Proper care??

[garter newbie]

I have been reading a lot about garter care and housing. Just wanted to make sure that I'm doing the right things since this is my first experience with keeping a snake and mine isn't eating.
Here's my story:
As I mentioned in my intro, my son and I found a garter in our yard, hiding under the grass, on 11/01/06 in Philadelphia, PA. The temperature outside has been variable lately - generally anywhere from 50's to low 70's by day and 50's to mid-30's at night. I have no idea what type or how old it is. The snake is approx. 13 inches long and 1 cm diameter. It is grayish brown with black diamond spots. At first we placed it in a dry plastic "planet frog" habitat that I had on hand so my son could show his friend. At that point, we weren't sure we were going to keep it as a pet. I placed a plastic plant saucer of water in there and tried to feed it small worms I harvested from our yard. I never witnessed the snake eating them so not sure it did. This past Sunday, we went to the pet store and purchased a 10-gallon tank, aspen bedding, grapevine branch, thermometer and humitity gauge, under tank heater, half log, and water bowl. I also picked up some rosy red minnows and frozen pinkies. I can't say the snake has been very active (although I don't really know what's normal) and still have not seen it eat anything yet. I've continued to try feeding small worms (wiggling in front of the snake) as well as a minnow (placed live in a jar lid w/ water), and two quarter pieces of defrosted pinkie (tried wiggling in front of it as well as left it sit in the cage). The temp in the cage is 75 F on the heated side (I have the gauge attached at the top of the cage not at the bottom were the heat mat is though) and the humitity is at @ 67. I keep the room temp anywhere from 66 - 70F. Since yesterday it's been hiding under some fallen leaves I have in the middle part of the cage at the edge of where the heat mat is. I think that covers everything. Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks,
Chrissy

[Thamnophis]

Chrissy, does it look like this snake? Do you have a picture?

http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/herpetology/FL-GUIDE/sdvicta02.jpg

[garter newbie]

Yeah, it looks pretty much like that except it doesn't really have the black markings on it's head. I just took a picture if it - let me see if I can get the image posted.

Chrissy

[Thamnophis]

If you don't succes in posting the picture, you can mail it to me. Than I will put it online and post it here.

[abcat1993]

I am no expert but what you have should be good. You might have to wait awhile before it will eat, and probably longer to be able to see it eat. Just give it some time to get used to it's environment and recover from hibertation (assuming it was starting to go into it).
Also, is ~ 67% humidity right? my tank is at anywere from 35-60%.
And what type of garter is that you posted?

[garter newbie]

That's the picture of it there as my avatar. Is that good enough?

[Cazador]

It's really tough to see detail in the avatar since the file size is so small.

[garter newbie]

It's really tough to see detail in the avatar since the file size is so small.

I figured that much. Can someone advise me on how to insert a picture from my computer? When I click on the "insert image" icon above it asks me to enter the URL of the image:confused: .

[ssssnakeluvr]

you want no humidity in the cage if its a garter....garters have problems with humidity. It's hard to see the pic there...

[abcat1993]

I thought they had problems with high humidity, not lowish humidity

[Cazador]

Hey Matt,
I think what ssssnakeluvr is saying is that you don't want obvious moisture in your substrate. Don't worry about the atmospheric humidity (relative humidity; RH) unless it gets too high or too low. If the RH is too high, it can lead to blister disease, fungal growth, and bacterial blooms. If it is too low, it can cause shedding problems.

As I recall, you have an Eastern garter, so about 55-60% RH is probably about the upper end that you want to have. There isn't a whole lot you can do, other than get a smaller water bowl or move your water bowl from underneath the heat light (or off of your heat pad). You can also replace moisture-absorbant substrate (shredded aspen) with less absorbant substrate (bark, paper towels). To increase the RH, you can either mist your substrate, get a larger water bowl, or move your water bowl under/over your heat source. Any other tips for Matt?
Rick

P.S. Other species/subspecies, like the Florida blues, can tolerate higher humidity, but those from more arid regions need even less.

[Cazador]

Can someone advise me on how to insert a picture from my computer? :confused: .

