Getting close

[rwgsnakes]

My western ribbon, Thamnophis proximus proximus , mated 1 month and 20 days ago. She shed a few days ago. I read that they normally shed a week before they have their babies...is this true? how long can they have them after they shed. Do they always go off feed before they have their babies?


Thanks,
Justin

[Lulu Bennett]

the pregnancy is about 90 days but i am not sure about is they go off their food but i guess they would shed is they are carrying a load of babies lol

[Josh]

good luck!!!

[ssssnakeluvr]

normal gestation period is 90-120 days... sounds like she is only half way thru...they will feed generally thru the pregnancy...but I have had a couple that will go off feed before giving birth. you still have some time to go!!

[rwgsnakes]

Awh man, that sucks, i could swear i read somewhere that its 2-3 months... thanks for the info though. Ill keep you all posted,
Thanks

[enigma200316]

remember nature can fool you, it will happen when its time, or not at all....
or atleast thats how I think it goes, but what do I know..........:eek:

[Stefan-A]

Some sources say 60-90 days, the people here say 90-120 days and I trust them a lot more than some random pamphlet.

My snakes mated in May, no babies yet and no slugs. :D

[rwgsnakes]

now we are coming up on three months...she seems very large so im hoping she has them soon.

[adamanteus]

I'll be watching your posts, Justin. Looking forward to seeing photos of baby Ribbons!:)

[Stefan-A]

Yeah, there hasn't been any baby ribbon pics yet. :)

[adamanteus]

That's true, Stefan. Have any of us bred Ribbons this year? I can't remember.

[Stefan-A]

I don't think I've seen any other pictures of ribbons except for a couple of adults and one juvenile in the yawning photo contest. I thought I saw one gravid ribbon in a thread earlier this year, but I don't know what became of that one.

[Lori P]

Justin, send pics anyway!! :-) I like the ribbon snakes... Reed is tempting me sooooo badly to get his..... :-)

[brandon0133]

i was thinking of getting a ribbon,,are they anything like a garter snake? i know this one looks like my garters

[rwgsnakes]

Garters and ribbons are all most the same snake...garters will get larger and are heavier set than ribbons which are normally thin and long. Diet is pretty much the same, but ribbons normally refuse rodents, i personally have gotten my female to eat rodents...but its not to common. other than that they are almost identical...they both fall into the thamnophis family so they cant be all that different if you think about it.

The Father
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/P.jpg

And the Mother
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/O.jpg

Now all we need are the babies to come!!! :)

[rwgsnakes]

aaah what the heck, here are a few more.

Bruno
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/100_2768.jpg
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/100_2767.jpg

Polly
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/100_2764.jpg
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/100_2762.jpg
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/100_2761.jpg

[anji1971]

Very nice -- can't wait to see the babies!!:)

[brandon0133]

man they do look like garters

[adamanteus]

Great looking Ribbons, Justin. Can't wait to see the babies.:D

[brandon0133]

are u going to sell the babies?

[Lori P]

They are so nice!! And I love your "cave"-- I've never seen that!

[rwgsnakes]

thanks everyone, yea, im going to sell all the babies...or maybe keep one or two:D

haha thanks lori

here are a few pics of that whole enclosure.

Starting point
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/entertamentcenter.jpg

all construction complete
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/100_1777-1.jpg

with out glass
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/Homemadetank.jpg

I dont think i have any pics with the glass on and them in it yet.

Ive got a smaller one in the works!
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/100_2501.jpg

thanks,
Justin

[Lori P]

Whoa!!!!! Justin, you MADE that?? What's it made out of?? I want, I want!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rwgsnakes]

hahaha, yea i made it.

It was an old entertainment center, now ribbon snake paradise :p

I glued down cut pieces of styrofoam, plaster of parised them and then painted and sealed. Relativly easy.

Thanks lori.

