Baby Rescue Turtle with Crushed Shell

[d_virginiana]

My husband and I got a call from his friend today that they found a baby eastern box turtle (same species as Turtle) with a broken shell, so we spent the day driving to go pick it up and see what we could do. The little guy still has a lot of growing to do, so if we get past the infection, mending the shell is going to be a long ordeal...

The wound had maggots in it, and was filled with dirt. He also has an eye infection (which should be easy to deal with. I still have antibiotics from when Turtle had her eye infection, and his isn't that bad yet). So, we started out by rinsing the shell wound with diluted hydrogen peroxide. I know it can be intense, but it was necessary for this case. Afterward, we flushed it alternately with water and diluted hibiclens several times to get as much grit as possible out. Lastly, I wicked out as much moisture as I could, and treated it with neosporin. It's loosely covered in surgical gauze (with the gentle surgical tape attaching it to his shell) to keep debris from falling in it.
He's beside my python's tank right now, to keep his temps in the mid 80's, and has plain newspaper substrate with no water. He'll be soaked twice a day, but every medical text I could find said not to give turtles with shell injuries free access to water.

I sent an e-mail to the reptile rescue that I adopted my White's tree frog from to see if there were any options there for him. They've had several intense, long-term medical cases that are posted on their website. I offered to foster him and do all the basic care, but this guy will almost certainly need a vet to pop that shell into place, and we can't afford that for a wild rescue. The vets around that do take rescue wildlife will only keep them if someone acts as a financial sponsor, so the rescue is the best chance for that.

He's alert and eating; killed a small worm earlier. A little weak, but no paralysis. He's also very curious and investigates anything new you put in front of him. A full recovery is a long-shot at this point, but you can tell he's still got a lot of fight in him.

Here he is... Well, seems more like a she, but still. We're calling her Derpy.
9372

[jwolfe152]

oh wow thats a bad spot i hope it heals underneath real well so they can use the fiberglass and i think steel mesh to make the shell again :confused: if they can do it from what i hear it also has to be replaced every ten years or so. have you thought about after it heals maybe talk to someone at the rescue maybe they could point you to someone will to do it cheap or maybe telling you how to do it. it seems unlikely they would tell or show you but it could be worth a shot if ya wanna keep her. oh and other than then shell she is a beautiful little girl.

oh and i will look for the link but using peroxide over an extended period of time may do more harm than good, because it kills off a lot of good stuff that starts the healing process in the skin just a heads up but a few days to help keep maggots out should be ok

[jwolfe152]

We are discontinuing the peroxide applications as of today and will not resume unless the maggots reappear. As I mentioned earlier the foaming has ceased and from now on out we will stick to the Neosporin. Here is a link to an article that backs up what "JWolfe" posted. I certainly think the peroxide had it's place. I could tell the maggots really didn't like it and vacated immediately.

Claim that hydrogen peroxide aids healing fizzles out | The San Diego Union-Tribune (http://www.utsandiego.com/uniontrib/20070717/news_lz1c17fact.html)

here is part of the thread

[d_virginiana]

I'm hoping the rescue will actually be able to afford the vet care for him.

I know about the hydrogen peroxide. Thing is, it's more intense than hibiclens or betadine. You can't really tell from the picture, but there was mud and gunk just caked up in there. The peroxide was the only thing that actually loosened any of it so I could flush the place with hibiclens and water.
With bad injuries, my strategy is generally to 'nuke' the injury once with peroxide, then clean with the milder stuff from then on out.

[guidofatherof5]

Thanks for taking the time to help. Any idea how the injury happened?

[jwolfe152]

oh yea i didnt mean to not use it period. i would use the peroxide for a few days because it debrides the wound of dirt,dead tissue, and a lot of germs, its just not something to use for more than a few days IMO. i don't think i would have tried anything but peroxide to get the mud out, you don't wanna go poking or digging at it and potentially making it worse.

i too hope that the rescue can pay for it. i guarantee its expensive for the wire mesh and fiberglass and not to mention whatever the vet gets for actually applying it. then there is the costs of keeping, medicating, and any other test they might wish to do.

[d_virginiana]

I'm thinking that they'll want to use the surgical wire for awhile since he's still growing and that's easier to replace. I want to watch them do it in case there's ever a time when that's not an option.
I've got my fingers crossed that I'll hear back from the rescue soon.


Thanks for taking the time to help. Any idea how the injury happened?

Not a clue. They just saw him walking through their yard, took him in, and called me. This is the third 'What do I do with this turtle' call I've gotten in a couple weeks, but the only one that needed extra attention.

[jwolfe152]

well at least you know other people care enough to at least call and ask someone who knows instead of looking at it and saying ahhh poor turtle, then just walking away. i cant imagine it would be that hard to apply the screen material or fiberglass, the thing to watch for is a wet sore that could fester underneath any material.

