Hibernation?

[Mandi0284]

My snakes have no eaten in quite a while dispite being offered food every other day as normal. Zeus took a large silver side a little over a week ago and Jesse has not shown any interest in anything for over two weeks. She even turned her nose up at live tadpoles!!??

Are they getting ready to hibernate?
Is this normal for garters?
Should I contiune to offer food to them?

[setfree]

I havn't had experience with hibernation yet so I don't know for sure. It sounds like all the right things but they do just go off food some times. I don't know why but they do. keep offering them food even if you don't hibernate them. But make sure you get other opinions.

Good luck!

[thamneil]

Definately a possibility with the season. You can try to wait it out or brumate if youre comfortable with that. Some of mine have gone off as well.

Live tadpoles hey? Great food but they do have a parasite potential. Just be wary of the source.

[Mandi0284]

I have read about doing brumation with our snakes, but not sure how to do it...and not sure if it would be ok for the baby snake....

or if the other two will one day decide to start eating again.

I got the tadpoles from a reptile store that buys them from a breeder. I would have to find out where exactly they get them. Was gonna raise them and then start breeding my own feeder tads.

[Light of Dae]

Feeder guppies are faster to reproduce... Still parasites... Frogs only breed once a year....

You could increase their light cycle to a little longer n see if that gets them outs of winter mood.

Or shorten the light cycle n let it be room temp for a few weeks, not offering food unless they seem active n looking for food(or escape) Pretty much ignore them for this time, just change their water as needed. I'd call this a 'cheater winter' its not true brumation where they get really cool n really lazy... This way worked for my checkered when he went off food for a while on his own.

Call it a nap... not a full out sleep. lol

[thamneil]

A member on here (I believe is was Thamnophis) brumated some of his baby tetrataenia to jump start their appetites. I understand that the circumstances are different, but a short brumatipng could definitely be used if nessecary. I wouldn't do so right away though.

[Mandi0284]

I am breeding my guppies. I have 60 new baby fish to raise. They are so cute.

Should I cover the snake tank?They crawl around a bit, but mostly just stay in one spot. Bitz is more active, but she isn't wanting food. I just tried small nightcrawlers.

[thamneil]

It depends what you're going for. If its a full out brumatipng, most would keep snakes in the dark. I'm with Michelle on this one. Just turn whatever heat light off,mgive them a while to chill(literally!), and slowly warm them back up.

[Invisible Snake]

IMO - I wouldn't do a full brumation with babies unless it is absolutely necessary because they haven't built up enough fat reserves. A cooling period would be more suitable, as recommended by Light of Dae.

[Mandi0284]

ok I will try that and see what happens.

[jitami]

How old are your babies?

With my adults I do pretty much what Light of Dae suggested. I just pretty much leave them alone, remove any light or heat source, but I don't cover the tank or go out of my way to make it any darker or colder than normal. They're between my kitchen & dining room, so get a fair amount of light & activity, but it doesn't seem to matter. Once I know they've skipped a few meals I go to only offering food once a week and sometimes every 2 weeks once it's established that they just aren't going to eat... and I do waste a fair amount of food this way, but the snakes seem fine, which is the important part. I've had my oldest snake for 10 and a half years and he does this every year.

With babies I try much harder to keep them up & active. I give them a heat lamp and try to replicate longer/warmer days to try and keep their appetite going through winter. This has seemed to work with babies. They might slow down, but don't go completely off food. If they do go completely off food a short brumation is probably in order as they can deplete their stores much quicker than adults.

I have no experience with brumation/hibernation at all and everyone here is happy & healthy :)

[Invisible Snake]

Hey I found this online, hope it's helpful! :)

Resetting a Garter Snake's Appetite - Gartersnake.info (http://www.gartersnake.info/articles/2005/resetting-a-garter-snakes-appetite.php)

[Invisible Snake]

This coming winter I plan on giving all my garters including the babies a cooling period, which I think is beneficial because it gives them a break from all the eating and pooping, plus it gives me a chance to save on money :D

[Mandi0284]

To answer the first question the baby is only about 8 '' long. Not sure how old she would be. She doesnt want to eat anything that I have offered. I tried the cup feeding, but nothing. Have to get more guppies today.

I have offered guppies and tadpoles to both the adults. Jesse cashed the tadpole around the water dish and bite it, but didnt eat. I noticed that Zeus is preparing to shed again. I may get some pinky mice and see what happens.