Styrafoam, just waiting to be turned into something great :D
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/indotank.jpg

Styrafoam finished (except for the cave and water dish areas)
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/newesttankupdate.jpg

Plaster
http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g168/ribbonsnakeyy/tanks%20and%20decor/plaster2.jpg



Justin

[brandon0133]

man thats awsome,,,good job

[drache]

very nice
some day when I've unpacked a few more boxes, I'm going to get into creative habitat tarting
for now I'll just be a little envious

[rwgsnakes]

thanks everyone...it is really fun when you have to time.

[anji1971]

Wow, that IS an incredible looking enclosure. I have an old baby wardrobe/shelving unit that I'd like to convert one day -- you just gave me a whole new world of ideas for it, if I can figure out how to do all that!! Great job!:):)

[brandon0133]

where do u get the plaster of paris stuff? i know how to use fiberglass really good but i dont know if that would hurt the snakes being a chemical like it is

[drache]

most good hardware stores should carry plaster of paris
some arts and crafts stores carry it
you can also use it sort of like paper maché, if you dip strips of gauze in it

[Stefan-A]

most good hardware stores should carry plaster of paris
some arts and crafts stores carry it
you can also use it sort of like paper maché, if you dip strips of gauze in it
That's what I did when I made that hide almost a year ago. :) I used strips of plaster gauze. Really easy to work with, but painting it to look like a rock isn't that easy. ;)

[Lori P]

Man.... I am SO un-artsy!!! We have so many creative people on here-- James and his amazing drawings (I could probably draw a stick snake, lol) and Justin's plaster of paris designs (I would end up covering myself and the floor, walls, ceilings and dogs before I got it in the enclosure) and I remember seeing some very nice wooden cabinets... you guys are serious talents!!!!

[Stefan-A]

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/photos/hidey/hidey1.jpg

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/photos/hidey/hidey2.jpg

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/photos/hidey/hidey3.jpg

http://koti.mbnet.fi/thamnoph/photos/hidey/hidey4.jpg

[brandon0133]

same kinda garter i have

[Lori P]

Wow, NICE, Stefan!! See what I mean?? Talent, talent!!! What else you guys got??

[rwgsnakes]

thanks guys. Also at some hobby stores you can find plaster for trains and stuff.

[brandon0133]

does anyone know if fiberglass is toxic to snakes? it would just be the resin and not the fiber particles

[adamanteus]

I think once the fibre glass is 'cured' it is inert and therefore harmless. Other members might know differently?

[Stefan-A]

I agree with James, it probably isn't toxic.

[Lori P]

But what about all the splinters you get from fiberglass??

[adamanteus]

There should be no splinters on the finished side/face side. It should be smooth.

[Lori P]

Ok. :-) I just know that we bought some fiberglass fence posts to run some electric wire, and even tho they looked smooth, they gave me tons of little splinters.

[adamanteus]

It can be finished as smooth as..well, glass! Like a yatch! Smooth on the outside, bit prickly inside!:D

[anji1971]

Okay, I have a question....
My husband saw all these pictures and he was inspired to try to make something out of styrofoam and plaster for Deejay's new tank! Question is -- when you paint and seal does it matter what type of paint you use? Would some types be toxic to the snakes?? What did all of you use on yours??

It's project time!!!:D

[Lulu Bennett]

lol anji, its a shame my fella doesn't get 'inspired' lol he just loks at the pics and goes 'oh yeah' !!! he isn't to good at taking hints lol bless!:p

[rwgsnakes]

i used acrilic paints that you get in the little tubes at craft stores. The fumes from almost all paints would be harmfull to snakes but given enough time to dry most are just fine.

Please post pics of progression!!! i tried to use superglue to hold the styrafoam down at first but the superglue just melted it away......--hint hint GORILLA GLUE IS A LIFE SAVER :)

[anji1971]

I planned on using my glue gun, but it might melt it too. Denis seems to know what this Gorilla glue is, though, so I guess we'll give it a whirl!! Keep in mind that this is going to be a much smaller project than what's been posted here-- we're just going to start by creating an insert for the 20G tank. Sort of giving the snake a multilevel home, with a loft!!:D:D

[anji1971]

Oh, and acrylic paint won't be any problem, I have a whole bin of it at work, since it's what I use to paint nail art!:)

[brandon0133]

i might take on something like this alittle later myself,,lol

[Lori P]

We gorilla-glued pieces of cholla wood to the back of the 55 gall that holds the 2 ball pythons. We put them at varying heights, so they can climb the back wall as well as their branches. It worked really well! I'm going to do that for the others as well. But I love that styrofoam/plaster idea... might just have to try my hand at it too!! Post pics for sure Anji!!!!!