[d_virginiana]

well at least you know other people care enough to at least call and ask someone who knows instead of looking at it and saying ahhh poor turtle, then just walking away. i cant imagine it would be that hard to apply the screen material or fiberglass, the thing to watch for is a wet sore that could fester underneath any material.

One segment of the shell has been pushed below the rest though... And it's now being held out of place by the other segments. It'll have to be popped back into place before the shell could begin to heal. I've watched tons of videos on the subject, but I wouldn't want to do that if there's any chance I can get a vet to do it. Plus, I got the majority of bone fragments out, but there's at least one still stuck in there. Hoping it'll come out as the dead skin begins to slough off though...
I cried when I had to trim Turtle's toenails earlier in the week and I accidentally made one bleed. She didn't even notice lol. I'm not generally squeamish at all, but I really hate to be the one causing an animal pain. I'd definitely feel a lot better about any future 'rescue' procedures I have to do if I could get a walkthrough by a vet.

[d_virginiana]

When I cleaned it out this morning, a fair bit of grit and dead skin washed out. Part of the wound has a pink look instead of the 'zombie' flesh look it had last night as well. I'm taking that as a good sign.


The bad news is that he almost definitely has some nerve damage in one of his back legs that I didn't notice at first. He can still move it, and scoot around a little bit, but it's clear now that he can't control it correctly. Doesn't look severe enough to be a long-term mobility issue, but that has me worried about when his shell has to be popped back into place, since that means the initial injury definitely affected the spinal cord.

[EKS56]

:(

[Eddie]

I think it is awesome that you are taking the time to care for him. Next to garter snakes eastern boxies are my favorite herp!

[d_virginiana]

He ate a blueberry tonight and scooted around a little in the water when I let him get a drink.

[d_virginiana]

I found out last night that the vet school nearby has a turtle rescue program that provides surgeries and whatnot to sick/injured wildlife. I haven't e-mailed them yet, because I'm worried that he would just be put down immediately. Mainly because they are centered toward releasing them to the wild, and this one will never be able to be released. The extent of his nerve damage is becoming clearer, and he can't walk. He can scoot maybe an inch without assistance, but that's about it. Additionally, shell injuries in young turtles require years of supervision to heal. I am quite sure that a typical vet recommendation would be to put him down, and once handed over to that program he would be completely out of my control.
Any opinions on this? I'm still waiting to hear back from the other rescue...

I am aware that he may have to be put down, but when he doesn't seem to be in pain, and he's so alert and interested in everything around him I'm not going to do it. You can tell he still has the will to live. He can still move all four legs, and I think there is great possibility for improvement or maybe mobility with some sort of wheeled prosthesis.

The good news is that the majority of the wound is pink today, and more pieces of badly injured shell have flaked off. Most of the dead tissue seems to be gone, and he enjoyed a morning session of drinking and pawing at the water. The eye is clearing up nicely as well.

[guidofatherof5]

Tell them about your concerns.

[d_virginiana]

Got a response from the Reptile Rescue, and am sending a message to the Turtle Rescue team (apparently they work together). Regardless, he should be somewhere that he can get that surgery by the end of the week. I'll just have to make it clear that I'd be willing to take him on long-term and do whatever basic therapy and care would be needed.

[jwolfe152]

thats fantastic news hopefully they will let you keep him afterwards and not insist that he stays in the rescue

[d_virginiana]

It doesn't really matter if he stays with me, the rescue, or ends up in some sort of educational program somewhere as long as he gets the treatment. I'm invested in him, and I want to know what happens, but I volunteered mainly because I've got an idea of how long the rehab process is going to be, and I'm not sure if there'd be a line of people wanting to foster a special needs turtle...

Apparently the reptile rescue is looking for someone to fill one of the positions there. After I get the turtle taken care of I may see if that's something I'd have time for.

[jwolfe152]

yea i have looked at a few sites that you can search your area to see what shelters/rescues have what animals and i have seen a few shelters/rescues with special needs turtles most of them have half or more of the shell missing its sad to think they get turtles (or any other animal for that matter) that need medical attention and get all fixed up then further down the road when nobody will adopt them, they put them down.

i really wish more people knew about and adopted animals from shelters instead of going to pet stores and getting something for a lot more money that is filling up the centers. hell on the sites i was talking about i have seen so many juvenile pythons and corn snakes and if there is a fee for them its still cheaper than a pet store. same thing with ferrets and im sure that sugar gliders (i love them) will start showing up more and more

[d_virginiana]

I'm really hoping I can get involved with the reptile rescue near me in some way. It'll give me a go-to since I've apparently become the person people call for reptile rehab or removal (seriously, I've gotten like five calls in the past month. Luckily most of them were watch overnight then release cases). I imagine most people who see a sick or injured reptile either kill or ignore it. I know a lot of people who wouldn't even consider going to a vet for their pet reptiles, which just baffles me.