Hi Chrissy,
The link, below, will help you post pictures into your thread.

http://www.thamnophis.com/site-feedback-suggestions-questions/181-posting-pictures.html#post1244

[garter newbie]

Cazador - Thanks for the instructions on picture posting.

Here's the picture of my garter:

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/images/overlay-round.gif (http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/showphoto.php?photo=200&cat=500&ppuser=114)

Chrissy

[garter newbie]

I followed the directions exactly but not sure why the picture is not displaying properly in my post. However when you click on the blank square an enlarged picture does come up. Hopefully now someone can identify what type and the approximate age.

On the subject of humidity - I repositioned the gauge low in the cage and am getting a reading of 64 now. But according to Matt and Rick's comments, this is still too high, correct? I am currently using the aspen bedding so I guess I should switch to the wood chips or newspaper. Couple questions about these substrates -(1) Should I just use sheets of newspaper or shred it? (2) Can the bark chips be the kind you use in your garden for weed control (as long as it's not cedar) or does it have to be the kind specifically made for animal bedding (purchased at the pet store)? Sorry if I'm asking a lot of questions but I am a total novice on the topic of snakes.

[ssssnakeluvr]

That's a brown snake, not a garter..they are a little trickier to keep, big eaters of worms.

[ssssnakeluvr]

aspen beeding should be ok for that snake. You might want to put the worms on a small plate or lid so the snake doesn't get them in the bedding and ingest itl I don't know if brown snakes are as susceptible to humidity and skin problems.

[sschind]

Looks to me like you have a Brown snake or Dekay's snake Storeria dekayi. If so, he most likely will not eat minnows or pinkies, at least mine never did. I never kept these guys long term because I found it difficult to provide the proper food for them. They like earthworms and slugs and I have noticed that the one I have now will eat the rolly polly bugs on occasion. Setup can be like a garter but they seem to be even more secretive. They will eat readily in captivity if you can find the proper food. Leaf worms are not appropriate (see other threads regarding worms on this site) and earthworms can be difficult to find in winter. At least here in Wisconsin. We've had a few unseasonably warm days now so this afternoon I am going out log turning to see what I can find. If I can get enough to fatten it up I will probably cool it this winter with the rest of my breeders.

Good luck with it.

Steve

[Cazador]

Just seeing if I have the same problem that you did posting your picture.

http://www.thamnophis.com/thamphotos/data//500/medium/garter1.JPG

Strange. You loaded it correctly, so then it's just a matter of pulling your picture up; clicking "copy to clipboard"; and pasting the link wherever you want it. Should have worked. Make sure you don't have the icon of your picture (at the top of the screen) highlighted when you click "Copy to clipboard." Wanna give it another shot?

[Thamnophis]

That's why I posted that picture in the beginning of this topic.
From the description I figured it had to be a Storeria dekayi.

[Cazador]

Nice job Steve & Fons (Don & others). Your ability to recognize the many morphs of each subspecies is remarkable, but to identify similar snakes from another genus is amazing!

[Thamnophis]

Chrissy wrote: It is grayish brown with black diamond spots.
So I thought: that's probably no Thamnophis.
Then I looked at the snakes that live in her neighbourhood.
The conclusion was it could be a Storeria dekayi.

(Fourty years reptile-experience helps too :rolleyes: )

[garter newbie]

So I have a brown/dekay snake not a garter. See I told you I know nothing about snakes. Thank you everyone for all your help. This site really has a great group of members - you are very knowledgable and quick to respond to all my questions. I would highly recommend this forum to everyone from the novice like myself to long-time garter enthusiasts. I guess now I'll have to try to find a brown/dekay snake forum to join:D . I think we are going to keep it. I was able to find some basic info about the snake and a care sheet for keeping them online. It doen't seem like it will be too difficult. A lot of the setup is the same as for garters. Thanks again.

Chrissy

[sschind]

They are fairly easy to keep if you can find suitable food for them. Like I said, search this forum for threads pertaining to worms and feeding. I'm going of memeory but it seems to me that most of the worms (red wiggler, leaf worms) that you find in bait shops are unsuitable for snakes. Also, with a worm diet you are probably going to want to supplement with calcium a bit. Just dip one end of the worm in come calcium powder and they shouldn't have a problem.

Good Luck