Another pet store...

[EasternGirl]

I was just doing a search on the internet for info on albino checkereds. I just wanted to see pictures of other albinos like Hermes for color comparisons because I was wondering if he looked a little yellow to me. I just want to make sure he isn't sick or something. Anyway...I came across an ad for an online pet store selling garter snakes and in their care sheet, they said that garter snakes eat crickets. I got really upset and sent them an email telling them that this info was incorrect and dangerous. I explained why garters cannot eat insects. I invited them to check out our forum if they wanted correct info on the care of garter snakes. I told them I would be happy to recommend some books too. I was very polite. Ugh.

[chris-uk]

I was just doing a search on the internet for info on albino checkereds. I just wanted to see pictures of other albinos like Hermes for color comparisons because I was wondering if he looked a little yellow to me. I just want to make sure he isn't sick or something. Anyway...I came across an ad for an online pet store selling garter snakes and in their care sheet, they said that garter snakes eat crickets. I got really upset and sent them an email telling them that this info was incorrect and dangerous. I explained why garters cannot eat insects. I invited them to check out our forum if they wanted correct info on the care of garter snakes. I told them I would be happy to recommend some books too. I was very polite. Ugh.

Yet another shop in need of education. There's so many people who don't realise that garters aren't insect eaters. With a bit of luck the pet shop you contacted will be prompted by your email to do a little research on the animals they are selling.

[PINJOHN]

Here's hoping that Greg doesn't spot your post on another ignorant pet shop :eek: else you will hear the explosion on your side of the pond:mad::mad::mad:

[gregmonsta]

arwoigjaoifvjoiajioefjoijoipviovojo KDVJIOJJ skdjijjriripf KABOOM!!!! :mad: ... Fingers crossed you get a positive response :rolleyes:

[EasternGirl]

It would be nice if they actually read my letter and listened to what I said, wouldn't it?

[aquamentus_11]

they'll switch from crickets to goldfish

[GarterGuy17]

why I think would be even worse , why do so many people think goldfish are okay ?

[aquamentus_11]

because they don't cost much and the store owners don't know any better. pet stores only need to keep them alive long enough to sell. the store by me recommended crickets and goldfish. they double teamed it and blew my mind. i think garters get dismissed as very easy to take care of, so people don't worry about researching their care.

[EasternGirl]

Well...actually crickets are worse because garter snakes cannot digest the exoskeletons of insects. The insects therefore cause intestinal blockages that can then kill the snake. So basically the pet store is telling customers to feed something to the snake that will most likely kill it if the snake eats it. Yes, goldfish are very bad too...but I believe that it takes quite a few of them to kill a garter.

Turns out...in comparison...Hermes looks a lot less yellow than many of the other albino checkereds I saw pics of. He is a very pretty color compared to other albinos I have seen. Kudos to Jason, Chondro788, for breeding such lovely albino checkereds. I guess the morph just has some yellow in it and that what I am seeing around his mouth is normal...which is good...because I love my little Hermes.

[BUSHSNAKE]

yep even albinos vary in color...when i had those(albino checkereds) i remember liking the ones with the brightest dorsal stripe:)...let us know how your petstore responds, i grew up with petstores and theyre a dying breed, i try to support the ones in my area

[gregmonsta]

I have had consant dismay with petstores ... in Britain .... and in the US if you remember the campain against petco for selling keelbacks as plains garters as well as advising silly food regimes .... unfortunately my last thread still stands .... the British lack of commitment to the job at hand - http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/8050-british-garter-hobby.html

[EasternGirl]

Well, Hermes barely has any yellow at all. He is quite stunning. Now this pet store...the reason I came upon it is because they are selling albino checkereds. Their albino checkereds are quite yellow. If anyone wants to check out the store, PM me and I will give you a link...I'm not going to say the store's name or post a link to the store in a thread on the forum. But here is Hermes: (Please ignore the writing on the outside of his tank..I'm working on getting that off :rolleyes:)

4100

[EasternGirl]

I have had consant dismay with petstores ... in Britain .... and in the US if you remember the campain against petco for selling keelbacks as plains garters as well as advising silly food regimes .... unfortunately my last thread still stands .... the British lack of commitment to the job at hand - http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/8050-british-garter-hobby.html I was just looking at your thread, Greg. I guess I should be glad that the store at least knows what an albino checkered garter is...and that they aren't advertising it as a gecko!

