Sexing help? (Didn't want to post in someone elses thread)

[rattus knits]

So i just got these two from a friend of mine, they are common garters (are common garters also called eastern garters or no?) and she never really cared to know the gender but i may breed if they seem like they would be good for it (good temperament, easy to keep fed etc) which is bassically what i'm figuring out right now. I tried learning how to pop them but i don't want to hurt them and videos don't really help much so instead to pictures it is!

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The one on the left is my smaller garter, i don't think they are the same age so i couldn't even make a guess based on size (my friend gave me very little info about them and the place she got them from didn't give her much either<or she didn't ask)
The picture on the right has both, the left snake in that picture is my larger snake.

The larger is probably about 2 feet and the smaller it about half the girth and about 1 foot or so

Thanks for any help and tips!

Oh and right now they eat toads but i don't like the idea of feeding them something that is filled with parasites and who knows what else, haven't tried fish yet but i breed mice for snake food so i want to try and switch them, any ideas? Plan to try scenting the mice with toads today or tomorrow, anything else i could do?

[guidofatherof5]

I would say the larger snake is female and the smaller is male. The only one I question is the smaller one as a better under tail photo is needed. I can't really say which species they are from your photos.
You are correct about the toads. I would also caution you about feeding mice(fur bearing) Pinkies are safer in my opinion as they don't have fur which can cause impaction.
Here is a link to the care sheet which will give you much information. Why not feed some night crawlers?
Be sure to introduce yourself in the "Welcome Lounge" so we can give you a proper hello.
Welcome Lounge (http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/welcome-lounge/)

Garter Snake Forum - Garter Caresheet (http://www.thamnophis.com/index.php?page=caresheet)

[rattus knits]

I would say the larger snake is female and the smaller is male. The only one I question is the smaller one as a better under tail photo is needed. I can't really say which species they are from your photos.
You are correct about the toads. I would also caution you about feeding mice(fur bearing) Pinkies are safer in my opinion as they don't have fur which can cause impaction.
Here is a link to the care sheet which will give you much information. Why not feed some night crawlers?
Be sure to introduce yourself in the "Welcome Lounge" so we can give you a proper hello.


How can you tell? My friend just brought down her other 4 (she's going to let me pick which ones i want^^) and we've "confirmed" one female (i'll take a pic but she's large, very thick with a short kind of "stumpy" looking tail, so female right?) and then two little ones, about 6-7 inches, and then the last is the size of the larger one before. I think i'm going to take pictures of all of them tomorrow full body and then underside for help, but i am trying to figure it out on my own haha

[rattus knits]

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so 1 is the one that we are pretty sure is a female, the very tip of her tail looks like its gone but it doesn't seem like her tail was much longer than that.

I think 2 is a male <guessing (his vent is right by my fingers in that picture if you can't really see it)

[rattus knits]

10885108861088710888

the two middle pictures are two of the snakes, the left is number 5 and the right is number 1, are these common garters? (if you can tell, pictures aren't great)

[guidofatherof5]

Take a look at this thread it will help you learn how to visually sex your snakes. It will also give you a good idea of what photos to post.
Popping not done correctly can injure the snake and if not done correctly gives you a false result identify a male as female.
http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/breeding/5069-sexing-pics.html

[rattus knits]

i looked there first and still don't get it><" i mean i understand that the males tail stays the same girth for about and inch (well obviously that varies for size but as my way of explaining) bellow the vent, where as a female's continues to taper right after the vent, but when i actually go to do it i'm just like that looks like it tapers.... but then again how much is tapering.... how long should it not taper.... ><""""""
^i'm definitely a "shower me a million times and re-explain before i can trust myself" type of person.... i also tried to figure out which was which in the pics on that forum before looking at the answer and failed miserably.....
As for the pictures this is all they would stay still enough for, they are not tame in the least (then again i wouldn't be either after a 3 hours car ride and then people touching me and moving me between tanks)

[guidofatherof5]

I would suggest studying that sexing page. It take time to learn all the nuisances in sexing these snakes.
I've learned over years that the more I stare at a photo the more I second guess myself.

Relax, you'll get it.

[rattus knits]

so i guessed based on the sexing page (i only need to know since my friend is going back home in a couple days so i need to figure out who i'm keeping.
1 is female
2 i think is a male but i'm not sure (i feel comfortable saying whose female since the taper seems obvious but with the males i can't tell when there isn't any)
3 is female
4 i think is male
5 i think is female (she's wicked little though so not sure but i don't think i'll be keeping her regardless)
and 6 i have no idea, but again probably not keeping since it's pretty small and i dont think i'm ready for little baby snake challenges just yet hahaha

Any ideas on these? As far as agree or disagree? 1 and 3 the taper is wicked obvious, whereas 2 and 4 i can't really say that i see any,

[guidofatherof5]

I know it's a lot of work but I think we all would be much more confident with our observations if the tails were orientated north and south(tail hanging).
Some males can be tricky and hard to sex until they are more mature.