Enclosure Don'ts

[guidofatherof5]

I thought a thread about enclosure "don'ts" might be wise, to save some people the hassle of finding out for themselves that somethings don't work.
I'll get things started:

When using fake vines be sure to keep them a minimum for 4 inches/ 11 cm off the bottom of the enclosure. Otherwise, they will use the vine and leaves toilet paper. There will be skid marks all over the place :D Cleaning poop off these vines is a pain. Don't ask how I know:D

[chris-uk]

When you're using an ExoTerra viv, don't think the gaps around the background are tight enough that a garter can't get behind the background.

[guidofatherof5]

When you're using an ExoTerra viv, don't think the gaps around the background are tight enough that a garter can't get behind the background.

That goes for any enclosure or container. When I built mine I had to stuff foam insulation in any possible gap or crevice.

[KephrenJorgensen]

That goes for any enclosure or container. When I built mine I had to stuff foam insulation in any possible gap or crevice.

Marine silicone works great for that too.

Something that I've had to frequently stress to new reptile keepers in my area is NOT keeping a snake, or anything, in an enclosure that is obviously too small for the creature. A friend of mine was keeping a full grown bearded dragon in a 10 gallon -.- I couldn't look at her in there so I gave him my old dresser-made-beardie-home. The lizard cost at least 4x more than the 10g, never mind it being longer than the tank.

Many people probably have different opinions or rules for this subject. For garters, I use length as a guide. I like to give atleast a foot of length more to the enclosure than the snake when possible. I more often than not have to compensate with width or height, usually width. If you can give a square floor, ie/ 2'x2', the snakes aren't confined to the option of one way and back again. My puget's are a huge fan of flying across their enclosure in random directions. When they were in a tank with a floor length 3 times the width, they were constantly smacking their heads off the walls trying to go forward or backwards instead of left or right. Using tanks that are impractically long compared to the width may not be a Don't, but it definitely keeps you watching your snakes be themselves more often if you equalize the length x width of the floor. I find my snakes are more energetic and interactive with me and each other if they have a larger horizontal distance to cross. Issues like space and finance obviously play a factor in this as well.

[infernalis]

Number one "enclosure don't".......

Never turn your back while open. ;)

Entirely too many escape stories all over the internet.

[guidofatherof5]

This recommendation is more of a enclosure maintenance item and I'm sure Wayne will substantiate its importance.

"NEVER LEAVE SHEDS IN THE ENCLOSURE"

[d_virginiana]

Just wondering, is there something particularly harmful about sheds being left in the enclosure? Or is it just the common sense reason for removing them?

[guidofatherof5]

Just wondering, is there something particularly harmful about sheds being left in the enclosure? Or is it just the common sense reason for removing them?

Wayne had a snake crawl back into a shed and it died.

[gibble888]

Number one "enclosure don't".......

Never turn your back while open. ;)

Entirely too many escape stories all over the internet.

+2 ..i customized my lid so it cant open the whole way wich makes it close automatically and also added weight to the lid so just in case i forgot to latch it the weight makes it harder/impossible to open. It might be a little harder to work in the cage but after losing a garter for a couple days its a good peace of mind.

[chris-uk]

Just wondering, is there something particularly harmful about sheds being left in the enclosure? Or is it just the common sense reason for removing them?

And how can you check that the shed is complete if you don't remove it? No point taking it out and putting it back again.

[Foxrun402]

Don't use anything sticky inside the tank... Tape.. Double-sided foam tape.. Anything they could get stuck to is bad, and anything that could adhere itself to them is also bad. For the thermometers/hygrometers I do not stick them to the glass anymore! I read to many bad things and worried myself to the point of just burying them flush into the substrate... Plus it gives you a more accurate reading of the floor temp.

[chris-uk]

If you need to stick anything to a tank use hot glue, a hot glue gun isn't expensive and comes in surprisingly useful.

I also use Blue Tac to fill in little gaps in one of my vivs around the hole that thermometer cables go in through, without the extra precaution the hole is large enough that a small scrub could get out.

[infernalis]

This recommendation is more of a enclosure maintenance item and I'm sure Wayne will substantiate its importance.

"NEVER LEAVE SHEDS IN THE ENCLOSURE"

I will pull the photo when I can, but I had a snake attempt to use it's own shed as a hide, crawled back into it's sloughed skin backward, became stuck and suffocated. I found this mess early one morning.

[infernalis]

Notice the snake's head is crammed into the tail of the shed, proving the snake completed shedding, then crawled back inside the skin in reverse prior to passing away. Pity too, it was a nice caramel coloured albino radix.

http://www.varanus.us/dont/deadradix.jpg

[gibble888]

That is soooo odd! Sorry for your loss.