[aquamentus_11]

good luck with that writing...i have a little bit of it on mine and just gave up on it.

[chris-uk]

I have had consant dismay with petstores ... in Britain .... and in the US if you remember the campain against petco for selling keelbacks as plains garters as well as advising silly food regimes .... unfortunately my last thread still stands .... the British lack of commitment to the job at hand - http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/general-talk/8050-british-garter-hobby.html

I noticed you posted to correct an incorrectly identified infernalis on RFUK at the weekend. That ad got me excited, I thought that someone was actually selling an infernalis half an hour's drive from me. Shame it was a parietalis. Grrrrr

[GarterGuy17]

4100

Looks like Hermes is reading ! LOL:D

[gregmonsta]

I noticed you posted to correct an incorrectly identified infernalis on RFUK at the weekend. That ad got me excited, I thought that someone was actually selling an infernalis half an hour's drive from me. Shame it was a parietalis. Grrrrr

It's simply frustrating .... it would be funny if it wasn't so disappointing ... the fact that Britain is so trend oriented doesn't help either.

[chris-uk]

It's simply frustrating .... it would be funny if it wasn't so disappointing ... the fact that Britain is so trend oriented doesn't help either.

The RFUK Classifieds are heartbreaking for a garter lover. Pages and pages and pages of royal pythons and boas, even corns aren't so common. Then the odd ad for garters pops up... and it's either someone with an overpriced checkered which isn't selling because the price is just too high (although if it was closer I'd maybe consider it now he's dropped the price from £60 to £35, if he took £25 :) ), or a parietalis being sold as an infernalis. I think there's even more Baron's Racers than garters in the classifieds at the moment...

[EasternGirl]

Here we go...was actually impressed by the response. I am going to reply to him and give him a link to our care sheet and safe fish list...can someone post a link to the safe fish list please? Here is the response: Sign In (http://bl140w.blu140.mail.live.com/mail/InboxLight.aspx?fid=1&fav=1&n=1539900660&mid=2be0204c-07c2-11e1-8754-002264c17c50&fv=1#!/?rru=inbox!n=488957025&rru=inbox&fid=1&pdir=NextPage&paid=889ad2bd-36c2-4edd-9347-eeed6978e920&pad=2012-02-15T15%3A03%3A32.000Z&pidx=2&fav=1&cid=1337e322-c93f-11d9-bf8b-7e1494aba7a7&fv=1)

[chris-uk]

Here we go...was actually impressed by the response. I am going to reply to him and give him a link to our care sheet and safe fish list...can someone post a link to the safe fish list please? Here is the response: Sign In (http://bl140w.blu140.mail.live.com/mail/InboxLight.aspx?fid=1&fav=1&n=1539900660&mid=2be0204c-07c2-11e1-8754-002264c17c50&fv=1#%21/?rru=inbox%21n=488957025&rru=inbox&fid=1&pdir=NextPage&paid=889ad2bd-36c2-4edd-9347-eeed6978e920&pad=2012-02-15T15%3A03%3A32.000Z&pidx=2&fav=1&cid=1337e322-c93f-11d9-bf8b-7e1494aba7a7&fv=1)
Fleshware error? I don't think you can actually just link to your an email in your Livemail account... try copying and pasting the text again? Would be interested to see the response if you're impressed and satisfied by it.

[EasternGirl]

Oh sorry...the link worked before when I tried it...here:


Thanks Marnie,



I think that must be a result of our switch to a new site from an old one, and it resurrecting old data on a few items overwriting more recent information. The garters we sell are actually eating frozen thawed rosey reds at the moment.



I will have a look at your site for additional information, and I thank you very much for pointing this out. I will react to this right away.


Sincerely,

John Flynn

Live Deliveries Manager

PetSolutions.com

1.800.737.3868

[EasternGirl]

I already wrote back to him about the fish. I told him what he should be feeding the garters and gave him a copy of the unsafe/safe fish list and told him to contact me if he had any questions or needed any help.