[Boabab95]

Feeder guppies are faster to reproduce... Still parasites... Frogs only breed once a year....


That depends completely on the frog, one of my dart frog groups [100% safe in captivity] are laying 3-5 clutches a month, each clutch containing ~19 eggs. The garters also seem to like them :D

[Invisible Snake]

That depends completely on the frog, one of my dart frog groups [100% safe in captivity] are laying 3-5 clutches a month, each clutch containing ~19 eggs. The garters also seem to like them :D

Any chance you can post pics of your dart frogs in the http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/garter-snake-lounge/167-other-pets-pics-discussions-448.html#post225954 thread? :D

[Mandi0284]

The tadpoles are from bullfrogs.

Is it safe to give them dart frog tadpoles?

[Mommy2many]

This time of year you may find your snakes sticking up their little snakie noses at their usual foods and not eating at all. Just offer food every few days and let them eat when they will. Mine start this process in August and it can last until late February and March. They will eat occasionally but not like the spring/summer months. They will be fine. Just keep an eye on them. Good luck!

[Mandi0284]

anymore advise on how to get Bitz to start eating?

[guidofatherof5]

So, how many weeks have they been off food?

[Light of Dae]

That depends completely on the frog, one of my dart frog groups [100% safe in captivity] are laying 3-5 clutches a month, each clutch containing ~19 eggs. The garters also seem to like them :D



Is it safe to give them dart frog tadpoles?

That would be my concern... Ain't dart frogs toxic to most predators? Wouldn't the tadpoles be toxic too?

[Stefan-A]

That would be my concern... Ain't dart frogs toxic to most predators? Wouldn't the tadpoles be toxic too?
Apparently the toxicity originates from their diet in the wild. If I remember correctly.

[Invisible Snake]

You are correct.

"It is argued that dart frogs do not synthesize their poisons, but sequester the chemicals from arthropod prey items, such as ants, centipedes and mites - the diet-toxicity hypothesis.[22] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poison_dart_frog#cite_note-21)[23] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poison_dart_frog#cite_note-22) Because of this, captive-bred animals do not possess significant levels of toxins as they are reared on diets that do not contain the alkaloids sequestered by wild populations. Nonetheless, the captive-bred frogs retain the ability to accumulate alkaloids when they are once again provided an alkaloid-containing diet.[24] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poison_dart_frog#cite_note-23) Despite the toxins used by some poison dart frogs, some predators have developed the ability to withstand them. One is the snake Leimadophis epinephelus, which has developed immunity to the poison."

[Boabab95]

Apparently the toxicity originates from their diet in the wild. If I remember correctly.

Yep, that's correct, while they may have the ability to produce the toxins if fed the right bugs, they are completely harmless...

[Mandi0284]

I have good news for you all. The "chill period" I put the snakes through seemed to work. Zeus has eaten 2 fuzzy mice without issue or scenting. Jesse has eaten one tadpole, but not much else , and the baby snake has eaten chopped tadpole.

I want to get them on a mouse diet ASAP. How do garters take to live fuzzy mice? Are they accepted? I was thinking about breeding my own feeder mice for them?

[guidofatherof5]

I would be concerned as fuzzies are more then capable of biting/injuring the snake.

[Dan72]

Apparently the toxicity originates from their diet in the wild. If I remember correctly.

That is totally correct. Raised in captivity nothing toxic about them.

[Mandi0284]

I would be concerned as fuzzies are more then capable of biting/injuring the snake.

Oh. What about pinky mice? Should I stick with F/T mice?

[guidofatherof5]

I don't think pinkies would be an issue but then again I don't/won't feed live.

[snake man]

Congratz

[Light of Dae]

I want to get them on a mouse diet ASAP. How do garters take to live fuzzy mice? Are they accepted? I was thinking about breeding my own feeder mice for them?

As stated I wouldn't feed live mice, but if you wanted to breed mice n freeze them. Kill them with dry ice first... Put mice in perforated deli cup n dry ice in a dish put both in a sealed container, No pain just sleepy time.

[Mandi0284]

ok. I will stick with the F/T mice. Got all the snakes on them now which is good. The baby has eaten 3 pinky mice already and out of my hand too. Still skitish around hands, but glad she is finally eating.

Sorry it has taken me a while to get back on. My computer was down again.