Garter suddenly won't eat

[tvance]

Hi there,

I have 2 garter snakes which were found in the wild. They were caught in May or so.

They are currently in a 20 gallon terrarium with aspen substrate, heating pad, water dish, fake plants, cave, etc.
They have been eating pinkies for months, but now one of them suddenly stopped eating.

The one snake is still eating fine, but the other hasn't eaten for about 3 weeks or so. I've tried cutting the pinkies up, feeder fish, and earthworms, but he won't eat anything.

I don't know what else to do! If anyone has any advice please let me know.

[chris-uk]

I'm sure you've already read this, but...

Two weeks really is nothing. This time of year most garters will go off food to some degree.
For example, my male radix (3-4 years old) went off food around this time last year and I didn't worry, he started eating again in Feb or March. He will often stop eating for a couple of months at a time, for instance he stopped eating between the 18 Aug and 28 Oct this year.



And an extra comment...
You say they were wild-caught, are they this year's young or older snakes? Not that it makes much difference garters of any age will go off food at this time of year, it's just an older wild-caught snake will have been through brumation at least once before so the habit will more deeply ingrained. What species are they? Some species you can expect not to eat until the Spring, others might start eating again sooner.

[tvance]

Thank you for your reply Chris!

I have no idea how old the snakes are, although the one that isn't eating is quite a bit smaller than the other.

I don't know what species they are either, but apparently there are 3 different species in Ontario- T. sirtalis, T. sauritus, and T. butleri.
I'm not sure how to tell the difference, but I have some pictures of them.
The one on the left is the one that's not eating.
99279928

[tvance]

I have a question for you: when your garters stop eating, do you take steps to make sure they go through brumation? Or do you continue as normal until they start eating again? If I don't make sure my snake brumates, will he starve?

[chris-uk]

Last year I didn't brumate any of mine. I turned off the heat for the ones that refused for longer and lengthened the gap between offering food.
They won't starve. Garters can go months without eating even at normal temps.

[tvance]

Thanks, I really appreciate your help!

[indigoman]

T.s. sirtalis first one looks male, can't say on second pic.

[raoul76650]

Hi all

I have a sirtalis albinos (adult sized) who doesnt eat too ! I bought her (its a female) 2 weeks ago. She lives in a big terrarium, but she doesnt eat trout, or others fishes i gave to her...I gave live guppies, dead fresh fishes : no success ! Is she sick ? Is it normal ?

I dont speak engish so well, so could you explain me what you call "brumation" ?

Thanks for your answers

Laurent (FRANCE)

[EKS56]

It certainly isn't what you like to see. I had a male Blackneck that went four months without eating. I was sick, I just knew he was fixing to die. He turned out to be fine. I think what I'm trying to say is don't let it get you down.

[guidofatherof5]

Hi all

I have a sirtalis albinos (adult sized) who doesnt eat too ! I bought her (its a female) 2 weeks ago. She lives in a big terrarium, but she doesnt eat trout, or others fishes i gave to her...I gave live guppies, dead fresh fishes : no success ! Is she sick ? Is it normal ?

I dont speak engish so well, so could you explain me what you call "brumation" ?

Thanks for your answers

Laurent (FRANCE)

Two weeks isn't a very long time. Some snakes take longer then others to settle in. Have you offered any worms?
What in of heat source are you providing? Overall just give use an idea about your setup, please.
Brumation is a time of lower temps and no food. A time of reduced activity. Water is supplied. Here's what the care sheet has to say and a link to the entire care sheet.
Garter Snake Forum - Garter Caresheet (http://www.thamnophis.com/index.php?page=caresheet)

Brumation

Sometimes brumation (hibernation) is necessary to make snakes breed, also needed around winter some snakes will automatically go off feed because their internal clock says its time to brumate