[EasternGirl]

Another response:


I read through all of the information on the page yesterday and already adapted our feeding instructions to reflect the salmon, trout, and tilapia yesterday and had already removed crickets. Goldfish were already a given, that's something I don't even recommend to fish keepers for feeding piscivores let alone reptiles or amphibians. I'm already familiar with the vitamin B absorption deficiency issue that can occur with thiaminase. To be honest, any fish of any type which is fed whether it is on the "safe" list your forum has generated or not is going to contain a wide variety of other contaminants, and the long term feeding of fish on the "unsafe" list then becomes almost secondary. I'm actually somewhat surprised that hasn't become a discussion on your forum site already.



Even after almost 30 years of keeping and breeding reptiles, amphibians, and various fish, I'm always open to learn new things and discuss best practices. I appreciate your input.


Sincerely,

John Flynn

Live Deliveries Manager

PetSolutions.com

1.800.737.3868

My response to that:

John,

We do discuss the potential for problems with feeding a diet of fish alone...certainly. We have had many threads discussing the problems with a diet that is not varied, a diet that is vitamin deficient, the B vitamin deficiency, calcium deficiency, and the use of supplements to aid in such deficiencies when necessary. If you pop into our forum regularly, you will find that we have many members who are experienced keepers and breeders of many years and have a vast knowledge base. We have many threads and topics...feel free to look through them. l appreciate you being so open to my suggestions and taking the time to listen to my input. It makes me feel good to know there are pet stores that do actually care about the animals they sell. I wish you the best of luck and hope that you will contact us if you ever need assistance.

[snakehill]

Maybe Petco should be next! They have goldfish and crickets listed on their care sheet too! :rolleyes:

[PINJOHN]

Another response:


I read through all of the information on the page yesterday and already adapted our feeding instructions to reflect the salmon, trout, and tilapia yesterday and had already removed crickets. Goldfish were already a given, that's something I don't even recommend to fish keepers for feeding piscivores let alone reptiles or amphibians. I'm already familiar with the vitamin B absorption deficiency issue that can occur with thiaminase. To be honest, any fish of any type which is fed whether it is on the "safe" list your forum has generated or not is going to contain a wide variety of other contaminants, and the long term feeding of fish on the "unsafe" list then becomes almost secondary. I'm actually somewhat surprised that hasn't become a discussion on your forum site already.



Even after almost 30 years of keeping and breeding reptiles, amphibians, and various fish, I'm always open to learn new things and discuss best practices. I appreciate your input.



Sincerely,


John Flynn


Live Deliveries Manager


PetSolutions.com


1.800.737.3868

My response to that:

John,







Well done John Flynn a person who seem's to have the interest at heart of the animals in his care :)

[EasternGirl]

This was his most recent email to me in response to that last email I sent. I have to say, I am very pleased with the outcome of all of this and impressed with this manager.

Email response:


That is great to hear, it sounds like it must be a very fun and interesting forum to participate in. I'll have to set aside a little more time and go through and read some of the threads there. I'm actually planning to go in and add more to the descriptions of both of our garters, and flesh out their information a bit beyond what we have now.



Too many online and brick and mortar pet stores view their animals as a commodity, an item. My personal feeling is that I have the responsibility to do everything we can for our animals to be safe and as well cared for as possible both on our end, through the shipping process, and upon final delivery. Yes this is a business, and business needs to keep costs and efficiency in mind, but there can and should be a balance between profit and responsibility. I am at this company doing this job because I love coming to work every day, and when I go home at the end of the day I'm usually still in a very good mood. I'm certainly not going to get rich doing what I do, but if I wanted to go to a job I hate but make a lot of money at I would have kept working in finance as I did years ago.



Have a great afternoon Marnie, and thanks again!

[mikem]

good work marnie! :cool:

[EasternGirl]

Thanks...I felt like I did a little in my effort toward helping the animals.

[indigoman]

Good job Marnie! John Flynn has my respect.

[aquamentus_11]

yeah, sounds like a good guy. great work, marnie.

[EasternGirl]

Thanks everyone :).