[anji1971]

C'mon Lori, you can do it!!! Although I'm not quite convinced that I can yet! Think I'll just let hubbie do all the work and I'll look over his shoulder and say things like, "Hmmm, shouldn't that piece sit just a more to the right?......... I'm not sure that's the correct angle on that little section right there...........no, that colour won't work at all............OUCH!!!!":p:p

[Lori P]

You know what I've been thinking... there is a little shop up the road from me going out of business, and she has a lot of display cases in there. I'm going to stop in and see if she's selling them... because there are several that would be just stunning snake enclosers, part wood and part glass. Of course, the problem is then knowing where I'd put them... lol... we have a VERY small house!!!

[anji1971]

I can relate to that -- we have what we call a "Wartime House", built in the early 40's, all very tiny. We could probably fit the whole thing into Brandon's 175G tank!!! ;)

[Lulu Bennett]

You know what I've been thinking... there is a little shop up the road from me going out of business, and she has a lot of display cases in there. I'm going to stop in and see if she's selling them... because there are several that would be just stunning snake enclosers, part wood and part glass. Of course, the problem is then knowing where I'd put them... lol... we have a VERY small house!!!

you know what you should do about that then Lori...
Do as Rhea did and buy a bigger house :D

[Lori P]

I can relate to that -- we have what we call a "Wartime House", built in the early 40's, all very tiny. We could probably fit the whole thing into Brandon's 175G tank!!! ;)

LOL... too funny Anji... I needed that!! Look out Brandon, Anji & I are moving into your tank, we need to spread out!

[Lori P]

you know what you should do about that then Lori...
Do as Rhea did and buy a bigger house :D

Sigh... sounds so easy, doesn't it?! Actually, our big project now is building a new barn, and the truth is I'd live in a cardboard box as long as my barn is perfect!! Jamie keeps asking if I plan to move out there once it's done, and I keep telling him nothing would make me happier than to live with the horses!!!

[anji1971]

See, Lori, that's where you're lucky -- you have all kinds of land to build bigger places. I just have a yard, and while it's a pretty good size for being in the city, it won't ever fit a barn anywhere!!
However, I just love my cute little house, and whenever I think of moving, I look around and think how much I'd miss it. Especially after the gazillions I've spent on the garden!!!:p

[drache]

you know what you should do about that then Lori...
Do as Rhea did and buy a bigger house :D

gosh Lulu
I wish I'd really done that
the actual square footage of the building is just about the same as that of the old place - it's just laid out differently - and it's got a yard
right now I don't feel I've got space and time for more snakes - the babies are keeping me pretty busy and the house is still a mess
moving is a royal pain in the donkey

[Lulu Bennett]

gosh Lulu
I wish I'd really done that
the actual square footage of the building is just about the same as that of the old place - it's just laid out differently - and it's got a yard
right now I don't feel I've got space and time for more snakes - the babies are keeping me pretty busy and the house is still a mess
moving is a royal pain in the donkey
lol sorry Rhea i was under the impression it was bigger lol.
me and the fella are thinking of buying a place next year. it really is worrying me after hearing all the stress you had lol
Prices are really high at the moment but supposed to be going down alot next year so us first time buyers should find it easier lol

[Stefan-A]

It can be finished as smooth as..well, glass! Like a yatch! Smooth on the outside, bit prickly inside!:D
Sorry about the random quote, but I think this part of the discussion just inspired me to try to make a fiberglass terrarium. :D If they can make boats out of it, a terrarium shouldn't be impossible. ;)

[brandon0133]

ive made alot of hand made stuff from fiberglass,,get some tiny fenceing like litle square shapes and bend it the shape u want it,,then use some fiberglass matting and do one layer,,,then use resin ontop of that,,,it will hold shape really good,,,then of course u would want to do the inside next,,

[Stefan-A]

You mean like a permanent frame, or just to get the shape right?