[jwolfe152]

well even if you don't have much time, maybe you could keep animals overnight for whatever reason, or be a foster owner for a week or however long you wished, or maybe just cleaning supplies or food. i know the shelters here appreciate any help someone wants to give even if its not time at the shelter and either supplies, food, or cash to pay for other things. i really wish i could help at the shelter close to the house but im pretty much full time taking care of someone and don't get much (not that i need anything considering who it is) out of it.

[d_virginiana]

Derpy went to the Turtle Rescue today. I asked, and they said I can call and ask for updates on him. I volunteered to do therapy and rehab for him once he can be released from the hospital. Since he's got some nerve damage, I also said I'd be willing to provide a permanent home if he can't be released into the wild.

I'll post updates as I get them.

[guidofatherof5]

Derpy went to the Turtle Rescue today. I asked, and they said I can call and ask for updates on him. I volunteered to do therapy and rehab for him once he can be released from the hospital. Since he's got some nerve damage, I also said I'd be willing to provide a permanent home if he can't be released into the wild.

I'll post updates as I get them.

Prayers going out to Derby.

[jwolfe152]

wow that good that got her in this quick hopefully they will let you do the therapy and for her

[d_virginiana]

wow that good that got her in this quick hopefully they will let you do the therapy and for her

I have experience with rehabbing eastern box turtles, as well as a lot of general experience with 'special needs' reptiles like my blind garter and the pacman with neurological issues. I let them know about that, as well as the progress he's made in just a few days (like most of the necrotic tissue sloughing and being replaced by healthier pink tissue) and they said I could definitely rehab him once he's stable enough.

They were also very happy to hear that I'd be willing to be a permanent home, especially after seeing the nerve damage.

[jwolfe152]

thats great news i hope he gets his surgery soon and gets through it with no problems

[d_virginiana]

I got a call from the rescue yesterday saying he was ready to be released! I guess fixing his shell allowed the nerve damage to repair itself. We're picking him up on Monday and driving him back to his home territory next weekend :)

[guidofatherof5]

Very cool. Glad the little guy got some help. Thanks for caring.

[mikem]

That's great news! Glad you were able to get him help! :)

[gibble888]

Good for you!

[d_virginiana]

Well, interesting pickup for Derpy today... He's doing much better, and the shell injury has been filled up with thick skin which is normal during healing. I'll put pictures up later.

He drank some water and is very alert. One thing that worries me, is that when we offered him a blueberry after getting home (mostly to see what he would do) he did the normal turtle "I am Not Amused" gesture of turning around, but his left front and back legs were very odd, and the whole 'turning around' process took about three minutes, even though he was trying hard the whole time. The front leg kept not hitting the ground when he moved it, and when it did, it was almost like he was walking on the back of his foot. The back left leg just ended up stretched out and dragged behind him...

He does have full mobility of all the legs, but if this keeps happening between now and this weekend (release time) I'm going to video it and contact the rescue again...

[EKS56]

:confused:

[guidofatherof5]

Could be neurological repairs under way. Maybe his brain is rewiring to compensate for the injury. Just a thought.

[d_virginiana]

Could be neurological repairs under way. Maybe his brain is rewiring to compensate for the injury. Just a thought.

Definitely a possibility... Thing is, they said he was releasable. But I just feel like something is still wrong; it took him about three minutes of constant effort to turn 180 degrees. Then this morning I was letting him soak in chin-height water and he stuck his head under to drink, but then started shaking and holding his mouth wide open under the water. I took him out, and he calmed down after a few minutes, but it was just bizarre...

[guidofatherof5]

A little Lora recovery/TLC time might be needed.

[d_virginiana]

Good news and bad news for the baby turtle... The puffiness around his head and legs has gone way down, and his swollen eye is at least cracked open most of the time now. On the other hand, he's started spitting up water, and I believe he may have aspirated some. I'm not yet sure whether spitting up the water was due to some sort of internal issue, or just going overboard (unless they were soaking him instead of leaving him to get his own, I'm not sure how much water he was drinking there).
But regardless, now I'm cleaning off gunk from his mouth and nose regularly. If I do that while annoying him enough to move around, it seems to clear up his system for awhile. I'm debating whether or not I should send a message to the Rescue, because there is no way this turtle should be released right now...

[guidofatherof5]

I would send a message and see what they think. If it's nothing then no harm done.

[d_virginiana]

I think I figured out why he hasn't been eating: Yesterday he ate a nightcrawler chunk and promptly vomited it back up, but then vomited up a HUGE chunk of mucous. It had to be the size of his whole stomach! Afterward he managed to keep down a tiny piece of worm. He hasn't been heaving for breath every little bit since that either; I believe it was putting pressure on his lungs. Then, this morning he had peed for the first time since I picked him up. The edema that had surrounded his legs and neck up till this point (which the rescue told me was 'puffing up from being angry') was completely gone.

Hopefully this will be a turning point. He's still acting sickly and spitting up a small amount of mucous every now and then, but not near what he was. Hopefully without that giant chunk blocking his system, he'll start improving.

[Mommy2many]

Fingers crossed for him!