Steps of Brumation
1.) Stop feeding for 2-3 weeks if this is not done the food still inside them will ferment. While doing this increase the number of hours of darkness and decrease the number of light hours, for example instead of giving them 12 hours of light and 12 hours of darkness give them 10 hours of light and 14 hours of darkness work this down until they are in darkness completely, after this i take them put them in a brown trash bag or container of sorts and put it in a pitch black place, i then clean out their brumation enclosure. I let mine sit in their clean brumation enclosures with pitch darkness for 2 days just to get them settled. And don't worry to much about slowly changing the light/darkness if you just drop it to dark it wont kill them it just wont be as natural.
2.) Put them in their clean brumation enclosure and drop the temperature down to around 60-65f for a week.
3.) Drop them down to their final brumation temperature i keep mine at 40-45f it is okay to keep them anywhere from 40-55f just make sure the temperature does not vary a lot i prefer keeping mine at a lower temperature because they do not lose as much weight, a natural brumation time would be 3 months this is what i recommend if you are trying to breed your snakes though many breeders have had success with only 2 months, also if you are just brumating to make your snake eat again i would suggest 2 months. You should brumate according to when they are going to wake up (if you can) they should wake up sometime around jan/feb/march. And remember to change their water and check on them every week but do not hold them.
4.) At the end of brumation to bring them back you do steps 1,2,3 again backwards, also when breeding it is suggested that you bring back up the male first because if you dont he might just be interested in the female and not want to eat. The male will usually follow the female everywhere and try to mate with her and if he doesnt he most likely will after the female sheds (which they always do after brumation)

Some Notes:
- Make sure they are not skinny and in good health. (there are exceptions such as ones that wont eat)
- I would not recommend brumating anything smaller than 16 inches for the purpose of breeding because they are more likely to die.
- Brumating is a natural part of a snakes life and some people feel that you should do it even if you are not breeding or it does not go off food.

[raoul76650]

Thanks for that answer Guidofatherof ! My terrarium has a warm area at 27°C, and a cold area at 21°C. The biggest place where the snake can hide is under the hot point...Do i have to organise another place to hide in colder one ? The light is "on" 12 hours a day, and for the moment, i dont want to brumate...She has a big water "swimming-pool". Water is changed every day. For the moment i didtn try to give worms, only fresh fish... Do you feed with natural earth worms, or "morio" (also called "flour worms") that we can buy in animals shop ?

[guidofatherof5]

Natural earthworms. What species is natural to your part of the world? No flour worms.
Once you get your snake eating it would be best to feed a varied diet. Each food has something different to offer.
Having a cool hide lets them feel secure while thermogregulating.

[tvance]

Good news! My garter has started eating again! Have to cut the pinkies into pieces, but that's okay!

Also, Indigoman, would a different type of picture help for identification? Like a whole body shot?
What sort of things do you look for in identifying species and male/female?

[guidofatherof5]

Here' a link to the forum sexing thread. It can show you what to look for or show you what kind of photos to post.

http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/breeding/5069-sexing-pics.html

[zendragondrew]

Hey guys, haven't been here in a while, mostly because Matt hasn't had any problems. I'm having a similar issue I had last year and similar to this poster, but this time it's been about two months since he has eaten anything. He won't eat any mice or fish, I'm just worried, I don't know how long he can go without eating. He's still moving fine, but two months seems like a very long time to go without food. I put a thawed pinkie in there today and he put his nose on it for a second, and pushed into it, but didn't eat it, then he went to another part of the tank.

Chris is saying it's OK for a healthy garter to go four months without eating? Should I just keep waiting?

[zendragondrew]

Update: Now he pooped right after I took the pinkie out. How do you poop when you haven't eaten in two months? This is probably around his fourth or fifth poop since he stopped eating.

[guidofatherof5]

Sure, still using fuel and creating waste.

[slipknot711]

if he went to the bathroom i wouldnt worry so much then. just keep trying, fish seems to be cheaper if you dont wanna keep wasting mice. maybe just try some worms too? im still a newbie to garters so you dont need to listen to me lol

[tvance]

Hey guys, haven't been here in a while, mostly because Matt hasn't had any problems. I'm having a similar issue I had last year and similar to this poster, but this time it's been about two months since he has eaten anything. He won't eat any mice or fish, I'm just worried, I don't know how long he can go without eating. He's still moving fine, but two months seems like a very long time to go without food. I put a thawed pinkie in there today and he put his nose on it for a second, and pushed into it, but didn't eat it, then he went to another part of the tank.

Chris is saying it's OK for a healthy garter to go four months without eating? Should I just keep waiting?

Mine started eating after a few months. I would wait and try not to stress :)
Now he's a super hungry guy, lunging for the pinkies as soon as they get near him.

[ConcinusMan]

Update: Now he pooped right after I took the pinkie out. How do you poop when you haven't eaten in two months? This is probably around his fourth or fifth poop since he stopped eating.

Not everything that comes out is poop. Even if they haven't eaten they still expel urates.

[zendragondrew]

Thanks guys. Hopefully he eats soon, maybe when the weather gets a little better. Usually he'll eat anything I put in his cage, but he did this for around a month last year so I guess he's just bad about eating in the winter.