[guidofatherof5]

Don't set plastic or glass enclosures in direct sunlight. The temps in side can become critical and kill your snakes. This can happen in a matter of a few minutes.
This is a serious situation.

[ConcinusMan]

Do not drill or punch ventilation holes if you're using plastic tubs for enclosures. And this applies to shipping containers too. Use a hot metal rot to melt the holes from the inside out and always remove any jagged/sharp spurs left behind. Make sure the holes are small enough that the snake can't stick his snout in it. Run your hand across the holes. You shouldn't get scratched or poked. Should feel smooth.

Let me show you what happened recently when someone drilled the holes and ignored the sharp edges and spurs left behind. Nothing like waking up to a hole in the head to start the week. Ouch!

http://i43.tinypic.com/wjtfdf.jpg

[chris-uk]

When using fake vines be sure to keep them a minimum for 4 inches/ 11 cm off the bottom of the enclosure. Otherwise, they will use the vine and leaves toilet paper. There will be skid marks all over the place :D Cleaning poop off these vines is a pain. Don't ask how I know:D

I've reconsidered my thoughts on this advice. I now disagree with you Steve. :)

I use fake plants to give ground cover for the snakes, rather than for pure aesthetic reasons. So lifting the leaves to 10cm off the substrate negates that ground cover. So I'd modify the advice to - if you have fake plants trailing on the substrate, use plastic plants instead of silk because they clean easier (don't ask how I know ;) ).
If you need to clean silk plants half an hour soaking in a tub of warm soapy water softens up the most stubborn of muck. I also take a hit every now and then and decide that a cluster of leaves has taken such a bad hit that they go in the bin, I'd rather buy a couple of new plants each year than clean snake s%£ from under my nails. :D

[guidofatherof5]

You disagree! Okay. :D
Your points are valid ;)

[ConcinusMan]

Mine do use them for toilet paper but I don't care. They're dollar tree (dollar store) plants. Besides my enclosures are glass. I just take them out when cleaning the tank and soak them in bleach solution, rinse and beat them a bit and that takes care of that. they come out clean.

[guidofatherof5]

Bump.

[guidofatherof5]

Don't ever say to yourself or out loud "I don't think they can get out there" Trust me, they can and will.
Better to go overboard with security then feel bad about not doing enough. Many of us know that feeling all too well.

[BLUESIRTALIS]

That is awful! Out of all my years of keeping snakes I have never seen anything like that. I have had baby kings eat their sheds before. I leave my female sheds in the cage during mating season so I guess i'll have to start breaking them in to small pieces.
Notice the snake's head is crammed into the tail of the shed, proving the snake completed shedding, then crawled back inside the skin in reverse prior to passing away. Pity too, it was a nice caramel coloured albino radix.

http://www.varanus.us/dont/deadradix.jpg

[Eddie]

I've keep female sheds in the enclosure during breeding many many times. I've even taken fresh sheds from one enclosure to another to spark male interest. I will start cutting them.
Good thread Steve!

[jwolfe152]

Instead of cutting into small rings would it not be better to just split it say from a mouth corner to the tail...or is that what you guys meant to begin with? Because i couldn't see how size, shape, or condition would make a difference to the interested parties, because isn't it just the hormones on the shed they are interested in?

[BLUESIRTALIS]

Yes we would cut it so that it was a flat shed instead of like a tube.
Instead of cutting into small rings would it not be better to just split it say from a mouth corner to the tail...or is that what you guys meant to begin with? Because i couldn't see how size, shape, or condition would make a difference to the interested parties, because isn't it just the hormones on the shed they are interested in?

[ConcinusMan]

disregard this post

[ConcinusMan]

isn't it just the hormones on the shed they are interested in?

pheromones. "The female sex attractiveness pheromone of the Canadian red-sided garter snake, Thamnophis sirtalis parietalis, consists of a novel series of nonvolatile saturated and monounsaturated long-chain methyl ketones which are volatile in nature "

[joeysgreen]

The amount of information a gartersnake can get from a single tongue flick is mesmerizing. They can tell if another snake has been there, if it's the same species, it's size/age, gender, reproductive status... There was a good talk on a study regarding this done in Manitoba presented at the last World Congress on Herpetology. If I can find the details I"ll post them.

[ConcinusMan]

Don't use UV lights on zilla slidelock tanks. The plastic is not UV shielded and within a year it becomes brittle and the tabs crumble leaving a hole for snakes to escape. Snakes don't need UV anyway.

Still in the process of trying to figure out who makes them but a WA state person makes slide top tanks in any size and configuration that don't have the problems the zilla tanks have. The frame around the screen is metal so it won't melt and there's no locking tabs to break. Also they can make any custom size or configuration. Theyre great. They have everything that's good about the zilla tankes, and none of the problems. Much better construction and cheaper than zilla slide top tanks. When i figure out who makes them I'll let you know.