to this!

Phew! You had me very worried...

Joanna

[ssssnakeluvr]

Me too!!!!!! :eek:

[enigma200316]

but if you already had the Garters before they went portected wouldn't you be able to keep them??

[sschind]

Keep them perhaps but breeding them and selling the offspring might be more difficult. I don't know what the new Texas law regarding native herps is all about but maybe that's what he was talking about.

[lyn s]

i now the butler garter is threaten.wi

[zooplan]

In Germany all native reptiles and amphibians are protected by law but you can get permission to keep, breed and sell captive bred offspring for most species.
This is made to protect wild populations against illegal catching.

[Thamnophis]

If it is neccesary to protect T. c. ocellatus because it is threatened it would be a good thing to protect it.
But not only protecting the snakes is usefull. The habitat should also be protected otherwise it is useless.
I presume this atractive species is caught a lot from the wild or am i wrong?

[sschind]

I suppose it might be collected a lot. I just don't see that many garters in general being offered here in the states as they don't seem to be all that popular (as opposed to say a corn snake) I see quite a few wholesale lists and garters are not listed on many of them. Maybe its the "native" thing that turns people off. It seems that the rest of the world and Europe more specifically is way ahead of the US in breeding or even keeping garters. I know that there are a few people out there who are very serious about it and a lot of the people on this forum are more than simple beginners. Still, the garters have a long way to go before I would consider them a popular pet species here in the US.

You are very correct in your assessment of habitat conservation as well as protection of the species in general. From what I understand, with many species (the San Francisco garter for example) there is no reason why this should be an endangered species from the standpoint of numbers or the potential for extinction. The problem is that there is no place for them to live in their native range any more. It doesn't sound like it would be a problem to restock a large area with plenty of snakes but there simply isn't enough suitable habitat for it to happen.

[brandon0133]

the local pet stores here in NC sell garters,,and different kinds to,,might get another sometime soon,,

[sschind]

Still, the garters have a long way to go before I would consider them a popular pet species here in the US.



I should amend that comment to being a popular pet species available in pet shops here in the US. Garter snakes are perhaps one of the most widely kept snakes simply because they are so plentiful and relatively easy to find in the wild. I'm sure many many people got their first start in the hobby by keeping WC garters. Its just that as they are introduced to more exotic species most people tend to forget about the local common stuff (not me, my favorite species of frog is still the Gray tree frog that I grew up surrounded by) Perhaps that is why you don't see them offered as much in the retail trade. I am sure that some stores carry a few but my guess is nothing compared to other colubrids.

Tying this in with the E. Blackneck discussion, I seriously doubt that a few people picking up a garter snake here or there to keep as a pet would have much of an impact on wild populations. Wholesale collection is the aspect of the pet trade that has to be watched closely, and being that garters are not so much in demand the problems of that may be more limited. Obviously those species and subspecies with a more limited range would be more at risk. Add to that the beautiful coloration and relative docile temperament of the E. Blacknecks I could see where it could potentially be a problem. Habitat destruction IMO is still the number one threat to wild populations. If it gets bad enough, sure, then plucking one or two prime breeding females to keep as pets could cause lasting damage to the population but if it gets to that point the species is probably doomed in the wild anyway.

[Thamnophis]

I think it is the combination of collecting them to much and disturbing of the habitat. For example waterpollution. Frogs and fish dissapear and then there is no food for the garters.

[MoJo]

I think I know why someone said the Eastern Blackneck is now protected. From what I understand Texas is going to pass a law restricting the commercial sale/breeding/capturing of any native species. There is an active thread on a corn snake site about this as it pertains to corns but from what I can understand it pertains to all Texas wildlife. I tried to follow the link to the Texas government site but it did not work. If anyone wants the link to that thread PM me and I will give it to you.

Joanna

[zooplan]

That need not to be bad.
We have the same cardinal law.
But it is possible to get a permission to breed and sell captive born specimens.
So we have protected populations of Natrix, Bufo, Bombina ... and also hugh CB populations as well.
Theres no cause for poaching because most native species are avaliable quite cheap with permission but without most of the native parasites

[sschind]

I agree with Joanna that this is probably the source of the information as I received it. If this is the case it should not effect sales outside of Texas.

As far as protecting native animals, I agree with zooplan that it need not be a bad thing. The only problem is that here in Wisconsin, where native herps are protected from sale but some are still allowed to be kept in limited numbers, is that they make no distinction between WC or CBB. They also, according to one person I talked to, make no distinction between subspecies, so technically I would be violating the law if I were to breed and sell ANY Thamnophis sirtalis subspecies, which really sucks.