[brandon0133]

permanent frame

[Stefan-A]

I've never done anything out of fiberglass, so maybe I need a bit of practice first. :D

[Cazador]

A word of caution about using fiberglass... It must be completely smooth and sealed, particularily if the rough side is on the inside of a cave where the snake will spend time hanging out. One of the real dangers with fiberglass is that its shards can be easily inhaled. If the little shards from the inside of the cave are rubbed loose, they'll accumulate within the cave on the floor. As the snake moves around within the cave, it may stir these shards up. If the snake is in a small enclosure (cave) where it stirs up fiberglass shards and has its head near the floor where the shards settle, it is more likely to inhale them.

Once shads make their way into the lungs, they have two ways to harm organisms. First, they are notorious for digging into lung tissue, causing lesions, and destroying it. That's particularily bad for garters with only one lung to start with. Second, our detoxification enzymes (P450s aromatase enzymes) are unable to break fiberglass down , but they still try. When this process goes awry, it often leads to respiratory tumors and cancer.

You see why it is so critical to ensure the fiberglass is perfectly sealed on both sides. Personally, I wouldn't do it. You can buy plaster of Paris at most craft stores, including Wal Mart, K-Mart, and similar stores. It's cheap, too. Kind regards,

Rick

[CrazyHedgehog]

does anyone know if fiberglass is toxic to snakes? it would just be the resin and not the fiber particles
surely just the resin would not be a problem, it is just like a plastic glue really

[drache]

how do you work with that stuff anyway?
don't you have to heat it? like really high temps?
the very word fiberglass sounds kind of cool
isn't it just glass fibers?
so what's the resin made out of?
lots of questions . . .

[anji1971]

Back in the day we used to use fiberglass in the salon for nail repairs. It came in thin sheets, like a fine woven fabric, and the resin we use is just an acrylic base(cyanoacrylate). I wonder if this is the same type of thing? It's pretty easy to buff down smooth, although I would worry about the particles being harmful to the snakes as well.

[drache]

since this is something that happens before the snakes ever get to occupy the thing, I'd kind of worry more about the particles in the air while working with the stuff
isn't that stuff hell on your respiratory system?
I mean - once you use it, it follows that you need to smooth it, right?
from what I understand, you need to let it harden completely, and then you essentially smooth it through an abrasion process
wouldn't that cause microscopic airborne fibers of glass to go all over the space you're using?
that kind of stuff worries me

[RZL36]

Keep away from fiberglass. It's not only bad for your snake, it's bad for YOU. Unless you find those little white masks that could fit your snake. Plus I really wouldn't want to know what would happen if that stuff makes its way in between some scales. Sounds like tumors, tumors and more tumors. Tumors all around. I'm good on that.

[brandon0133]

ok heres all i can say about this,,,if u make a metal fence frame,,,then make one outter layer across the metal frame with whats called fiberglass matting,,,let that dry,,when u mix the resin u add a hardner to the mix that causes a chemical reaction and makes the resin harden,,,u soak the fiberglass matting in the resin then hold it up in the air let alot of it drip off then lay it on the metal frame,,,,it will harden and dry pretty fast,,,once u get the outter shell done then turn it over and use a paint brush,,,just mix some more resin (which is the wet liquid stuff) and use a paint brush and brush it on smooth on the inside of the cave ure making,,it will harden fast also,,resin does not have fiberglass in it so it will not effect the snakes at all,,i can understand if the fiberglass matting got on the snakes,,that would be bad,,,but if u keep putting resin on and make it smooth like glass then u wont ever see fiberglass on or around the snakes,,once that dries flip it back over and brush on the resin on the other side,,just like the underside,,,then once its dry paint it how u want it,,,will look awsome,,ill do it just to show everyone how its done,,ive made alot of fiberglass car parts so im sure i can do a cave,,lol